Baiting deer but not other animals?

[Doskil]

I would just legalize it.

I'm willing to bet illegal baiting goes on quite a bit.

 

[deerhunter10]

I would just legalize it.

I'm willing to bet illegal baiting goes on quite a bit.

For sure then you go into a store and they sale bait instead of food plot seed and minerals. It's mainly bait. I don't care if they legalize it or not I would rather then not but that's just me. Imo a food plot or some people call them bait llots what ever you wanna call it is way more effective than a like of corn.

 

[Deerbuster1996]

I would just legalize it.

I'm willing to bet illegal baiting goes on quite a bit.

For sure then you go into a store and they sale bait instead of food plot seed and minerals. It's mainly bait. I don't care if they legalize it or not I would rather then not but that's just me. Imo a food plot or some people call them bait llots what ever you wanna call it is way more effective than a like of corn.

Agreed, food plots have been a big help with bring deer in and keeping them around. I quit throwing corn out during the summer when running cameras. I got tired of having 25%deer pictures and 75% coons pictures.

 

[Deer Assassin]

DA...I'd hate to see it. There may never be a disease consequence but the potential is there. More than any other reason I think John Q. Public, even if they know nothing of deer hunting and aren't for or against it, would look at hunting in a negative light.

i have no desire to debate baiting because there is nothing to said that hasnt been posted on here 100x in the last 10 years.


Mike

i certainly respect you opinion and I have talked with SCN and i know he is adamant against it and that is fine by me. I think the anti are going to be anti no matter what. The non hunting neutral public people I think they are happy with the out of sight out of mind approach

the people that would be upset with baiting ( non hunting public) would also be upset will kill plots and other tactics used buy hunters but the fact is they dont care

The non hunters I have talked to (granted just a few) see no difference between the current legal forms of baiting and no legal forms

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

DA...I'd hate to see it. There may never be a disease consequence but the potential is there. More than any other reason I think John Q. Public, even if they know nothing of deer hunting and aren't for or against it, would look at hunting in a negative light.

i have no desire to debate baiting because there is nothing to said that hasnt been posted on here 100x in the last 10 years.


Mike

i certainly respect you opinion and I have talked with SCN and i know he is adamant against it and that is fine by me. I think the anti are going to be anti no matter what. The non hunting neutral public people I think they are happy with the out of sight out of mind approach

the people that would be upset with baiting ( non hunting public) would also be upset will kill plots and other tactics used buy hunters but the fact is they dont care

The non hunters I have talked to (granted just a few) see no difference between the current legal forms of baiting and no legal forms

Well I am a seasoned hunter who has hunted many of the states where baiting is legal and I gotta tell you I cannot see any difference between the current legal forms of "baiting" in TN as you put it VS TN regulations of illegal baiting.

Putting out a salt lick or mineral block in order to lure the deer in and attract the deer is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn or sweet feed. They are both a natural attractant brought in from outside the natural environment of the surrounding area. Neither are grown there on site. Neither are growing out of the ground. Yet somehow Its legal to introduce a foreign attractant into the woods in the form of a mineral block or salt lick but bringing in corn or sweet feed is not. :bash:

Planting a row of corn and hunting directly over it is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn and hunting directly over it. You are still putting yourself up against the animal in a fair chase situation.

Ive heard people on here bad mouthing TV hunters and hunters in other states for hunting over corn or feeders. But those same hunters that were doing the bad mouthing don't seem to have a problem a few threads back talking about deer lures, urines, decoys, game calls, salt licks and mineral blocks that they themselves are using. Its irony at its best. One form of attractant should be as good as any. I think each and everyone of us has their own line in the sand of where they feel ETHICAL begins and where ETHICAL ends. Bottom line is it ends in the regulations till we get them changed.


Ive heard all the mumbo jumbo reasons for keeping baiting out of Tn and they are simply invalid IMHO. Baiting is both LEGAL and ETHICAL in many many states and until such time as the regulations are changed we will have to abide by it. Some of the states that approved it with limitations saw the benefit of it and have expanded on the regulations and made it more open and accessible to hunters to bait without heavy restrictions. Tn will eventually legalize baiting practices. It will take some well organized groups that are well funded and politically organized to get it done. Perhaps even putting pressure on current seated voting members to get on board with it or get them removed. That's how things get done. Moaning and griping about it on Tn Deer will do no good so its really wasted breath even talking about it. It divides the board as much as buck limits.

