Rub size
- Thread starter Mr. Hawk
- Start date
In most cases the height of a rub means more than the size of the tree.
Spike
just kidding with ya i hope its a monster!!!
just kidding with ya i hope its a monster!!!
Tweeter
Well-Known Member
Could that be a bobcat? Sorry for my ignorance, but just wondering.
I guess it's possible, I figured for the time of year and location which is right along a heavily traveled trail it was a 200" buck!
BSK
Well-Known Member
I disagree completely. Rub height is meaningless. In fact, some of the largest bucks make their rub low on the tree (most likely for leverage). Rubbed tree diameter is very significant.
backyardtndeer
Well-Known Member
Had some beech trees here about the same size that had similar rubs or scratches. When asked, seemed to be split opinions between being a big buck and a cat.
Always heard that a big buck will rub a little tree, but a little buck won't rub a big tree. I'd say you have a good one. Good luck!
I've seen rubs on power poles in KS due to lack of trees.
I've seen rubs on power poles in KS due to lack of trees.
Soft Talker
Well-Known Member
A good woodsman can learn a lot about a buck, from the size, height, and collateral damage around a rub. 
East TN Bowhunter
Well-Known Member
This is my theory as well. I also agree with BSK that diameter is more important than height. I had a 22-24inch wide 7 point last year rubbing cedar trees as big around as my thigh but the rubs were only maybe a foot of the ground at the bottom.
I've never been able to tell much by rubs but they do offer hints. If it's got gouges in the back then maybe there's a kicker off on of the brows. If there are good tine gouges noticeably above where the "rub" is then the buck probably has long tines and/or a big cage frame. I've also never seen significantly deep gouges from yearlings. Only a strong, heavy buck has that kind of force.
Other than that obvious stuff I've never been able to use a single rub for gathering much info. I've watched big bucks rub a hundred trees in the matter of a few minutes, and I've seen young bucks follow behind bigger ones rubbing the same trees. Some are big. Some are small. IMO a buck rubs a tree that's in front of him when he's feeling like rubbing.
The info I'm most interested in with rubs is how many there are, which side of the tree is rubbed, and if they're randomly placed or in a circle or line. If in a line then it's most likely a path between bedding & food, and whichever side the trees are rubbed tells me which direction the buck is traveling. If both sides are rubbed then he's going back & forth rather than making a loop. If the rubs are laid out encircling a small house size area then you're standing inside his core bedding. Get out without touching a thing & stay out so you can hunt his coming & going. But if it's just a blob of random rubs it means nothing, even if there are a bunch and some are big. One buck could have done it all in a few minutes and never return again. They rub for a lot of different reasons. Sometimes it's just a dominance exhibition and means nothing. But if there's a pattern to it then maybe look a little closer.
Other than that obvious stuff I've never been able to use a single rub for gathering much info. I've watched big bucks rub a hundred trees in the matter of a few minutes, and I've seen young bucks follow behind bigger ones rubbing the same trees. Some are big. Some are small. IMO a buck rubs a tree that's in front of him when he's feeling like rubbing.
The info I'm most interested in with rubs is how many there are, which side of the tree is rubbed, and if they're randomly placed or in a circle or line. If in a line then it's most likely a path between bedding & food, and whichever side the trees are rubbed tells me which direction the buck is traveling. If both sides are rubbed then he's going back & forth rather than making a loop. If the rubs are laid out encircling a small house size area then you're standing inside his core bedding. Get out without touching a thing & stay out so you can hunt his coming & going. But if it's just a blob of random rubs it means nothing, even if there are a bunch and some are big. One buck could have done it all in a few minutes and never return again. They rub for a lot of different reasons. Sometimes it's just a dominance exhibition and means nothing. But if there's a pattern to it then maybe look a little closer.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Considerable research has been conducting on buck rubbing behavior. Until this research was conducted, it was not understood just how "social" rubbing behavior can be. The vast majority of rubs are meaningless. They are created and never revisited. Yet there is a particular type of rub - the signpost rub - that is highly significant. Signpost rubs are not only rerubbed in multiple years, they are also rerubbed, sniffed, and licked by most of the deer that encounter them in a given year (even does interact with signpost rubs). It is believed signpost rubs transmit important chemical messages through the population (just like scrapes, but different chemicals). Who starts a signpost rub is critical. Signpost rubs do not exist in areas without older bucks (generally at least 3 1/2, but more often mature bucks). However, once an older buck starts the signpost that season (and they are usually rerubbing a tree that shows scars of many years of being rubbed), every age buck in the population reworks the rub. That is why hunters say they saw a spike working a big rub. Yes, they do, but they did not start the rub. Older, generally mature bucks, start big rubs, but then every age buck interacts and reworks them.
Interestingly, in each region of the country, bucks prefer a different species of tree to use as a signpost rub. In Coastal South Carolina, where some of the original research was conducted, sassafras is the #1 choice for signpost rubs. In TN, eastern red cedar is the top choice. In the far north, aspen usually tops the list.
The pictures below show rub scars from repeated usage of the same trees for rubbing year after year.
Interestingly, in each region of the country, bucks prefer a different species of tree to use as a signpost rub. In Coastal South Carolina, where some of the original research was conducted, sassafras is the #1 choice for signpost rubs. In TN, eastern red cedar is the top choice. In the far north, aspen usually tops the list.
The pictures below show rub scars from repeated usage of the same trees for rubbing year after year.
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ScLowCountry
Well-Known Member
BSK
Well-Known Member
Red maple and beech is what I see them on most often in big woods. I see a lot on cedars in low open/brushy country.
BSK
Well-Known Member
When I was conducting my decade-long rub research project, I found the larger the diameter of rubbed tree, the fewer species of tree that were represented. Once I got up into the really big rubs, just 5 species were found: eastern red cedar, loblolly pine, beech, maple, and poplar.
tree_ghost
Well-Known Member
kentuckylakebuck1
Well-Known Member
nonsense
kentuckylakebuck1
Well-Known Member
Im sure some here would remember, back in the 80s Tinks 69 had a commercial with a spike rubbing a power pole! as far as height vs diameter, my experience is that ive seen multible 130s -170s rubbing very small trees and low and high in height? Ive watched yearlings rubb 10-16 in diameter trees, high and low. so MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE is that its VERY random! i hope you have a monster on your property though!
Sign post rub every deer going by hits it, shot a 8pt that scent cked 1 as it walked by, winmag ruined his day. Tree had fresh rubs on it the rest of the season but never caught another 1 checking it. Would have been a great place for a stealth camera,
