Mid day movement of mature bucks?

[BSK]

Finally finished entering all of this year's October data, and it appears - at least this year - the older bucks were very "crepuscular." And by crepuscular, I mean their movements peaked in the low light conditions of first and last light, although the morning peak is a little later than first light. This is quite different than the November data, which shows movement is constant all night and then drops off fairly significantly during the day.

Below is the data for just this year for October, and the second graph, all 14 years of November data. The October data may change when I get more years of data entered, but entering 14 years of October data is going to take me a while!

 

[tellico4x4]

I'm late to the conversation...this thread covers multiple topics that are interesting...on the private land we hunt and manage we absolutely have sanctuary or refuge areas...farms around us are hunted but not over pressured....but we still allow deer a place to go without being pressured...basically there are three large blocks we dont put pressure on...but we hunt travel corridors in-between these areas and we do everything possible to keep pressure to a minimum.

I'm late too. We are limited to sanctuary areas by timber cutting schedule on our place, therefore some of our sanctuaries may be 100 acres or more of 10 year old planted pines. I refer these areas as "deer factories". No doubt some deer live their life out inside these areas, venturing out only to feed or during rut. But wherever those areas end creates a lot of "edge" that makes a great place to catch a mature buck anytime of day during rut. Outside of rut, you'll never see them. We try to place as many plots as they'll allow at these edges, which takes years of planning and work, then it'll be 5-6 years before those plots are worth hunting. Think new cutover, push plots before pines are planted, plant for several years before hunting. But after established, we have great places for 10-15 years to hunt food sources adjacent to the deer factories, and kill mature deer any hour of day during rut.
We too do absolutely we can to minimize pressure on our 3500 acres. Only 15 members, only traffic past camp during hunting season is hunting (no riding around, scouting, moving stands, no cams on plots, mowed trails to shooting house to allow stealthy approach, etc). Cams are only checked if you hunting where your cam is at.

Also...we have killed mature bucks before which we dont have pics of...but the majority of mature bucks we kill we have many, many pics of....also, for some bucks we will get summer velvet pics, hard horn pics and occasionally pick up their sheds..."home towners" we call them...and while some bucks absolutely do shift...all bucks dont travel for miles....especially when they have everything they need in one location with minimal pressure...

While we occasionally kill a mature buck that is a visitor, the vast majority we know very well. Very common for one to be killed where we had pics in summer. Many of our visitors come from across the road where we join a 6500 club, and I'm sure that they kill a few that stay on us most of year too.

I only run 3 cell cams and they are all on big traditional scrapes scattered fairly equal across property and never go to them unless there's an issue with batteries or card. I primarily use them to tell me about deer "movement". Probably 95%+ of daytime pics are does and junior bucks even during rut. If I'm getting pics at noon on the north end of property, chances are very good that I'm getting pics at the south end as well which is 5 miles away. Even if it's just does & young bucks, I want to be in woods when that movement is occuring. I do not get many mid day pics of mature deer but feel that know that cam is there and avoid getting pic taken. However if does are moving at mid day during rut, I want to be hunting then. I may even sleep in on those mornings and not get into stand until 8-9:00.

I'm not a big plot hunter so my cell cam locations are all at major terrain and/or timber type intersections such as hardwoods/sanctuary area/thinned pines/steep hollows, i.e. type of areas I like to hunt for mature bucks. I really try to setup on at least transition of 3 different types of terrain or cover.

One anomaly we've noticed the past few years is big mature bucks in thinned pines. 7- 8 years ago timber company started thinning and 5th rowing our pines as opposed to clear-cutting. These areas have become hotspots for cruising & chasing all hours of the day. Often they will be in between of two sanctuaries or a sanctuary on one side & hardwood hollow on other. We use tripod stands in these spots and key is to be able to see a lot of area. During rut, these are spots that you want to pack a lunch and set all day. Our best buck ever was killed cruising in one of these spots late morning & scored 168 with a broke left G2. I saw him the day before around 2:00 scent checking a plot 75 yards off of it but why I didn't kill him is another thread topic

 

[Ski]

Finally finished entering all of this year's October data, and it appears - at least this year - the older bucks were very "crepuscular." And by crepuscular, I mean their movements peaked in the low light conditions of first and last light, although the morning peak is a little later than first light. This is quite different than the November data, which shows movement is constant all night and then drops off fairly significantly during the day.

Below is the data for just this year for October, and the second graph, all 14 years of November data. The October data may change when I get more years of data entered, but entering 14 years of October data is going to take me a while!

Those charts mirror the MSU study showing daylight activity increasing as rut begins, progresses, then eventually drops off post rut.

 

[BSK]

Those charts mirror the MSU study showing daylight activity increasing as rut begins, progresses, then eventually drops off post rut.

