Overhunting stands

[AT Hiker]

My only disagreement about this is the period when loverboy is blind with poonanny on his mind chasing a doe. HE WILL NOT CARE what he smells or sees. This is fact and all hunters who have witnessed this phenomenon will affirm it.

Want to make that statement even more true? Tack on what BSK said, save your best rut stands for the rut.
It's hard for me to do but it's what I do now. I hardly even put cameras out just to keep pressure as close to zero as possible.

Down side is I have no clue what's around nor do I know if trespassers are roaming.

 

[BSK]

Funny reading this thread. The big 10 my son killed on youth day this year was always on cam at night in the lower field. That evening. We decided to sit on the top field. Low and behold. He came out 75 yards above the lower field shooting house we hunted that morning.

Just remember, as I stated, as hunting pressure in an area increases over time, sighting rates decline. But they never fall to zero. Anything is possible on any given day. But if you want to up your odds, don't overhunt stands.

 

[Headhunter]

Nice Buck...I'd take one just like that any day.

Thanks, I did and still would.

 

[Headhunter]

I'm going to defend Headhunter's thoughts a bit here, based on my assumption he likely hunts "higher" than most hunters.

I have found that wind direction typically becomes much less an issue, the higher up a tree you hunt. I commonly have older deer directly downwind from me, within bow-range, never smell me, IF I'm 20-something feet high in my climber. Where possible, I often hunt 30-feet high.

IMO, in most close-range setups (under 50 yards), being over 20 feet high is critical, and there seems to be something almost magical in going over 22 feet.

At least for archery & muzzleloader, and/or anywhere I'm expecting the deer to be under 100 yds, my most common tree-climbing height is about 23 feet, and higher is preferred to lower. Since this is impossible with many trees, I often just pick a different tree in a different spot, just so can get higher up. The most recent morning I hunted, I climbed up to exactly 30 feet before settling in, and in a particular tree I hadn't hunted in almost exactly 1 year, and won't hunt again this year.

In many cases, your scent will blow over & above the deer, then become more diluted at all downrange distances, as compared to if you're on the ground or not as high above it. Your scent molecules actually "stick" and stick more to any vegetation or surfaces the closer they are to the source.

Another thing: The wind direction typically shifts dramatically while you are on stand. Being higher up just minimizes the problems this can cause.

Yes, there are many "downsides" to hunting from a higher perch, so each "hunt" is weighed based on all the options. Since I cannot find a "safe" ladder stand over 21 feet, that largely rules out most ladder-stand hunting for me personally. Never mind I do often hunt from the ground, and do that more than I hunt from ladder stands.

I've said this many times:

The best way to ruin a great spot is to place a ladder stand in it.

This is in part because the wind will typically shift around,
no matter how it was forecast when you decided to hunt that spot.

Another part of how it ruins the spot is via the ladder stand being placed,
it becomes a more "convenient" spot to hunt, then over-hunt.

Lastly, it is seen by other hunters (often including trespassers), who will now start hunting a "spot"
they didn't and maybe wouldn't previously, just because it has now become "convenient"
for them, too.

By contrast, packing in, climbing, descending, & packing out a climbing stand daily is the absolute least "convenient" way of hunting, as it requires getting up earlier, and more "work" with each hunt. For me, it has generally been the most effective way to hunt "undisturbed" deer.
Just have to get up and get going a little earlier with each outing.

Yes, there are exceptions to everything said above.
But most set-ups are not exceptions.

thanks for the "defense". I am the oddball, always have been, I just hunt. Always have and god willing always will.

 

[JCDEERMAN]

JCdeerman, maybe you don't realize it, but it is amazing the number of hunters that will not hunt if the wind is wrong, even for an entire farm.

I totally get it and I know some hunters like this as well. It's just not my mentality - I simply pick somewhere else to go. You and I both have the determination to get out there and get the job done, we just take a different approach. Nothing at all wrong with that. We only get so many sunrises.

I never pay attention or look at the wind until I get to where I want to hunt and even then I may go ahead hunt the spot even when I think the wind is wrong.

Oh trust me, I used to be the exact same say! But from my observations, I saw fewer and fewer deer every time I sat in a particular stand multiple days in a row. It just wasn't working for me.