 

[Bone Collector]

DA...I'd hate to see it. There may never be a disease consequence but the potential is there. More than any other reason I think John Q. Public, even if they know nothing of deer hunting and aren't for or against it, would look at hunting in a negative light.

They already think that is how hunters hunt. I work with a ton of non-hunters. If the topic comes up, 90 % think it is unnecessary because we have grocery stores, and think all we do is set out salt or corn and deer line up to be shot.... Oh and it is all for sport and a set of antlers. 99% of their opinions come from seeing a hunting show 1 time on TV....

As for bait being necessary in TN. I don't think it is, but the flip side of that is I don't think it is unnecessary either. If is ok in Ky with all their crops, fertile soils, and huge "healthier than TN" deer herd, then why not here. If it were legal, then I guess I'd have an opinion about it being not necessary, but would accept it like the 2 buck limit. It is what it is.

 

[Bone Collector]

Well I am a seasoned hunter who has hunted many of the states where baiting is legal and I gotta tell you I cannot see any difference between the current legal forms of "baiting" in TN as you put it VS TN regulations of illegal baiting.

Putting out a salt lick or mineral block in order to lure the deer in and attract the deer is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn or sweet feed. They are both a natural attractant brought in from outside the natural environment of the surrounding area. Neither are grown there on site. Neither are growing out of the ground. Yet somehow Its legal to introduce a foreign attractant into the woods in the form of a mineral block or salt lick but bringing in corn or sweet feed is not. :bash:

Planting a row of corn and hunting directly over it is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn and hunting directly over it. You are still putting yourself up against the animal in a fair chase situation.

Ive heard people on here bad mouthing TV hunters and hunters in other states for hunting over corn or feeders. But those same hunters that were doing the bad mouthing don't seem to have a problem a few threads back talking about deer lures, urines, decoys, game calls, salt licks and mineral blocks that they themselves are using. Its irony at its best. One form of attractant should be as good as any. I think each and everyone of us has their own line in the sand of where they feel ETHICAL begins and where ETHICAL ends. Bottom line is it ends in the regulations till we get them changed.


Ive heard all the mumbo jumbo reasons for keeping baiting out of Tn and they are simply invalid IMHO. Baiting is both LEGAL and ETHICAL in many many states and until such time as the regulations are changed we will have to abide by it. Some of the states that approved it with limitations saw the benefit of it and have expanded on the regulations and made it more open and accessible to hunters to bait without heavy restrictions. Tn will eventually legalize baiting practices. It will take some well organized groups that are well funded and politically organized to get it done. Perhaps even putting pressure on current seated voting members to get on board with it or get them removed. That's how things get done. Moaning and griping about it on Tn Deer will do no good so its really wasted breath even talking about it. It divides the board as much as buck limits.

I've made this same argument at least 3-5x on here and someone who plants food plots is sure to jump in and say "if a food plot is 50 acres, you can't shoot from one end to the other, but a bag of corn can be dumped out in one spot.." Problem is food plots are not usually 50 acres and are more like 1-2 acres and depending on layout you can cover that with a rifle. Even if it is a big plot and even if you scout and determine where the deer enter the field at, you can reasonably set yourself up to be successful, because even if the deer come into the field at a different point eventually they'll come back in at the point you're set up on. In the end they are coming to a food source...If you hunt property that has no fields, doesn't have a lot of mast, don't have permission to or have the means to plant food plots, I see no harm in putting out salt, corn, or whatever. I see no difference in killing a deer over a cut corn field or a winter wheat field in late December and shooting one over some "other" type of food.

