Squirrel gun update...

Tenntrapper

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After doing the upgrades to the 10/22, to be honest...I wasn't impressed. I tried several different kinds of ammo, including some eley tenex...just wasn't where I wanted it. So, I put it away. Got it back out yesterday and decided to try again. I had switched scopes on it and needed to get sighted in for squirrel.
I had a couple bulk packs of Winchester power points that I hadn't tried. Figured to use them to sight in. Again... unimpressed, but it was what it was.
I've got a few bricks of tenex EPS that I hadn't tried, figured what the heck. Loaded up 10 rounds and started shooting. WOW, much better. Guess this is the ammo this barrel likes. This is 10 rounds at 25 yards. The other pic is...after shooting the EPS, I loaded 10 Winchesters and shot at same target. Quite the difference....
 
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tug

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After doing the upgrades to the 10/22, to be honest...I wasn't impressed. I tried several different kinds of ammo, including some eley tenex...just wasn't where I wanted it. So, I put it away. Got it back out yesterday and decided to try again. I had switched scopes on it and needed to get sighted in for squirrel.
I had a couple bulk packs of Winchester power points that I hadn't tried. Figured to use them to sight in. Again... unimpressed, but it was what it was.
I've got a few bricks of tenex EPS that I hadn't tried, figured what the heck. Loaded up 10 rounds and started shooting. WOW, much better. Guess this is the ammo this barrel likes. This is 10 rounds at 25 yards. The other pic is...after shooting the EPS, I loaded 10 Winchesters and shot at same target. Quite the differe
Did you upgrade your barrel?

There is only so much accuracy you can get out of a 10-22. The 10-22 is sold everywhere and in incredible numbers. So that Ruger does not have to deal with complaints that a gun is not functioning, they cut the sloppiest chamber on Earth. The result is that 10-22s feed virtually any ammo but the tradeoff is reduced accuracy. It is a great plinker.

An individual 10-22 will shoot some ammo more accurately than others, but if you don't address the barrel and it's chamber limitations, you will probably never be happy with it as a squirrel rifle.

This is life. There are no perfect answers. Only tradeoffs.
 

Tenntrapper

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Did you upgrade your barrel?

There is only so much accuracy you can get out of a 10-22. The 10-22 is sold everywhere and in incredible numbers. So that Ruger does not have to deal with complaints that a gun is not functioning, they cut the sloppiest chamber on Earth. The result is that 10-22s feed virtually any ammo but the tradeoff is reduced accuracy. It is a great plinker.

An individual 10-22 will shoot some ammo more accurately than others, but if you don't address the barrel and it's chamber limitations, you will probably never be happy with it as a squirrel rifle.

This is life. There are no perfect answers. Only tradeoffs.
Some observations...and things I've read...

The 10/22 is a great plinker...and it's the small block Chevy of the rimfire world.... anything is available for it....and the rabbit hole is DEEP!!
I've owned about dozen CZ 452s, 455s, and 457s...never owned one that wouldn't out shoot any 10/22 (or any other 22) I've owned.
Can a 10/22 be made to shoot? Yes, I'm sure they can. I just haven't found the trick yet. Pretty sure the trick is to replace everything but the sling with aftermarket parts. Receiver, bolt, trigger, barrel, and stock. I've already got considerably more in this one than the most expensive 457 would have cost. Anymore and I'll be getting into Annie territory.

I have done a mock up with a shim under the front receiver pad thing...to see how "free floating" the barrel would effect things. I didn't shoot it because it was obvious that it wouldn't work. With only one action screw, it turns the barreled action into a teeter totter. Unless you buy a new receiver with a rear flange, there is nothing to hold the rear down. Guess that's why most 10/22s have a barrel band. Additionally, if you do free float it...now you're dealing with a steel barrel in a thin aluminum receiver with nothing supporting it. In the 10/22 world they call what will eventually happen....barrel droop. This is a rifle I intend to hunt with, not a bench rifle that will spend a fair amount of its life in a hard case or gently sitting on a bench. I'm sure it would be picked up but the forearm/barrel end. That, I'm sure, would put even more pressure on that "unsupported" barrel/receiver junction. So...what to do?
For now, I'm just going to leave it the way it is. I have replaced the factory barrel with a 16.5" GM SS fluted factory contour"match" barrel...it has the "Bentz" chamber. I've also replaced the trigger group with a Timney Calvin Elite 2-stage trigger (it's sweet, BTW).
Short of replacing the bolt/receiver...not much else I can do. I'm trying different ammo now. The tenex EPS has shot the best so far. I'm waiting on an order of "subsonic hollow" to get here. I've had issues in the past with RN target ammo ricocheting through the woods (I hear it bouncing off limbs). I would like to avoid that if possible. If the SH shoots good, I'll stock up on it and call it good. If not..I'll try the Aguila or CCI subsonic HPs.
Which brings me to another issue....mini-mags. This is a 16.5" barrel. Had I went with the 20", I would try the MMs. I've read that the 22 will get all it's going to get at about 16"... anymore and the barrel is actually slowing the bullet. I've even read that some of the better barrel mfgs will make the last few inches a slightly smaller ID...to intentionally slow the bullet. Something about bullets leaving the barrel supersonic, and going transonic between muzzle and target and upsetting the bullet. It's more than my tiny brain can fully understand...but the idea makes sense. So...all supersonic ammo is out!!
Wow...this post turned out longer than I intended...lol
I love the idea of using a 10/22 for squirrel hunting, but if accuracy is your end goal, save yourself some $$, and just buy the CZ. It will end up costing less...and will out shoot a 10/22 all day long. Yes, I'm aware there are exceptions...but I'm speaking generally.
 

bowhunterfanatic

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Some observations...and things I've read...