 

[catman529]

Doesn't matter what the boots are made of, if they're not kept clean. What really spooks deer is the oils and petroleum smells we get on our boots from the floormats of our vehicles, or from walking around at the gas station. I wear my hunting boots nowhere but the woods. They are kept in air-tight containers when I'm not walking through the woods, and the outside and soles are regularly washed in scent-reducing soaps. Makes a BIG difference IF you have to walk across/along deer trails to a stand.

I'm curious how you figured the deer spook from petroleum smells rather than human scent left behind. Deer don't seem to be scared of tractors with rubber tires leaking oil and hydraulic fluid, so I'm curious why a pair of rubber boots that got a lil fuel on them at the gas station would spook deer.

 

[backyardtndeer]

Sure there are exceptions to this. Have a stand behind the house that is about 225 or so yards from the back door. The max shooting distance from that stand is a little under 200 yards. Directly behind the stand(between the house and the stand) is a wooded gully, that drops about 55-60 ft below the level of the ground the stand is on. That stand is about 15 ft to the seat. The stand is a homemade permanent steel ladder stand in a large oak, that has army tent canvas wrapped around it, draped down to about 3 feet off the ground. The field in front of the stand raises, then rolls off about 15-20 ft to the far edges. I will hunt this stand consecutive afternoons with the right wind, and usually have pretty consistent activity, and usually more often than not deer will get well within archery range. Another factor in this is with the rut and presence of does. Hunting the does over afternoon food, can have bucks show up. Biggest issue we have had is educating older does and non shooters when getting down. We started doing 4 wheeler pick ups after dark and cut way down on the deer "watching the stand".

I would imagine if I hunted my best stand inside the woods for several days in a row, it would be more like your data, but I don't typically hunt that stand as often. Wind has to be nil or just right for it, which is more limiting.

 

[BSK]

I'm curious how you figured the deer spook from petroleum smells rather than human scent left behind. Deer don't seem to be scared of tractors with rubber tires leaking oil and hydraulic fluid, so I'm curious why a pair of rubber boots that got a lil fuel on them at the gas station would spook deer.

It's impossible to say exactly what deer react to without asking them, and we can't. However, several studies involving deer olfactory senses (their sense of smell) found deer react quickest and most negatively to the smell of petroleum, especially gasoline. In fact, their brain shows an electrical response within the olfactory center of the brain to gasoline at one 1 part per billion. That's shockingly sensitive, and there is the assumption from those findings they have such a heightened response to it for defensive purposes. That may not be true. They may not care about it all. But as a general rule, prey animals are most sensitive to smells that are the most dangerous to them. But again, that's just an assumption. In fact, one piece of evidence against that is the observation I've made many times that deer don't react at all to where I've driven a stinking oil and gas dripping ATV through the woods, but they very quickly learn to avoid an area I walk through.

 

[catman529]

It's impossible to say exactly what deer react to without asking them, and we can't. However, several studies involving deer olfactory senses (their sense of smell) found deer react quickest and most negatively to the smell of petroleum, especially gasoline. In fact, their brain shows an electrical response within the olfactory center of the brain to gasoline at one 1 part per billion. That's shockingly sensitive, and there is the assumption from those findings they have such a heightened response to it for defensive purposes. That may not be true. They may not care about it all. But as a general rule, prey animals are most sensitive to smells that are the most dangerous to them. But again, that's just an assumption. In fact, one piece of evidence against that is the observation I've made many times that deer don't react at all to where I've driven a stinking oil and gas dripping ATV through the woods, but they very quickly learn to avoid an area I walk through.

When I have time I'd like to do a trail cam study of my own using black flash cameras and some common products like diesel, scented deodorant, maybe even Waffle House, and see how the deer react. The tough part will be placing the scents without stinking up the place with my own scent. I could leave the cameras for a couple weeks before checking the cards. I have a feeling deer tend to be more curious about non-human foreign odors rather than afraid of them. But I'd like to see some evidence rather than just assume.

 

[BSK]

When I have time I'd like to do a trail cam study of my own using black flash cameras and some common products like diesel, scented deodorant, maybe even Waffle House, and see how the deer react. The tough part will be placing the scents without stinking up the place with my own scent. I could leave the cameras for a couple weeks before checking the cards. I have a feeling deer tend to be more curious about non-human foreign odors rather than afraid of them. But I'd like to see some evidence rather than just assume.

That would be a fascinating study. In addition to the items you mentioned, I would also include smells we assume they should be afraid of, such as coyote scent.