 

[deerchaser007]

Baiting defined- To place a bait, be it on the ground,hook, or trap in order to lure in a animal or prey. Now, where in this definition does it say that if you place that bait 250 yards away and can't hunt in that 250 yard circle, that it's not baiting? It doesn't! The bait is placed, its BAITING! Either make it legal for all, or illegal for all, and do away with this stupid rule so the big landowners can control a deer population in their area.
And yes, I will hammer this home again in my letter to twra comments this year. If they gonna make it legal for some to bait, they gonna make it legal for all to bait. IMO

 

[Fitchj13]

I come from Louisiana. Hunted there, ark, Ms, and Tx before moving here. Hunted over food plots (.25 to 500 acres), corn feeders, mineral licks, sweet potatoes- you name it. I also hunted between bedding areas and bait or other food areas. I hunted draws, pinch points, transition areas, etc.

That said - I do not consider it a lack of effort , knowledge, etc to hunt over corn or other 'bait'. I do not see any difference in those than small food plots or mineral licks or spiking acorn trees to make the acorns sweeter. Found that alot of nicer bucks treat feeders just like food plots and skirt the area until dark - unless the area is not pressured. And deer eat persimmons, then acorns first - will completely ignore other "bait". I could call out all non traditional recurve bow hunters lazy, etc. I mean, who can't sit out somewhere and pop a deer at 300 yards with a rifle - yeah boy, that takes all sorts of effort. And FYI - I utilize all hunting seasons - just making a point.

Keep in mind that there are some places where you can not or are not allowed to put in any food plots. Or for those of us who are married, with kids, and dont have the luxury of a big lease with alot of people right down the road that can maintain food plots cause we don't have the time to devote to it - or when that 2 acre food plot did not take or burnt up...... That means you are limited to just salt/mineral licks and can't supplement 365 days. I just don't see what the issue is. Okay - rant over. Just my opinion.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I come from Louisiana. Hunted there, ark, Ms, and Tx before moving here. Hunted over food plots (.25 to 500 acres), corn feeders, mineral licks, sweet potatoes- you name it. I also hunted between bedding areas and bait or other food areas. I hunted draws, pinch points, transition areas, etc.

That said - I do not consider it a lack of effort , knowledge, etc to hunt over corn or other 'bait'. I do not see any difference in those than small food plots or mineral licks or spiking acorn trees to make the acorns sweeter. Found that alot of nicer bucks treat feeders just like food plots and skirt the area until dark - unless the area is not pressured. And deer eat persimmons, then acorns first - will completely ignore other "bait". I could call out all non traditional recurve bow hunters lazy, etc. I mean, who can't sit out somewhere and pop a deer at 300 yards with a rifle - yeah boy, that takes all sorts of effort. And FYI - I utilize all hunting seasons - just making a point.

Keep in mind that there are some places where you can not or are not allowed to put in any food plots. Or for those of us who are married, with kids, and dont have the luxury of a big lease with alot of people right down the road that can maintain food plots cause we don't have the time to devote to it - or when that 2 acre food plot did not take or burnt up...... That means you are limited to just salt/mineral licks and can't supplement 365 days. I just don't see what the issue is. Okay - rant over. Just my opinion.

You made some very excellent points. Great post!


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[PillsburyDoughboy]

Well I am a seasoned hunter who has hunted many of the states where baiting is legal and I gotta tell you I cannot see any difference between the current legal forms of "baiting" in TN as you put it VS TN regulations of illegal baiting.

Putting out a salt lick or mineral block in order to lure the deer in and attract the deer is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn or sweet feed. They are both a natural attractant brought in from outside the natural environment of the surrounding area. Neither are grown there on site. Neither are growing out of the ground. Yet somehow Its legal to introduce a foreign attractant into the woods in the form of a mineral block or salt lick but bringing in corn or sweet feed is not. :bash:

Planting a row of corn and hunting directly over it is no different IMHO than putting out loose corn and hunting directly over it. You are still putting yourself up against the animal in a fair chase situation.

Ive heard people on here bad mouthing TV hunters and hunters in other states for hunting over corn or feeders. But those same hunters that were doing the bad mouthing don't seem to have a problem a few threads back talking about deer lures, urines, decoys, game calls, salt licks and mineral blocks that they themselves are using. Its irony at its best. One form of attractant should be as good as any. I think each and everyone of us has their own line in the sand of where they feel ETHICAL begins and where ETHICAL ends. Bottom line is it ends in the regulations till we get them changed.