The 10/22 is a great plinker...and it's the small block Chevy of the rimfire world.... anything is available for it....and the rabbit hole is DEEP!!
I've owned about dozen CZ 452s, 455s, and 457s...never owned one that wouldn't out shoot any 10/22 (or any other 22) I've owned.
Can a 10/22 be made to shoot? Yes, I'm sure they can. I just haven't found the trick yet. Pretty sure the trick is to replace everything but the sling with aftermarket parts. Receiver, bolt, trigger, barrel, and stock. I've already got considerably more in this one than the most expensive 457 would have cost. Anymore and I'll be getting into Annie territory.

I have done a mock up with a shim under the front receiver pad thing...to see how "free floating" the barrel would effect things. I didn't shoot it because it was obvious that it wouldn't work. With only one action screw, it turns the barreled action into a teeter totter. Unless you buy a new receiver with a rear flange, there is nothing to hold the rear down. Guess that's why most 10/22s have a barrel band. Additionally, if you do free float it...now you're dealing with a steel barrel in a thin aluminum receiver with nothing supporting it. In the 10/22 world they call what will eventually happen....barrel droop. This is a rifle I intend to hunt with, not a bench rifle that will spend a fair amount of its life in a hard case or gently sitting on a bench. I'm sure it would be picked up but the forearm/barrel end. That, I'm sure, would put even more pressure on that "unsupported" barrel/receiver junction. So...what to do?
For now, I'm just going to leave it the way it is. I have replaced the factory barrel with a 16.5" GM SS fluted factory contour"match" barrel...it has the "Bentz" chamber. I've also replaced the trigger group with a Timney Calvin Elite 2-stage trigger (it's sweet, BTW).
Short of replacing the bolt/receiver...not much else I can do. I'm trying different ammo now. The tenex EPS has shot the best so far. I'm waiting on an order of "subsonic hollow" to get here. I've had issues in the past with RN target ammo ricocheting through the woods (I hear it bouncing off limbs). I would like to avoid that if possible. If the SH shoots good, I'll stock up on it and call it good. If not..I'll try the Aguila or CCI subsonic HPs.
Which brings me to another issue....mini-mags. This is a 16.5" barrel. Had I went with the 20", I would try the MMs. I've read that the 22 will get all it's going to get at about 16"... anymore and the barrel is actually slowing the bullet. I've even read that some of the better barrel mfgs will make the last few inches a slightly smaller ID...to intentionally slow the bullet. Something about bullets leaving the barrel supersonic, and going transonic between muzzle and target and upsetting the bullet. It's more than my tiny brain can fully understand...but the idea makes sense. So...all supersonic ammo is out!!
Wow...this post turned out longer than I intended...lol
I love the idea of using a 10/22 for squirrel hunting, but if accuracy is your end goal, save yourself some $$, and just buy the CZ. It will end up costing less...and will out shoot a 10/22 all day long. Yes, I'm aware there are exceptions...but I'm speaking generally.
I have nothing to offer you in the way of help, but I am super curious how far you are trying to shoot said squirrels? Only reason I ask is because neither of my two primary squirrel slayers would wow anyone on a bench, but they are plenty accurate enough to head shoot tree rats.
 

Tenntrapper

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I have nothing to offer you in the way of help, but I am super curious how far you are trying to shoot said squirrels? Only reason I ask is because neither of my two primary squirrel slayers would wow anyone on a bench, but they are plenty accurate enough to head shoot tree rats.
I can agree with this. As is, my 10/22 is plenty accurate to shoot squirrels. I've been testing at 25 yards, but I would like to see some nice groups at 50. With my last CZ, head shooting them at 75 was pretty easy. I generally don't shoot them at that distance, but it's nice to know the rifle was up to it. If I can get 35 and an occasional 50, I'll consider that good enough. The biggest issue so far has been... RN match ammo has been what shoots the best. The others I've tried left a lot to be desired. But the RN match ammo ricochets to much for my liking. I've been reading about the Paco Kelly tool as well as the Waltz tool....turns RN into HP or FP.
Unfortunately, common sense showed up a little late...as usual... 😂
I got to figuring.....
Based on killing 50 squirrels a year..for the next ten years. Using a rifle so inaccurate as to hitting only one in 10 shots(and it's much better than that)...it still would have been cheaper to just bought 10x the ammo... 😂
I guess they call it a rabbit hole for a reason... 😂
These posts are only meant as a warning for folks considering the 10/22. I'm not angry about it...not in the least. But if you are looking for a squirrel gun and the 10/22 is on your short list....forget the mods and just stock up on ammo. You will be better off... 😂