 

[mossyoakmantn]

This is a great thread and great information. The bigger buck I saw was "later" this morning. I have a spot designated just for pressure. It's a hidden little spot that's thick and way away from everyone else. It's the perfect spot and I've never hunted it. Once the guns start going off they will run here.

 

[Deck78]

This year, 48 on 500 acres.

I've got to up my stand count on our place. we have 625 acres and on my best year of putting out stands, there are maybe 10 and they get overhunted without a doubt!

 

[TNPete1]

Since this data was collected from 30+ years, I would like to see data from the last 5 or 10 to see if there are differences since so much technology changed. Case in point, 30 years ago I wore leather boots and put cover scents like fox pee on them. Now I go out with scent control clothing and rubber boots, both of which are saturated with scent elimination sprays and washed in scent elimination washing liquid. Hunting technology (even camo patterns) has made leaps and bounds over even the last 10 years. All that said, I've had deer coming in and when they get to where I walked in 2hrs earlier, they stop, look around, and change course. The bottom line is that when you hunt, you are in their living room. Scent, movement, or anything they sense as abnormal can screw a hunt up. Some days we get lucky, some days not so much. No matter what, a bad day in the woods is better than a good day working. Good info though, thanks for posting.

 

[TNPete1]

Want to make that statement even more true? Tack on what BSK said, save your best rut stands for the rut.
It's hard for me to do but it's what I do now. I hardly even put cameras out just to keep pressure as close to zero as possible.

Down side is I have no clue what's around nor do I know if trespassers are roaming.

On the expensive side, but I now have two cameras out that send the pics to my phone. It will even tell you when the batteries are low. I've had some out for over three months without "going back in". Down side for a lot of folks is leaving them out when hunting public land. Fortunately, I hunt private and don't have that issue.

 

[catman529]

On the expensive side, but I now have two cameras out that send the pics to my phone. It will even tell you when the batteries are low. I've had some out for over three months without "going back in". Down side for a lot of folks is leaving them out when hunting public land. Fortunately, I hunt private and don't have that issue.

Those cell cams are nice. I have one in my backyard and one on public in an overlooked spot that's hard to get to. It's that public spot that I try to stay out of until the rut. Just the other day I was in there for the first time in over 2 months to find a scrape to move the camera to. I won't be back till the first or second week in November. In my backyard I might be planting wheat, cutting shooting lanes or sighting in a rifle, but I like to see what bucks are showing up since the place I live on doesn't hold many big deer but rather is a place where they pass through during the rut to find does.

 

[Harold Money jr]

One of my favorite trees to hunt is very susceptible to over hunting. I've hunted this tree for 20 years, I usually hunt it once or twice at most during bow season. Then stay away till juvenile or muzzleloader season, I believe even that's been too much over the years. I noticed late last year a subtle trail and a rub line that was in a deep drain where the deer could skirt by my stand about 60yds away without ever being seen. I'll be waiting there one morning hopefully during muzzleloader season. Point being, I think they tend to adjust their patterns to go around us without us knowing.

 

[LA man]

Thx Brian for the info

 

[AlabamaSwamper]

I agree that stand type matters

I sat 11 straight days last year in the same stand. Sightings never decreased.

Killed an 8 on day 2
Saw a 4.5-5.5 year old 6 on day 9
Killed a 4 year old 9 on day 11

Had dozens of buck sightings in between

But I can say had I been in a hardwood set up that I'm sure it wouldn't have been that way.

 

[BSK]

Some days we get lucky, some days not so much.

That's the quote of all hunting quotes!

I just wish the "lucky days" were more frequent. I might get one or two a year.

 

[woodsman04]

I have stands that I haven't hunted since last rut, and will not go back until this rut. I'm saving them until December 1-10th, hoping somewhere in that time it will be cold. If it ain't it ain't I'll go anyways.
I also only forget the wind during the peak rut. By then it's all or nothing, so I just go. I may try to adjust by wind, but not totally.

During early fall and kate season though wind direction influences where I go greatly.

I mostly use a bow, and if you want to get in range, you better have the wind right. There have been times when I said screw it I'll hunt it anyway, or in a rush and running late, or get lazy, and seems like every time I try to cut corners I get winded as im about to draw my bow back.

Also, I've gotten to where I won't hunt if it's hot, strong south winds, or just bad conditions. Unless it's peak rut time.
The more im in the woods the more im stinking up the areas.