Ive heard all the mumbo jumbo reasons for keeping baiting out of Tn and they are simply invalid IMHO. Baiting is both LEGAL and ETHICAL in many many states and until such time as the regulations are changed we will have to abide by it. Some of the states that approved it with limitations saw the benefit of it and have expanded on the regulations and made it more open and accessible to hunters to bait without heavy restrictions. Tn will eventually legalize baiting practices. It will take some well organized groups that are well funded and politically organized to get it done. Perhaps even putting pressure on current seated voting members to get on board with it or get them removed. That's how things get done. Moaning and griping about it on Tn Deer will do no good so its really wasted breath even talking about it. It divides the board as much as buck limits.

I've made this same argument at least 3-5x on here and someone who plants food plots is sure to jump in and say "if a food plot is 50 acres, you can't shoot from one end to the other, but a bag of corn can be dumped out in one spot.." Problem is food plots are not usually 50 acres and are more like 1-2 acres and depending on layout you can cover that with a rifle. Even if it is a big plot and even if you scout and determine where the deer enter the field at, you can reasonably set yourself up to be successful, because even if the deer come into the field at a different point eventually they'll come back in at the point you're set up on. In the end they are coming to a food source...If you hunt property that has no fields, doesn't have a lot of mast, don't have permission to or have the means to plant food plots, I see no harm in putting out salt, corn, or whatever. I see no difference in killing a deer over a cut corn field or a winter wheat field in late December and shooting one over some "other" type of food.

You hit the nail on the head.

On many of the properties I hunted back in the day that I begged permission to hunt ..the landowners would have looked at me sideways if I would have suggested bringing in a disk and planting clover or food crops. Most landowners did not want you disturbing the property in anyway or erecting permanent stands. Some land owners were even goofy about climbing stands because they marked up their trees, so we ground hunted or used climbing sticks.

I've got 60'acres and have two fields . One is about 2 acres and the other is 5 acres. We played the food plot game planting different stuff and what we found with that small of a track food plots get eaten up,pretty quick. So what we found is that we were better off cutting the fields in rows and fertilizing what grows natural. Deer seem to like the cover the rows provide and the natural greens that grow seem to be good enough .

Unless you have some size able food plots your really not doing the deer herd or yourself much good.

I've also found that opening up the Forrest canopy provides a lot more green on the ground and cover than I could ever produce with a food plot or disk. And much cheaper too.


With that said I sure wish we could supplement all of that with some bait,



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[Crappie Hunter]

I'll obey the law as long as it stays as is.
But, if they legalize baiting, CO-OP had better watch out I'll be coming in on 2 wheels to load up.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I'll obey the law as long as it stays as is.
But, if they legalize baiting, CO-OP had better watch out I'll be coming in on 2 wheels to load up.

A strategic plan is all it takes on baiting. It does not take feeding every deer in the county to be seccesuful. As a matter of fact gravity feeding or continuous feeding can be counter productive.

Timer feeding and starving them down is more productive, get them on a regular feeding pattern at a specific time and then closer to your hunts starve them off off it a day or two before so when you get to your hunt and the timer goes off its like the red light going off at kRispy Kreame Donuts. There are some other theories on controlled timing that work as well.

Bottom line is I would never set up on a feeder. Rather set up on the travel routes that go to and from and the pinch points. I would use them more of a supplement to what I am already doing rather than relying on them as a primary source of hunting.

Mostly what you see on TV is western based hunts. Deer do not have hardly any natural resources to feed off of . Look at the desert terrain sometime, it consist of cactus ,scrub oak and sage. They become very dependent on corn for survival. You can ride around in a truck with a feeder and they will practically come right up to the truck and lick it right off the bumper. I have seen them do it with my own eyes.