Edit to add... nothing I'm saying is meant to imply that the 10/22 is a bad platform...we all know better than that. It's just not the best for building a bench gun...or rather, a squirrel gun with bench gun accuracy.
Sure, there are some options out there...Kidd for example, but before I pay Kidd prices, I would just buy an Annie. And before I done that..I would buy another CZ. This is/was just a project to build a small, lightweight, squirrel gun...that had some class to it. (The stock is beautiful)
Hindsight being 20/20...I should have just bought more ammo... 😂
 
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tug

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I've heard of doing that, but curious as to how that would address the "free floating" issue?
If yours is floated, what did you do to secure the rear of the receiver?
I use a .920, 16 inch, non-tapered barrel in a Hogue overmolded stock. In a .22, especially with a short .920, there is very little value in free floating. I use the standard single screw mount with a better screw. I always shoot suppressed.

There are several shortcomings that a monolithic barrel and receiver overcomes. The scope is unitized to the barrel. There is zero variance between the barrel and the magazine mount (receiver) increasing reliability. The bolt face can be perfectly square to the back of the barrel.

The 10-22 barrel/receiver interface was designed for ease of assembly, not accuracy. There have been a million ways tried to overcome this issue. Parts, gun-smithing. Some of it works pretty well. But in the end, if you don't thread the barrel to the receiver, there will always be a little play.

If you go this route, make sure you drill a cleaning rod access hole in back of the receiver.
 

Tenntrapper

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I use a .920, 16 inch, non-tapered barrel in a Hogue overmolded stock. In a .22, especially with a short .920, there is very little value in free floating. I use the standard single screw mount with a better screw. I always shoot suppressed.

There are several shortcomings that a monolithic barrel and receiver overcomes. The scope is unitized to the barrel. There is zero variance between the barrel and the magazine mount (receiver) increasing reliability. The bolt face can be perfectly square to the back of the barrel.

The 10-22 barrel/receiver interface was designed for ease of assembly, not accuracy. There have been a million ways tried to overcome this issue. Parts, gun-smithing. Some of it works pretty well. But in the end, if you don't thread the barrel to the receiver, there will always be a little play.

If you go this route, make sure you drill a cleaning rod access hole in back of the receiver.
Although I completely understand what you are saying...the CZ 457 has a very similar barrel mountain system (interchangable barrels) and accuracy isn't a problem. When that model first came out (actually on the 455) there was a lot of speculation that it would lose the accuracy that the 452 was known for. Just wasn't the case though. In my experience, the 455 and 457 are just as accurate.
Back to the 10/22. I'm wondering if it would benefit from floating all but the last inch or so (muzzle end). I've heard that a pressure pad has been effective with some. In the end, it has to maintain two points of contact...or else it just going to teeter totter. I've yet to find a way to secure the rear of the receiver.
 

tug

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A centerfire rifle barrel benefits from free floating because it oscillates as does a tuning fork. If a .22 rim with a one inch barrel only 16 inches long might oscillate some, but its impact on accuracy is imperceptible.

My barrel contacts the channel throughout. No teeter totter. I could probably remove the mounting screw and not even miss it much.
 

Tenntrapper

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Just check with the guy who did my gun some years ago. He says he has a better method.

I've read about CPC on another forum.... thinking RFC.
Just curious, if you don't mind saying...what kind of groups are you getting? I don't mean that 1 in 100 "best" group, but rather what it shoots consistently. And what ammo are you getting it with? I know they can each have a favorite, but again...just curious.
 

tug

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I've read about CPC on another forum.... thinking RFC.
Just curious, if you don't mind saying...what kind of groups are you getting? I don't mean that 1 in 100 "best" group, but rather what it shoots consistently. And what ammo are you getting it with? I know they can each have a favorite, but again...just curious.
Let me dig out my targets. Be a day or so.

This outfit quit threading receivers in favor of what they do now. They think it is a better way. I don't know if anyone approaches the issue with threading now.

RWS 40 Gr hollow point sub through a sparrow for squirrels. I don't eat the brains so I shoot them in the noggin. Just about decapitates them. I try not to shoot a body.
 

tug

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I've read about CPC on another forum.... thinking RFC.
Just curious, if you don't mind saying...what kind of groups are you getting? I don't mean that 1 in 100 "best" group, but rather what it shoots consistently. And what ammo are you getting it with? I know they can each have a favorite, but again...just curious.
All of these averages of either 3 or 4, five-shot groups. 35 yards. Non-suppressed.

CCI: Green tag .50; Pistol match .58; Standard .77; Stinger .90

WW XX HP .73

RWS sub HP .80

Rem yellow jacket .84; Sub hp 1.05

Fed: HP .86; 711 .54; 900 .42; 900B .65; UM1 .40

That was when the gun was new.

Now the RWS HP shoots about .40. Not sure if the gun got better, RWS changed the load, or possibly the suppressor made a difference. But my last 10 shot group at 35 measured .62 edge to edge. At 100 a ten shot went 1.40.

I have not gone back to see if the other 13 loads changed from un-suppressed to suppressed.
 

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