MidTennFisher
Well-Known Member
We have pages of people mentioning the differences between a food plot and a corn pile and the negative effects caused by the latter on mostly turkeys and other birds, but deer as well.
Baiting Bill HB1618/SB1942
- Thread starter bjohnson
- Start date
I was traveling from West Tennessee on Monday and saw a bunch of turkeys in a corn field eating what the harvester left behind....Wonder how many of those Turkeys will be dead by Spring from Rotten Corn left laying around????
Awesome pictures brother thanks for sharing.
vinootz
Active Member
I believe half of what I see and less of what I hear; or in this case, read. People mentioning differences doesn't mean it's fact; or reality.
Just curious ...Which are you "Oppressed or Privileged"? Ahhhh I read on You seem to think your Oppressed. Since your Neighbors land is More/Better....Dang the bad luck. Need to find some better property. That is all. Putting down Bait is better Management. According to most opinions on here it seems that 2 50lb bags of corn should get you tagged out. That's $20. Verses $3,000 on food plots... P.S. I don't give a hoot what you pour out on your land.
So you are saying as long as it's locally grown corn not put out in a pile but spread out with a seed spreader over several acres that it would be acceptable. Kind of like Texas does with the seed spreaders on their trucks and side by sides.
DoubleRidge
Well-Known Member
Im not saying....but various studies show....that yes....to spread certified aflatoxin free corn over a large area in an arid desert type region like Texas would be more acceptable than dumping non-certified "deer corn" in a more humid, moist closed canopy type forest setting in TN...with neither scenario really being of any benifit to wildlife.
I really don't care to have corn, but I would like to be able to have mineral licks again(CWD zone, so I don't because I can't legally). At least the mineral spots do have some positive benefit to wildlife in general. I don't want welfare deer anymore than I want welfare ducks(which is federal mostly, and what "food" is best for waterfowl depends on who you ask).
MidTennFisher
Well-Known Member
Spread out pieces of corn as a result of normal agricultural practice over a large field is quite different from 200# of it left in a pile, and refreshed weekly. But I know you know this.
MidTennFisher
Well-Known Member
The problem is that it will come down to money. Selling out of state licenses is a lot easier when folks know they can come to TN, dump a pile of corn, and just wait for the deer to come. It's easy killing. That's why SC allows it. That and the good ol boys network of legislators who like the easy deer killing so they keep it legalized.
You should see the flooded corn pond duck preserves here. Those same legislators hunt at those preserves, so that's how the legalized baiting of waterfowl takes place but only if you're rich enough to own a preserve. They say a poor man brings his corn to water, a rich man brings water to his corn.
You should see the flooded corn pond duck preserves here. Those same legislators hunt at those preserves, so that's how the legalized baiting of waterfowl takes place but only if you're rich enough to own a preserve. They say a poor man brings his corn to water, a rich man brings water to his corn.
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
Not sure if this has been previously mentioned, but it is a fact that deer quickly become more nocturnal as soon as any hunting begins over the bait.
Most hunters can relate to how little deer movement is seen when there is a super-bumper acorn crop, and the deer simply don't have to move around much to find food. Same principle with a bait pile, only even less movement than with a super-bumper acorn crop.
He made two distinctly different suggestions, not one. Using the forum as a source of education was not one of them. You misread it. You're a smart guy so slow down and read it for what it actually reads and not what you initially percieved when skimming over it. You'll see why I pointed out the blatant oxymoron in your belittling of him. The hillbilly term for that is, "eating crow". If you can dish it like a man then you can eat it like a man. Lord knows I've eaten plenty. I could share a recipe if you like.
TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
Let me add just a little.
Just to be clear, aflatoxin rarely "kills" deer, just more or less makes them sick at their stomachs, or "puny". But, that can make them temporarily weaker, and easier for dogs & coyotes to catch. Dripping diarrhea, also probably leaving a trial for those dogs & coyotes to follow as well?
Corn that is spread over a cultivated plot or field is much less likely to develop the aflatoxin mold than is corn poured in a pile in a single "spot".
There are reasons why corn spread around in a field is less likely to develop aflatoxin. Being out in a field, it's more visible to birds flying over. Birds such as blackbirds, crows, and doves will typically eat 100% of the visible corn in a matter of days. This means there is little risk of "piling" (under which aflatoxin is more likely to develop).
Another reason we see less aflatoxin in a field is because whatever corn gets left, it's continuously receiving more sunlight & wind than compared to a pile of corn in the woods. Sun & wind helps keep scattered corn kernels dry and aflatoxin-free. By contrast, corn can mold just being inside an enclosed "feeder", as well as just being "piled" on the ground.
Beyond that, there is another big difference in the aflatoxin risks of a corn field vs a corn "feeder" or a corn "pile'. Much of the corn sold in places like Wal-mart in Tennessee already contains the aflatoxin.
Corn grown in a field, left behind for wildlife, or inadvertently just a farmer's harvest loss, has to "develop" aflatoxin, which again, is simply much less likely in an open field getting sunshine & wind (unlike a shady corn pile in the woods, or an enclosed feeder, the inside burning in direct sunlight). Also, should a farmer accidently dump a "pile" of shelled corn in a field, being very visible to birds (typically crows), it gets quickly eaten, before it develops aflatoxin. It is then NOT replenished, no aflatoxin develops.
