Pope & Young Poll - Legalize Lighted Knocks?

gil1

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I'm an official P&Y scorer. Last year, I had to tell a guy who used lighted knocks to kill a 135 net score buck (I scored it anyway just for fun) that his deer didn't qualify because the rule states "no electronics attached to the bow or arrow." He was bummed, and I might have been even more bummed. But I understood the reasons behind the rule.

I am excited that there is now a poll out giving P&Y members the chance to weigh in since the Board is split on the matter. I think there are some great arguments for either side, but I'd like to hear your opinions before I vote. If you are a member, you can go on-line to the Members-Only section and vote.

The next post will have all the info. I received in the letter. It might help you to read through it to familiarize yourself with the organization's opinions on the matter.

Thanks in advance.
 

gil1

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TO: Pope and Young Club Members
FROM: Your Board of Directors

One of the Pope and Young Club�s longstanding positions is that hunting bows and arrows should not incorporate electronic components nor should they have electronic items attached to them. That position is facing more and more resistance, embodied most obviously at this time in the growing popularity and use of battery-powered lighted nocks on hunting arrows.

Your Board of Directors has thoroughly examined and discussed this timely subject and is evenly split between maintaining the no-electronics principle and proposing a by-laws change allowing lighted nocks. Consequently, we are seeking input from the entire membership. Valid arguments for and against change exist. Undoubtedly, many Pope and Young Club members have already heard the pro and con discussions about lighted nocks and formed an opinion. Regardless, here are a mere handful of pertinent points commonly presented in support of and opposition to making this change:

IN SUPPORT OF THE EXISTING RULE

Unchecked technological advancements threaten existing bowhunting opportunities and the future of a sport that is based on the willing acceptance of equipment limitations, as well as the values of challenge, simplicity, discipline, skill and patience that bowhunters seek.

The Club's long-established rules were thoughtfully crafted to reflect values and principles that have served our organization and bowhunting well for 50+ years. Our "line in the sand" on electronics is a clear, understandable and defendable position. Any effected changes when made, should always be based on what's right for bowhunting, not what's merely popular.

Embracing lighted nocks may be interpreted by the public and media as admitting that bowhunters have a problem with wounding and recovering animals and need a product to fix the "problem"--the very arguments bowhunters and legislators are using in favor of lighted nocks. The Club would be better served to educate today's bowhunters about shot placement and ethical restraint in not choosing risky shots, instead of encouraging use of a product or technology as a crutch to overcome any deficiency.

The Pope and Young Club is held in high esteem by many who consider it a reliable champion of ethical, responsible, fair chase bowhunting. Our stated mission is to promote our heritage and values in order to preserve the future of our sport. Lighted nocks are only one of many products now being marketed that challenge our rules. The expected influx of new technologies and electronics will yield many more new products; making an exception for one item opens the door to requests for additional exemptions to, or elimination of, our rules. It not only erases a clearly defined policy but invites future requests for product "endorsements."

The arguments we've all heard favoring a change to accept lighted nocks are the arguments that could be used for a myriad of products currently on the market or yet to be invented.

IN SUPPORT OF CHANGING THE EXISTING RULE

Lighted nocks are increasingly popular items which are legal in many states. Their sole advantage is visual, improving a shooter's ability to follow fast-flying arrows and pinpoint their point of impact. The glowing nocks also improve chances for the recovery of expensive hunting arrows on missed or pass-through shots.

Many bowhunters using lighted nocks are unaware of the Pope and Young Club's electronics rule. Each year official measurers inform successful hunters their animals are ineligible for the Pope and Young Club's records. This disappoints bowhunters and creates the perception that legally taken trophy-class animals are somehow unworthy of recognition. We alienate potential Club members or supporters and deprive ourselves of entry fee revenue.

A potential exists that a possible World Record will be taken by an arrow equipped with a battery-operated lighted nock. As was the case with the Club's former "65% let-off compound bow rule," when a giant non-typical whitetail buck was taken with a higher let-off bow, we did not recognize a legally harvested animal until our let-off rule was eventually changed. Will history repeat itself?

One false public perception is that our Club is a traditional-based organization whose leaders are mostly anti-compound, anti-archery industry, close-minded bowhunters who cling to the past and resist all change. We must consider making reasonable changes that our membership supports.

It is desirable and possible for the Pope and Young Club to balance its traditional values and its position on bowhunting's principles with the reality of twenty-first century bowhunting, embracing our heritage while accepting change.
 

catman529

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I don't see why they wouldn't be allowed. Does P&Y have an agreement with arrow manufacturers to encourage more hunters to lose their arrows in the woods?
 

Elmer

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Lets enforce common sense. Using lighted knocks you can make a better decision on when to take up the trail after shooting in low light. It also helps recover an arrow. I really can't believe this is an issue
 

Diehard Hunter

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If they are going to be that particular, maybe they should stick with what Ishi taught Dr. Pope, and eliminate anything that has come along since then.

For goodness sakes, that lighted nock doesn't even activate until after all the skill of bow hunting has been brought to bare on the animal! It does not aid in killing that animal in any way. It does help to recover the arrow, and that may influence your decision as to when to take up the trail, but it doesn't kill the animal any deader, and it doesn't lessen the skill needed to kill the animal with a bow.
 

REM7

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Snake said:
deerhunter10 said:
Roost 1 said:
IMO a lighted nick offers no afvantage to harvesting a trophy animal. I say allow them!!!

x3! its a way to save a 6-10 dollar arrow.

No advantage at all , man let's use common sense !

Snake said it best, its simple common sense that lighted nock has NO advantage for the kill. Just easier to find an high dollar arrow and head.
 

nabowhunter

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Of all the advantages that today's bowhunter has over bowhunters 50 years ago, the lighted nock has to rank very low on the list.

One of many reasons I will not enter an animal in any record book. Geez!
 

bowriter

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A lighted nock does nothing to increase your ability tokill a deer. So, why would you not allow them. Just another P&Y example of poor thinking. Their contention, though maybe not spoken, is they make it easier to shoot at night. MY contention is so does a spotlight or a full moon. You can not legislate morality.

Allow the dan things and crossbow, too.
 
A

Anonymous

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Not only that but a lighted nock makes it that much easier to see where the deer was hit or where the arrow is and that in turn makes for a more humane recovery. That is the intent anyway.
 

bowriter

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When I resigned from P&Y after nine of membership, it was 100% due to their hypocrasy. Sad to say, it has gotten worse. They have become downright stupid.
 

gil1

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I totally get what you're saying folks, but I think some didn't read P&Y's reasoning. They never said the rule was in place because they think lighted knocks give a hunter an advantage. And there's certainly zero there about fear of night hunting.

Although I get their reasoning for not allowing lighted knocks (listed above in the thread), I voted to change the rule because I don't believe there's enough there to justify keeping them banned from the record books. It's just the right thing for the club at this time IMO.

I'm a big fan of these folks. There's no hypocrisy that I can see or I wouldn't be involved. They don't celebrate the hunter - they celebrate the animal. They are giving their members the ability to make policy, and that's a refreshing and stand-up way to do business.
 

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