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[darn2ten]

People have big misconceptions about baiting with corn piles and such. I know many people that hunt in SC where baiting is legal. They all say the same thing. If you want to kill does or young bucks then yes they're ok for that, but don't count on killing big bucks from them. Yes, you might get lucky and kill one, but it's not the norm. They say you might see a bigger buck during the rut cursing by to see if any hot does had been to the corn, but it's slim and rare. Most I know over there try it, but end up changing their strategy to kill mature bucks. Usually if bigger bucks visit the piles it's under the cover of night and the only thing that shoots him is the trail camera.

 

[deerchaser007]

People have big misconceptions about baiting with corn piles and such. I know many people that hunt in SC where baiting is legal. They all say the same thing. If you want to kill does or young bucks then yes they're ok for that, but don't count on killing big bucks from them. Yes, you might get lucky and kill one, but it's not the norm. They say you might see a bigger buck during the rut cursing by to see if any hot does had been to the corn, but it's slim and rare. Most I know over there try it, but end up changing their strategy to kill mature bucks. Usually if bigger bucks visit the piles it's under the cover of night and the only thing that shoots him is the trail camera.

This is great post. Strategy to kill the mature bucks is key. With any strategy to kill mature bucks, you have to hold mature bucks to that property. If a large landowner in TN is running multiple feeders to hold deer on that property, that Is baiting. That is where the TN baiting law is twisted IMO. Giving some hunters the advantage over other hunters, that cannot run the same concept of holding the mature bucks. And, if said property is holding most of the does during the rut cause of the bait, its still baiting. That buck will follow!
The other thing that concerns me the most is that some want to throw out the disease aspect associated with bait.And I am one of them. The risk don't over ride the need for success. But, just because you can't hunt within that 250 yard radius of that feeder does not mean the risk is not there for disease. So, its obvious by this law written as it stands, they are not worried about disease, its more about what someone views as ethical under the defined baiting. No matter how you look at it, its bait, and its being used to manipulate the deer and other animals free range.

 

[Vermin93]

Since the TWRA comment period is open, I wrote them an e-mail and said I absolutely do not support legalized baiting.

 

[Tims]

So how do you legalize baiting for deer but not for other species like fall turkey?

Do you live in North Carolina and hunt in Tenn?

 

[AXL78]

To be honest, I wish they wouldn't even allow feeding of wildlife during deer and turkey season. People quit feeding during the coldest months when food is gone, then they start again for spring turkeys, when nothing needs it. They also really bend rules during spring turkey. People will have a feeder at a house, with no woods around, and hunters will cut the turkeys off that are on their way to the feeders. It really gets bad in turkey season in my opinion. I don't think you will kill a bunch of big deer over a feeder, but turkeys really fall victim to the corn.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

We have a neighbour two properties over during normal farming practices that feeds his cows a supplement of corn and has a feeding troth out full of corn. Turkeys routinely come out and feed on the corn and grain that he supplies.

I don't see any dead turkeys on his property or any that venture over on surrounding properties.

 

[blondebear]

IMO, baiting becomes more about shooting than hunting.

I have no personal "problem" with those who choose to shoot animals over bait where legal, just don't see it as being much different than shooting a cow coming to a fresh bale of hay at its daily feeding station.

I've known more than one pretty fair deer hunter who started (legally) hunting a lot over bait in other states. Over time, they all became LESS effective hunters, seeming to lose much of their former hunting skills. Speaking of which, there is no better way to never learn to otherwise effectively deer hunt, than by regularly shooting deer over bait instead of actually "hunting" them. For the purpose of that statement, I'd even include most food plots and fields, although they don't concentrate deer to approach a very small "spot" anything like "bait" poured from a bag.

There CAN be much more to deer hunting, than just sitting, waiting to shoot.
Same for turkey hunting.

this post really mirrors my opinion on baiting. yep, hunters becoming less effective and that should include young or new hunters never even learning ( or even wanting to learn ) to hunt.

legal here to bait but don't hear of any success by those very few who have tried it. young buck or doe if their lucky.

overall i think folks just want a quick and easy "fix" anymore. i've just heard of people making traps to collect shed antlers or more accurately "about to be shed" antlers . whatever became of the joy of hunting and finding a treasure/shed by way of boot leather and knowledge of where to look. never mind the risk of these devices injuring the deer.