As to the deer hunting implications of hunting over a corn field (or plot) compared to a pile of corn in the woods, it's the difference of deer always coming to the same "spot" (bait pile) rather than being scattered around or over a field. And since any corn remaining in a field is not replenished (unlike a bait pile), the deer never spend much time in any particular spot.
In fact, they often are essentially "done" spending much time in any particular field or plot after only a few days of feeding on any one particular item (such as corn). Whatever they were eating, becomes gone, eaten up. But the deer will be back, maybe in days, maybe in weeks, maybe in months, because a field will grow other plants, that will sprout & grow, then become available as food for deer.
Mother Nature just spreads the food out, rather than pouring it from a bag in one spot. This is one of many ways nature "naturally" reduces predation on deer, AND provides deer with a diverse source of foods needed to be healthy. Feeding deer corn is like feeding your child only candy, i.e. not at all healthy, can even stunt bone (and antler) growth.
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TheLBLman
Well-Known Member
As an aside, a little over 20 years ago, I thought it seemed a good idea to place a nice big corn pile as supplemental feed for the deer POST deer season. This was in mid-January. I poured out 4 50-lb bags of corn where a wood-line met a field. This was back in my days of using 35-mm film trail cams.
So I go back a week later, to see if I need to add more corn.
I found out upon developing the film (cam took 24 pics the 1st 24 hrs), most of the corn was gone by the end of the 2nd day. 100% of the corn was gone a week later, and I suspect that was the case within the 1st 48 hrs.
I had pictures of dozens, and dozens of crows quickly eating up the corn. Since all my 35mm film was quickly used up, I have no idea if a coon or a deer got any of the corn. Just know crows had eaten about all of it with 24 hrs of a single crow finding it. When one finds it, they "call" in all the others!
That same year, about 3 miles away, I had another corn-feeding station, only this one utilized a commercial feeder. I had regular visitors of coons, crows, deer, and turkeys. On that one, it was coons there were eating the most corn. And as soon as some spring green-up began, the deer completely stopped, even though they knew where it was, and I kept replenishing it until early March.
But one other thing happened with that feeder, sometime in early March. Even though I thought I was only purchasing aflatoxin-free corn from my County Co-Op, aflatoxin developed in my feeder. 100% of the turkeys that fed there (talking over 50 birds) died. The dead turkeys made some fine meals for the coyotes & coons, further augmenting the coon & coyote populations.
That was over 20 years ago, and was when I totally stopped "feeding" ANY corn, and haven't since.
I have no problem "growing" it in a field, and leaving some there for the wildlife. Just don't pour it out from a bag.
So I go back a week later, to see if I need to add more corn.
I found out upon developing the film (cam took 24 pics the 1st 24 hrs), most of the corn was gone by the end of the 2nd day. 100% of the corn was gone a week later, and I suspect that was the case within the 1st 48 hrs.
I had pictures of dozens, and dozens of crows quickly eating up the corn. Since all my 35mm film was quickly used up, I have no idea if a coon or a deer got any of the corn. Just know crows had eaten about all of it with 24 hrs of a single crow finding it. When one finds it, they "call" in all the others!
That same year, about 3 miles away, I had another corn-feeding station, only this one utilized a commercial feeder. I had regular visitors of coons, crows, deer, and turkeys. On that one, it was coons there were eating the most corn. And as soon as some spring green-up began, the deer completely stopped, even though they knew where it was, and I kept replenishing it until early March.
But one other thing happened with that feeder, sometime in early March. Even though I thought I was only purchasing aflatoxin-free corn from my County Co-Op, aflatoxin developed in my feeder. 100% of the turkeys that fed there (talking over 50 birds) died. The dead turkeys made some fine meals for the coyotes & coons, further augmenting the coon & coyote populations.
That was over 20 years ago, and was when I totally stopped "feeding" ANY corn, and haven't since.
I have no problem "growing" it in a field, and leaving some there for the wildlife. Just don't pour it out from a bag.
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AT Hiker
Well-Known Member
Do you believe in what you smell, taste and touch? We only have 5 senses so I am trying to figure this whole thing out.
Bloodwolf1984
Well-Known Member
Usually it's people who hunt over plots that say that. Its the same thing...one just required less work
Bloodwolf1984
Well-Known Member
Fact... Plots are placed bait to make deer come to one area...it's the same...one just took a lot less work
peytoncreekhunter
Well-Known Member
I'm confused by saying TWRA shouldn't be concerned with "leveling the playing field" but they should be concerned with "equal opportunity". Aren't those the same thing?
DoubleRidge
Well-Known Member
Again....if you are only focused on one thing...killing a deer....then a deer killed over a plot or a deer killed over a corn pile....yes both equal a dead deer.....ok...ok.
But if we will step back and take a humans self serving view point out of the equation...then its absolutely clear that there is a difference in a food plot and a corn pile.
One is a benifit to a variety of wildlife while the other does nothing but serve ones individual desire to take a short cut. (no matter what damage it may cause).
Again...For less than half the cost of a bag of corn you can get a gallon of chainsaw gas and get sunlight to tbe forest floor and create WAY more pounds of healthy forage, improve fawning cover and nesting habitat....save money and do something to benifit a variety of wildlife....win-win.
Bloodwolf1984
Well-Known Member
First person that I've ever seen that sees it for what it is. .well said...agreed with everything you said...that extra benefit for other wildlife is a plus...either way I think putting something there that wasn't there before for the sake of getting deer where you want them should be legal
