More CWD Positives

[double browtine]

Those circles might as well be touching Chester and Shelby.

https://clarksvillenow.com/local/zone-f ... -expanded/

 

[Omega]

..... but to go from 0 to the high number we have now, in one year of testing, is troubling.

I agree.

Maybe this is just me, but from a statistics viewpoint, I don't see this as that troubling. I say this also considering our land is literally surrounded by CWD positives and we haven't had any deer test positive. I think it seems high because we've DRAMATICALLY increased our sample size and uncovered a problem, but I don't think it is as widespread or as rapidly growing as some people believe.

Now, that is simply my viewpoint so I may be wrong.

The TN map does not show any growth, because it is a one season sampling. The US map is better to show growth as it shows multiple years of testing. But the high, very high IMO, prevalence rate does show a failure to identify, or an issue with the importation of infected deer to that region. You just don't go from 0 to 168 that fast in a normal migration (by whatever means) infection scenario.

 

[Andy S.]

.....our land is literally surrounded by CWD positives and we haven't had any deer test positive.

Sample size? Age of deer tested?

..... rapidly growing as some people believe.

I do not believe it is rapidly growing per se, but I do believe it has been in the hot zone for several years. I also believe it is very established in the hot zone and not much we as hunters can do, but learn to live with, and accept the new norm, whatever that new norm may look like down the road. The new norm being what 2019 season looks like compared to what it once looked like, say 5 years ago.

 

[BigAl]

I haven't read thru all the replies on this thread, but has the probability of the percentage of deer being infected at the processor been accounted for? If the test only involves taking tissue samples from the head and brain, then I'd say that chance is much lower than it being spread from processing utensils from animal to animal, but if the test is derived from the meat that has gone thru processing, then it could be worth noting. :?

I'm not sure I understand the logic here. The deer that are being tested have been killed in the field and most are being tested before they get to the processor and/or are processed. So the deer can't get infected at the processor, they're already dead and were tested before they go there. I also understand the testers at TWRA are diligent about cleaning their utensils. I might have misunderstood your point, but I think you were trying to say the processors might have been contaminating the test samples.

 

[woodsman04]

Another odd thing to me is that no one on this forum, that I've read at least, has reported any deer with physical signs of the disease.

I don't know, to me it's odd, worrisome, but also seems to be over blown.


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[Grnwing]

I have sent 4 to be tested and still waiting on results from 2, other 2 were negative. 3 of the 4 were 4.5+ year old deer and all of them looked and appeared to be healthy, other than a nasty abscess on one of the bucks that oozed green puss. One was a survivor of EHD that had twins this past summer. I think its important to remember that hunters are still going to kill more deer than what will die from CWD. The age structure will likely shift to younger deer but again remember the average deer in the wild doesn't live longer than 4.5 years anyway(does living longer than bucks on average). If you still want to shoot old bucks, you will still have to pass on the smaller ones I will continue to kill mature deer and let the younger ones live on the places i hunt in the hot zone.

 

[Andy S.]

Another odd thing to me is that no one on this forum, that I've read at least, has reported any deer with physical signs of the disease.

Some of us in the hot zone have more than one example. This is the first buck I seen from the stand during bow season. He was at 12 yards and looked eerily poor, having just shed his velvet, his antlers were covered with blood, and his ribs were visible through his skin. I estimated him to be a shooter, but could not get past all of the blood on his antlers, and how poor he looked, so I just watched him. After watching him for a few minutes, he glanced up at me in the tree, and eventually turned and walked off to never be seen again.

End of August pics in velvet

First week of October pics, having just shed velvet.

You think he went downhill fast?



Here is another example of weird stuff happening to our deer herd. It may or may not be related to CWD, but still makes one wonder.

Dec. 1 pic

Dec. 13 pic

Here are some pics taken in the hot zone in early January, 2019. Again, maybe not CWD related, but more and more weird stuff and findings are out there it seems, compared to years past. Maybe coincidental, maybe not? The buck in top pic below was aged at 5.5+ by myself and TWRA.

 

[cbhunter]

Another odd thing to me is that no one on this forum, that I've read at least, has reported any deer with physical signs of the disease.

Some of us in the hot zone have more than one example. This is the first buck I seen from the stand during bow season. He was at 12 yards and looked eerily poor, having just shed his velvet, his antlers were covered with blood, and his ribs were visible through his skin. I estimated him to be a shooter, but could not get past all of the blood on his antlers, and how poor he looked, so I just watched him. After watching him for a few minutes, he glanced up at me in the tree, and eventually turned and walked off to never be seen again.