Once I get all of this year's data entered, I'll post the older bucks by calendar date data. It clearly shows the peak and then drop-off. However, our camera data peaks well ahead of the rut, generally around November 1. I have no idea why. I've always assumed the drop-off after Nov. 1 is due to our hunting pressure driving older bucks away, but now I'm not so sure.

 

[Ski]

Once I get all of this year's data entered, I'll post the older bucks by calendar date data. It clearly shows the peak and then drop-off. However, our camera data peaks well ahead of the rut, generally around November 1. I have no idea why. I've always assumed the drop-off after Nov. 1 is due to our hunting pressure driving older bucks away, but now I'm not so sure.

Same on my place. It grows through October, peaks around Halloween then recedes again to normal. I don't think the bucks go nocturnal. I think they simply are moving a little in their coverage, putting my place in their nighttime area. When the epicenter of their movement for a given day falls on my property I see them in daylight.

 

[BSK]

Same on my place. It grows through October, peaks around Halloween then recedes again to normal. I don't think the bucks go nocturnal. I think they simply are moving a little in their coverage, putting my place in their nighttime area. When the epicenter of their movement for a given day falls on my property I see them in daylight.

Glad to hear it's not just my place.

 

[Ski]

Glad to hear it's not just my place.

For sure not. Nor do I believe it's pressure driven, or at least not entirely. My place doesn't get hunted but a few days per season and I'm not even there often enough to pressure the deer. Habitat work ends in August and starts again in January. During that time the only human presence is for hunting.

So I'm fairly confident the patterns are natural. And since they annually repeat almost without fail and regardless of human presence, I'm completely convinced the pattern is natural. The problem is figuring out what the driving force is and if there's anything I can do habitat wise to alter it in my favor.

I've not been able to yet but the habitat enhancements have for sure increased the numbers and quality of the deer I see. Timeline patterns seem static but I can influence how good the hunt is during that time and so far haven't seen the cap. Gets better and better over time. I just know from history that my best odds are last week of October into first week of November. If I miss that window daylight movement becomes increasingly unpredictable.

 

[BSK]

So I'm fairly confident the patterns are natural. And since they annually repeat almost without fail and regardless of human presence, I'm completely convinced the pattern is natural. The problem is figuring out what the driving force is and if there's anything I can do habitat wise to alter it in my favor.

When you figure it out, let me know! I've wondered about this for as long as I've had the data to show it. I've been tracking the number of unique older bucks I pick up on camera each day for years, and the number of unique bucks always peaks around Nov. 1-3 and then falls off, falling off dramatically right after peak breeding. When looking at the number of older buck events - not unique bucks, but just total times older bucks trigger the camera, which can involve the same buck several times - I see the same thing. Older buck activity peaks at the start of November and then begins to fall, even though the peak of the rut isn't until mid-November.

I've not been able to yet but the habitat enhancements have for sure increased the numbers and quality of the deer I see. Timeline patterns seem static but I can influence how good the hunt is during that time and so far haven't seen the cap. Gets better and better over time. I just know from history that my best odds are last week of October into first week of November. If I miss that window daylight movement becomes increasingly unpredictable.

We don't bow hunt anymore, so I always feel like we're getting left-out by not being able to hunt at the end of October and start of November, but honestly, despite the fact the number of older bucks using the property is declining as we start hunting (MZ Opener, which can be as late as Nov. 9), and buck activity levels are declining, it hasn't hurt our success. We still see plenty of buck activity right up until the weekend after Thanksgiving. Now after that, it falls off like a rock, but for the first 3 weeks of our hunting (MZ season and opening week of gun) we do OK. And the trend is definitely upwards because of all the habitat work we've completed.

 

[TheLBLman]

The recent MSU study shows that an average buck has a home range of 12,000 acres, and 67% of them live their entire lives inside it while the other 33% have more than one home range.

Probably fairly easy to live their entire life inside "only" 12,000 acres
That's over 18 square miles.

Think about the above next time you hear some hunter say,
"We've got a buck, over on our place . . . . . . . "

Then ponder the average "place" may be less than 100 acres,
while "their" buck roams 12,000 acres

 

[Creek]

Finally finished entering all of this year's October data, and it appears - at least this year - the older bucks were very "crepuscular." And by crepuscular, I mean their movements peaked in the low light conditions of first and last light, although the morning peak is a little later than first light. This is quite different than the November data, which shows movement is constant all night and then drops off fairly significantly during the day.

Below is the data for just this year for October, and the second graph, all 14 years of November data. The October data may change when I get more years of data entered, but entering 14 years of October data is going to take me a while!

Could food sources have an impact on those results?

 

[Hillbilly Hunter]

Probably fairly easy to live their entire life inside "only" 12,000 acres
That's over 18 square miles.

