What is wrong with East Tennessee?

[dmonty]

I think some of you guys out West are just mad because the guys from the east side are leasing land out west that you once hunted for free.There are slob hunters and poachers no matter which side your from.I leased land in middle TN for several years and had lots of problems with locals trespassing,road hunting,poaching you name it,typical reply from most if confronted was I have hunting this land for my whole life and no one is going to stop me.This always seemed funny to me because since the land was for lease why did they not simply lease it? East Tn hunting is tough,access to private land is not easy to get permission to hunt or to lease.Public land has deer but alot of hunters and with the terrain its a young mans game, you have to do the miles walking to find deer. I'm not a Trophy hunter so much anymore,I simply enjoy being able to get out a few times a year,enjoy being out and if I'm able to get some venison for the freezer I'm happy.Can't we all just get along?

 

[TeamMainStreet]

Take X amount of deer and insert them into a somewhat flat terrain with some sort of Ag and its not going to be hard to narrow down where they are.

Now insert the same X amount of deer into a mountainous terrain, most times steep and rough as a cobb, with
hardly no Ag of any kind. It can be a challenge to even see a deer.

 

[wobblegobble]

They choot em all!

 

[bigtex]

So, I was thinking about this and a thought occurred to me. Whitetail are highly adaptive and, in particular, seem to thrive on the edges that are largely created by humans manicuring the land. The more manicured edges we create, the more the deer thrive. Though we as hunters enjoy having a healthy and abundant population of deer to hunt, for all practical considerations there are more deer in Middle and West TN then there needs to be to have a stable population and there are likely far more deer in these areas then if Tennessee or North America for that matter, had never been populated by large amounts of permanent human residents.

Could it be this: We are spoiled. The deer population in East TN live in a setting which is much less altered and manicured than Middle and West TN and, therefore, the deer population is much closer to what it would be naturally without the intervention of humans.

Deer used to have more predators, more competition, and more room to spread out. As much as we complain, in all likelihood, deer hunting in Middle and West TN has never been easier in any point in history than it is right now. East TN, however, is about the same or closer to the same that it has always been, with some variations for over hunting and disease.

That pretty much sums it up.
Even though we have fewer deer in the East than the West, we have far more deer today than ever. I don't think that we are at carrying capacity, but where I live we're pretty darn close.
When I first started hunting many years ago I don't even think the county I live in had an open season. The closest place to hunt was Tellico or Ocoee. The closest county had only a few days a year in which to hunt. Combine a very short season with an army of eager hunters and well, I think you get the picture. Not a very good hunting experience.
Im not complaining,I wish it were better, but as bad as it is it's still better today than any time that I can remember.

 

[bowhunter163]

west knox has more deer than a lot of places i have hunted but it's hard to find land to hunt.East Tn.has areas that have a lot of deer and other areas that don't.

West knoxville is polluted with deer . I got permission to hunt 7 acres out there last year and the first morning I hunted it in December I saw 18 different deer . I have to bow only hunt it but I'm fine with that . I killed 4 does last year in 2 hunts . Can't wait for the either sex hunts coming up .

 

[Okatoba]

I really don't have a problem with east Tennesseans heading west to hunt a few times a season,I would too if I was them. Shoot,in the old days we burnt an ocean of gas travelling around the State to hunt. I've really only had 2 bad deals with guys heading west,both were the same bunch from Loudon County. One,they shot a doe when crossing over the corps line and got caught by Mr.Greenpants and got a ride to Hartsville. The second was not illegal I don't think,it was a big pile of breasted out hens in a pile on the old fall hunt. I guess they had tags or bought them but it was a shame to kill that many in such a small area, they almost had to shoot them off the roost to kill that many in one day. They maybe got busted again of found somewhere else cause I haven't seen them in years where I usta see them every year. Other than that in 40 years of deer hunting,that's all I've seen.