End of August pics in velvet

First week of October pics, having just shed velvet.

Interesting Pics Andy. I (for one) would have to assume that CWD was at least the case in some, if not all, of those deer. The one with the huge neck could be a diff injury but then again, i'm no CWD expert (or any other disease for that matter)

You think he went downhill fast?



Here is another example of weird stuff happening to our deer herd. It may or may not be related to CWD, but still makes one wonder.

Dec. 1 pic

Dec. 13 pic

Here are some pics taken in the hot zone in early January, 2019. Again, maybe not CWD related, but more and more weird stuff and findings are out there it seems, compared to years past. Maybe coincidental, maybe not? The buck in top pic below was aged at 5.5+ by myself and TWRA.

 

[double browtine]

That is a great example Andy. Thanks for sharing. I can see how that would decimate the deer heard real quick!

 

[BULL MOOSE]

Andy, those pics are gut wrenching!

 

[Andy S.]

Andy, those pics are gut wrenching!

I agree 110%. For the VERY FIRST time in my life, I actually felt sorry for the local deer herd where I hunted. It may be multi-factorial, but it just seemed the deer had everything against them this fall, and they could not catch a break, no matter which way they turned.

 

[woodsman04]

Andy, those pics are gut wrenching!

I agree 110%. For the VERY FIRST time in my life, I actually felt sorry for the local deer herd where I hunted. It may be multi-factorial, but it just seemed the deer had everything against them this fall, and they could not catch a break, no matter which way they turned.

Looks harsh Andy. I have seen one deer that supposedly had EHD, laying in a ditch quivering could hardly stand up, frothing nostrils, and almost like it was in a full body cramp. Sent pictures and videos to local game wardens and biologist. Both said it looked like EHD.

The first big buck you posted pictures of looks like it had a swollen jaw or something? If something is wrong with its jaw it may have not been able to eat right.


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[Andy S.]

It definitely had a compaction of sorts in both jaws, very possibly a condition called lumpy jaw. I'll never know for sure, just speculation without recovering it and testing.

 

[Tiny]

Thanks for the update

 

[MUP]

I haven't read thru all the replies on this thread, but has the probability of the percentage of deer being infected at the processor been accounted for? If the test only involves taking tissue samples from the head and brain, then I'd say that chance is much lower than it being spread from processing utensils from animal to animal, but if the test is derived from the meat that has gone thru processing, then it could be worth noting. :?

I'm not sure I understand the logic here. The deer that are being tested have been killed in the field and most are being tested before they get to the processor and/or are processed. So the deer can't get infected at the processor, they're already dead and were tested before they go there. I also understand the testers at TWRA are diligent about cleaning their utensils. I might have misunderstood your point, but I think you were trying to say the processors might have been contaminating the test samples.

I suppose I was asking if some deer, that had already been processed, had been tested after the fact, and the results added into the equation, thus possibly having a chance of being cross contaminated at the processor.

 

[JJ3]

I suppose I was asking if some deer, that had already been processed, had been tested after the fact, and the results added into the equation, thus possibly having a chance of being cross contaminated at the processor.

The samples are taken from lymph nodes at the lower base of the skull and also from brain stem cell. There is no test for processed meat. So no chance that sample are cross contaminated by the processor.

 

[MickThompson]

They test the same lymph nodes the doctors feel under your jaw. Processors never skin up that far when cutting up deer.


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[MUP]

Thanks for that info guys. Looks like there won't be any worries about continuing to use the processor for me then.

Eta-

Wait. Isn't the prion found in the spinal column as well?

 

[MickThompson]

MUP, there's 2 contamination discussions going on here- cross contaminating the tissue samples for testing (lymph nodes) and cross contaminating meat.

Contaminating meat will largely depend on how the processor cuts the carcass. If they debone the meat, there should be minimal opportunity for contamination as most of the prions are in parts that would be disposed of anyways.

Contamination can happen if they butcher deer in the traditional pattern of sawing down the length of the spine to split the carcass into 2 sides for easier handling. You can see how this could spread prions onto several other carcasses.


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[BULL MOOSE]

Not sure if I have seen this Drury podcast/video shared:
https://youtu.be/9DHErarlTiU