Think about the above next time you hear some hunter say,
"We've got a buck, over on our place . . . . . . . "

Then ponder the average "place" may be less than 100 acres,
while "their" buck roams 12,000 acres

And that is why many of my "new" bucks are just crossing through the extreme edges of their home ranges, at least that is what i suspect.

 

[Ski]

Probably fairly easy to live their entire life inside "only" 12,000 acres
That's over 18 square miles.

Think about the above next time you hear some hunter say,
"We've got a buck, over on our place . . . . . . . "

Then ponder the average "place" may be less than 100 acres,
while "their" buck roams 12,000 acres

That's one of the points the researchers were making. Most hunters can't even fathom hunting that kind of area, and an area that big covers maybe hundreds of properties. That's the average. Half of the bucks cover even bigger areas, some far bigger. But some far smaller. I believe Dr. Bronson said there was one buck who lived his entire life inside 100 acres and never ventured out. It's really an individual thing from buck to buck. But for the most part bucks cover far more ground than once believed.

 

[Ski]

And that is why many of my "new" bucks are just crossing through the extreme edges of their home ranges, at least that is what i suspect.

I'd say that's accurate. The study also detailed how bucks will go on excursions for unknown reasons and no rhyme or rhythm. They just randomly take a walk about then turn around and go home.

I thought that was odd but it would explain the random one time cruisers that don't hit any of the hot spots on the property. They just walk through never to be seen again. I get one like that every other year or so and not necessarily during rut.

 

[BSK]

Could food sources have an impact on those results?

Absolutely. I see very different movement patterns in years with a good acorn crop versus a poor acorn crop. In a good acorn crop, buck activity last longer into the morning hours. In a poor acorn year, buck activity peaks the last hour of daylight, as bucks feed in food plots.

 

[BSK]

The recent MSU study shows that an average buck has a home range of 12,000 acres, and 67% of them live their entire lives inside it while the other 33% have more than one home range.

Can you point me in the direction of the research? That 12,000 acres seems like an excessively high number. Most studies come up with annual ranges of 1,200 to 1,400 acres.

 

[DoubleRidge]

Can you point me in the direction of the research? That 12,000 acres seems like an excessively high number. Most studies come up with annual ranges of 1,200 to 1,400 acres.

Thats almost 19 square miles? I cant imagine "the average buck" in hills and hollow terrain...having a home range that gigantic?
I could wrap my mind around those numbers in WY or SD with whitetail or muledeer, maybe even higher in some circumstances. But locally I agree that 12,000 acres, as the average, seems excessively high?
Heck....some studies may suggest that 1400 acres is high for particular bucks...especially as they mature. (Side note: Im a big fan of all the work MSU Deer Lab does).

 

[bonestacker65]

I think everyone is right, the key is knowing your area and what works….. as for my property mid-day (12:00-3:00) sucks

 

[muddyboots]

Very different for me. From 8 am to 9:30 and from 2 to dark. I've tried midday numerous times. Never had it pay off. I have gotten a few pics about 1pm.

 

[Ski]

Can you point me in the direction of the research? That 12,000 acres seems like an excessively high number. Most studies come up with annual ranges of 1,200 to 1,400 acres.

Here's a screenshot. It's on page 12 of their recent publication. The link to it is posted under the screenshot. Hopefully it works. It's a PDF that will download. I linked a youtube video as well of them analyzing the data.

I believe I got confused with some of the info. I was watching the youtube explanation of it while following along in the PDF and they were talking faster than I was reading I think. I made a mistake. Clearly the 12,000 acres is average for mobile bucks. They have bucks broken down into two groups, sedentary and mobile. I mistakingly lumped them into one.

It's an incredibly interesting study and seems to be pretty comprehensive compared to other studies I've seen. There were some affirmations to stuff I thought was happening based on experience but there were also a lot of surprises. Well worth a read and listen if you need to get away from the holiday crowd for an hour or two.

http://extension.msstate.edu/sites/default/files/publications/publications/P3927_Buck%20Movement_webREV.pdf

Here's the youtube link to the good doctors' verbal explanation & analysis of the research.

 

[fairchaser]

I know we as humans want to try to control as many variables as we can when it comes to mature bucks. They are so wary, evasive and unpredictable. Study after study has educated us on the likelihood of behavior. But in the end they are individuals with their own unique set of behaviors.

The odds of their mid day movements may be extremely low when compared with the rest of the herd or even their cohort. But, that buck may want to move that day and you have to be waiting on him if you want to get him.

An old guide in Alberta told me once there was a good buck in there if I could wait on him. That's the hard part!

I still want to try to increase my odds and love learning and playing chess with these old warriors. They only have to make one mistake to lose everything but we have many chances. Yet most of the time, they still win.