 

[Stumpbroke]

I don't like it when east tn trucks swarm the public land here and then I start finding carcasses with the heads cut off and no or little meat taken.

care to elaborate further on your observations?

assumptions make me chuckle. go ahead, I'll wait op:

 

[miller1buc]

I am a transplant to TN so I cant speak to what it has been, and I know this gets bashed on here a lot, but the TWRA needs to step up and change the bag limits in COUNTIES of the state to better suit the populations. There is no reason here in East TN(Washington/Sullivan/Carter/Unicoi) that we should be allowed to kill as many deer as they currently allow us to. It makes no sense. Drop it to 1 buck only(with antler restrictions) for a couple years and then slowly start introducing a doe day here and there as things start to recover. Its not rocket science and has been done in many other places, many of which have recovered and have a healthy population now.

I have heard several locals say that In the big whigs eyes, the state of TN ends at Knoxville when going east. Maybe there is more truth to that statement than we let on. Otherwise, if you are in charge of "managing" a statewide population, someone is asleep at the wheel. If it were overpopulated and too many car collisions and crops being damaged, then they would change something. But since there arent money related issues involved, things remain out of site out of mind.

 

[Treestand Troubadour]

Yeah that makes a lotta sense. A one buck limit here and multiple buck limit out west would mean just that many more mountain boys headin out that way to hunt. Id hate to hear about what they would say then. They took our deer, they took our land, they took our jobs. Lol I can hear it now

 

[miller1buc]

Yeah that makes a lotta sense. A one buck limit here and multiple buck limit out west would mean just that many more mountain boys headin out that way to hunt. Id hate to hear about what they would say then. They took our deer, they took our land, they took our jobs. Lol I can hear it now

It works in other states. People have to grow up and act like adults. If the tables were turned, what would they be doing.

 

[Descint4pionter]

you could always buy a place that borders a national wildlife refuge and start making your own little "land grab"

 

[TheLBLman]

I'd gladly go to a statewide 2-buck limit, just to be more "fair" to everyone East of Knoxville.

However, I would like to see some trout stocked in Reelfoot Lake.
For as long as I can remember, most of the trout stockings have been going on in East TN. We've really been short-changed in the Western part of the state with the trout. Sure, we've got more deer (now). Ain't always been that way. But we ain't never had no trout, no bears, no grouse, no wild pigs, and most of our quail have disappeared, too. We got a few geese, but trust me, they're just one big nuisance, and ain't no telling how many baby trout one of those big feathered creatures could eat!

And why can't TWRA stock bears in West TN? Wouldn't the habitat support them?

But I'd really be happy if I could just catch a few trout on Reelfoot. It's a long drive from Samburg to the Clinch River. Actually closer to go to the White River in Arkansas. I think next year I'll just do all my trout fishing in Arkansas.

 

[TNGRIZZLY_]

So, I was thinking about this and a thought occurred to me. Whitetail are highly adaptive and, in particular, seem to thrive on the edges that are largely created by humans manicuring the land. The more manicured edges we create, the more the deer thrive. Though we as hunters enjoy having a healthy and abundant population of deer to hunt, for all practical considerations there are more deer in Middle and West TN then there needs to be to have a stable population and there are likely far more deer in these areas then if Tennessee or North America for that matter, had never been populated by large amounts of permanent human residents.

Could it be this: We are spoiled. The deer population in East TN live in a setting which is much less altered and manicured than Middle and West TN and, therefore, the deer population is much closer to what it would be naturally without the intervention of humans.

Deer used to have more predators, more competition, and more room to spread out. As much as we complain, in all likelihood, deer hunting in Middle and West TN has never been easier in any point in history than it is right now. East TN, however, is about the same or closer to the same that it has always been, with some variations for over hunting and disease.

So poser are you going to be hunting Big South Fork again?

 

[TboneD]

Some of the comments on this thread is 1 reason I wont hunt out of state and will probably stop making any trips out of this region. Twra has set up WMA'S for the sportsman of Tn and not just the locals. We all know it has to be the folks from out of town doing the poaching as no locals ever do such. how many dummys are going to drive a couple hundred miles and poach a deer and chance losing trucks guns and money taking it back home? my $ is a local that can get rid of it quick where nobody will see it and will hang in a barn till hell freezes over. some of us use hunting trips as vacations and its not so much the kill as the trip. I reckon my $ will stay in this end of the state

^^^^ exactly my thoughts . Blame it on the East TN guys . Like you said , who would drive a
Few hours to hunt just to leave a deer laying or poach ? I would bet locals as well .

