Today I shot some 290g Barnes TEZ's out of my new TC Impact, with 90g of BH209. Out of six shots, there were a couple of flyers, and I later noticed that a couple of the sabots were missing petals. Coincidence?
90 grains by weight or volume?TboneD said:. . . . 90g of BH209.
Wes Parrish said:90 grains by weight or volume?TboneD said:. . . . 90g of BH209.
Wes Parrish said:This morning I shot the best 200-yard group I've ever shot with my Savage smokeless, using those exact same Barnes bullets and their supplied blue sabots.
200-yard 3-shot group measured 0.67" (center-to-center of holes) which is a 0.34 MOA actual group at 200 yards.
I wasn't using BH209, but was using a "hotter" load than a 90-grain charge of BH209 (by volume).
I really like these particular Barnes bullets in my Savage, and so far have had no problems with the sabots.
This gun is a "stock" factory Savage with no custom work done to it.TboneD said:Dang. You've got one heck of a muzzleloader there, Wes.
Wes Parrish said:I have little idea as to why your petals broke off. I thought maybe you were using too much powder, and that possibly had an effect. Are they hard to load?
Muzzleloaders are particularly finicky.
A little more or less powder can greatly change your groups, and some guns simply don't like certain bullets & sabot combos.
Even the primer makes a bigger difference than most might think.
This morning, after shooting that sub-half-minute group at 200 yards, I decided to try the same load/bullet but with a CCIM 209 primer instead of the Federal 209A primers I prefer. I have a good supply of the CCI's and am low on the Feds, so just checking to see the difference.
I only test two rounds (at 200 yards) switching over to the CCI primers, but the difference in both POI and group size was significant. Changing nothing but the primer, my POI shifted about 3 inches to the right, about 1 1/2 inches low, and those two bullet holes were 2 1/2 inches apart. Not that I consider a 1.25 MOA 200 2-shot group "bad", but the bigger issue for me was they hit the target in a very different place, so after just two rounds, I have no plans of using those CCI primers (unless I can't find any more Feds).
mike243 said:my savage starts shearing petals at higher speeds with xtps, that what I based my comments on. heat from prev shots and ambient temps also affect the sabot. on a colder day the petals may stay intact with the fast load or waiting 10-15 min between shots. i don't load mine and let the heat soften the sabot, only load after the barrel has cooled or load and shoot quickly before heat affects it
The TC's do seem to have a tighter barrel compared to CVA's. I throw the sabots that come with the Barnes I get for my 45 cal and replace with easy load Harvester sabots. The bullets are hard to load with the sabots they come with.TboneD said:Hmmmm...well, the bases of the sabots were fine. Was the missing petals the reason for the flyers? I have no idea, but so far the best I can get from this TC is three shot groups of about 2.25" off a bench at 100yds.
I've tried 245g (or maybe it was 250g) XTP's and 100 g of BH209, and that was the worst with about a 3" group at 100yds. I tried one of the 295g XTP's, but it was just too dang tight with the supplied sabots. The Barnes shot about the same as TC 250g Shockwaves in the EasyGlide sabots, but I don't want to use those since they're the bonded ones. So I guess I'll try backing off the powder a bit with the Barnes and maybe pick up some unbonded TC Easy Glide 250 Shockwaves. They sure do load the easiest. This is the first TC I've ever had, and as I've heard, it definitely has the tightest bore of any MZL I've ever had.
Any other suggestions on what to try? I'm afraid that maybe part of the reason I'm having trouble is that the trigger is probably over 5lbs. If I confirm that, TC will take care of it, but it's a little late to send it off and have it back this season.
GMB54 said:The thinner the sabot petals the easier they shear off when shot. TEZs are basically the same in loaded OD as the HPH-24 sabot and the petals are fairly long. They separate from the bullet quickly too
Sabots like the MMP orange 50x458 sabot are even thinner. Petals nearly always shear but its totally normal. They shoot just fine for many people.