And heaven forbid someone come from East Tn to hunt " their " WMA . There are a few arrogant posts in this thread and I'm embarrassed for them .

For the record, I, for one, was simply trying to reply to the OP in my earlier comment and didn't intend to sound arrogant or presumptuous. I apologize, though, because what I said could be taken that I was painting with a broad brush. However, I was simply trying to relate that I didn't understand why folks would drive across the state to hunt Cedar Forest, and wasn't trying to disparage anyone's character. Just being real, and actually, the couple of guys of the group from E Tn that I met were very nice guys....and they're welcome to hunt in our neck of the woods, as they should be.


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[WORM82]

Poser you need to come on up around Unicoi or Shady Valley in the North CNF and do a hunt sometime. I have never set foot on the South CNF or big south fork tho so I can't give you a comparison on deer numbers but I think you would really enjoy it up here.

 

[archer19]

There is no single answer to the question of why are deer densities so relatively low in East TN vs. the rest of TN.

But the reasons include ("generalizing" here, as localized exceptions abound) in order of significance:

1) Poorer habitat that cannot support as many deer

2) More deer hunters

3) More poachers (my opinion, may not be fact)

4) Different attitudes among East TN hunters vs other hunters (not saying this is good or bad, just part of why there are fewer deer).

5) Greater predation from bears and household dogs. Assume the coyotes are widespread west to east, but there are more
roaming dogs in most of East TN simply because rural houses are more numerous, i.e. the rural human population is denser in East TN.

6) "Simplified" Statewide Regs that allow for the same number of deer hunting days in East TN as in all of TN. While the "antlerless" deer limits are considerably less, we still have the same annual 3-buck limit in Unicoi County as we have in Henry County. Certainly not an "apples-to-apples" comparison, but for the sake of comparison, East Kentucky has less than half as many gun-hunting days as East TN, and those East KY hunters have an annual buck limit of one, compared to our three.

What do you mean by #4 ?????????
I hunt deer. Don't know why my location makes my attitude different?

 

[catman529]

I don't like it when east tn trucks swarm the public land here and then I start finding carcasses with the heads cut off and no or little meat taken.

care to elaborate further on your observations?

assumptions make me chuckle. go ahead, I'll wait op:

no assumptions here, just observations. Anyone could have killed those deer they left lying on the ground. But I see quite a few trucks with east tn tags and quite a few wasted carcasses by the roadside at the same time. I'm sure most of the east tn hunters actually eat their kills because they can't find any back home. Funny though I saw one east TN truck parked at WMA with 2 deer on the hitch hauler, one looked to be head shot, both deer were gutted but had no ice and the hunters were hunting well into midday reaching the 60's that day and leaving the deer on their truck with flies buzzing. If you're gonna drive that far you might want to at least buy some ice and keep your meat good.

Also, a homeowner near the boundary once drove up to me, while I was bowhunting ML opener, and asked if I was going to shoot toward the house. (I was over 100yd from house) Of course I wasn't going to shoot that way, and was bowhunting anyway, but he was legitimately concerned because he said people come from Knoxville and even as far as North Carolina every year, and shoot up the place and cut the deer's heads and leave the deer to rot.

Those are my observations, not assumptions, and I also know people who hunt public land too who see the same kind of stuff


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[TeamMainStreet]

I'm pretty sure, no, 100% positive, that there are no idiots in middle and west TN. There just can't be.

We need a designated color font for sarcasm.

Catman, I especially liked the part of your story about hunters from east tn eating their west tn kills because they can't find any back home. I thought you said no assumptions man. Cmon

 

[bowhunter163]

I'm pretty sure, no, 100% positive, that there are no idiots in middle and west TN. There just can't be.

We need a designated color font for sarcasm.

Catman, I especially liked the part of your story about hunters from east tn eating their west tn kills because they can't find any back home. I thought you said no assumptions man. Cmon

oke:
:rotf:

 

[BallisticV]

Makes me thankful to live and hunt in Middle TN