Opening MZL weekend numbers are in...

[TNDeerGuy]

I think we may be our on worst enemy. Everyone wants to see more deer but they also want to kill more. I'm all for the twra doing away with the 3 a day limit in unit l.

THE COMMISSION sets the limits, and unfortunately, appears to have blinders on to the average joe's deer hunting. They and their buddies have properties big enough to hold deer, and like the "efficiency" of multiple doe harvests so they have more days to get their bucks. Why else would they add the unit L private land doe days at the end of the season? Nobody wants their target trophy buck to be shot by someone else while they're just trying to keep the buck/doe ratio in check. Just thank God they designated it for only private land.

The guys that buy licenses every year to pay the bills need to let their voices be heard and I'm all for a petition or something. It's going to take serious political pressure to get the Commission to start caring about the average guy's deer hunting and not just their's and their friends. I'm not trying to vilify the commission. Only calling it as I see it in the arbitrary limits and regulations for WMA's, open public state forest lands, and private lands. It shouldn't be arbitrary and political. There was NO legitimate reason to restrict Old Hickory Lock 5 Refuge as they did. If it's water under the bridge it's a dangerous precedent that one day could happen near you. If Cheatham and some other WMA's are properly managed than the rest of Unit L's should be as well. Why not common sense rules like MS has? They have more deer than people but last I checked only allow three does an entire season on open state forest lands. When are folks gonna take the blinders off and realize they're pretty fortunate if they're seeing deer every sit? Every farm I've ever had permission to hunt ended up sold, and it could happen to some of y'all as well. Then you might have do like I do and spend more time scouting than hunting until you find another property. You guys that hunt Yanali, wouldn't y'all like a little less competition? Think there's an endless supply of deer there? Sorry for rambling on. Just keeping it real. Overall, I just think the way Unit L deer is being managed is just a crying shame. It's like the only places they give a hoot about are suburban, developing, or big private properties...and select WMA's.


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There was majority support for it. They can't help it if the "average joe" doesn't involve himself enough to make his opinion known. All they can do is listen to the people that are being vocal.

Plus, what if your opinion is in the minority? Then what?

How do you know there was majority support for it? It's funny, my emails asking for exact numbers to prove one way or another what the numbers were have fallen on deaf ears or in the round file. Guess an official FOI request needs to be filed.

 

[AT Hiker]

There was majority support for it. They can't help it if the "average joe" doesn't involve himself enough to make his opinion known. All they can do is listen to the people that are being vocal.

Plus, what if your opinion is in the minority? Then what?

How do you know there was majority support for it? It's funny, my emails asking for exact numbers to prove one way or another what the numbers were have fallen on deaf ears or in the round file. Guess an official FOI request needs to be filed.

Diehard Hunter did the FOI route, the first email indicated a majority for reduced limit. Then a second, and controversial, email was then sent out. The second email solicited more responses to leave the limit alone.

Interpret it the way you want.



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[TNDeerGuy]

I think we may be our on worst enemy. Everyone wants to see more deer but they also want to kill more. I'm all for the twra doing away with the 3 a day limit in unit l.

THE COMMISSION sets the limits, and unfortunately, appears to have blinders on to the average joe's deer hunting. They and their buddies have properties big enough to hold deer, and like the "efficiency" of multiple doe harvests so they have more days to get their bucks. Why else would they add the unit L private land doe days at the end of the season? Nobody wants their target trophy buck to be shot by someone else while they're just trying to keep the buck/doe ratio in check. Just thank God they designated it for only private land.

The guys that buy licenses every year to pay the bills need to let their voices be heard and I'm all for a petition or something. It's going to take serious political pressure to get the Commission to start caring about the average guy's deer hunting and not just their's and their friends. I'm not trying to vilify the commission. Only calling it as I see it in the arbitrary limits and regulations for WMA's, open public state forest lands, and private lands. It shouldn't be arbitrary and political. There was NO legitimate reason to restrict Old Hickory Lock 5 Refuge as they did. If it's water under the bridge it's a dangerous precedent that one day could happen near you. If Cheatham and some other WMA's are properly managed than the rest of Unit L's should be as well. Why not common sense rules like MS has? They have more deer than people but last I checked only allow three does an entire season on open state forest lands. When are folks gonna take the blinders off and realize they're pretty fortunate if they're seeing deer every sit? Every farm I've ever had permission to hunt ended up sold, and it could happen to some of y'all as well. Then you might have do like I do and spend more time scouting than hunting until you find another property. You guys that hunt Yanali, wouldn't y'all like a little less competition? Think there's an endless supply of deer there? Sorry for rambling on. Just keeping it real. Overall, I just think the way Unit L deer is being managed is just a crying shame. It's like the only places they give a hoot about are suburban, developing, or big private properties...and select WMA's.


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Great post! By the way, the commission should be vilified—their actions against the sportsmen have repeatedly earned it over the years! They have repeatedly proven to be a corrupt and inept bunch of politically appointed, self-serving hacks that don't care about the people that don't rub elbows with high-cotton crowd—it's a miracle the deer farming didn't pass! In fact, one of the loudest pushers on the TFWC of the 2-buck limit rarely, if any, hunts in the State in which he was appointed to oversee. I think the TFWC, in its current form should be abolished and replaced with a more balanced approach—1/3rd TWRA biologists, 1/3rd political hacks and 1/3rd randomly drawn TN hunting/fishing license holders.

 

[Big20Pointer]

I think its a combo of all. Maybe 2 buck limit kept alot of guys's muzzleloaders in the gun case and they are waiting to buy their gun tag now that they only get 2 buck tags? I highly doubt weather is the factor could it have contributed, probably but thats a huge drop in numbers due to just weather. Wish there was a way to look a license sales especially muzzleloader tags. Now rut timing? I was in Montgomery county this past weekend and everything seemed right on track to me.

 

[muddyboots]

Still as many of my buddies hunting as always. Most don't give 2 thoughts to shooting a doe with a firearm. Mostly all hunting big bucks so not many shots around me. The few of my buddies after does are using there bow. There's another couple after them with their ml but they can't shoot.

 

[muddyboots]

And the weather definitely has curtailed some day light movement.

 

[cg02175]

I think the low harvest numbers relate to a reduced overall deer population. Over the last several years, TWRA has allowed way too many doe to be killed. IMO, TWRA cares more about supporting their free meal ticket program a.k.a hunters for the hungry program (which is one reason why they allow so many doe to be killed), insurance companies and politicians than our state's deer herd. Yes, some hunters will say they are still seeing a lot of deer in their area, but you have to considered the state as a whole, not just your hunting location. The reduced harvest numbers tell the story, and the low harvest number trend will continue throughout this season.

4 deer a day (1 buck and up to 3 doe) in unit L counties is insane. I know all hunters don't kill that many per day, but the doe have still taken a beating here in west Tennessee. I applauded the two buck limit, but TWRA needs to reduce the number of doe killed as well.

 

[TX300mag]

In my 14th deer season on Tndeer.com, I've come to predict certain thinks with 100% accuracy.

1. A lot will say they haven't seen as many deer as they were expecting and conclude that the population has dropped significantly

2. Many will say the hunting is better than ever

3. Some will say that more antlerless need to be killed

4. Several will say there was almost no rut, or at least that it isn't starting on time

I'm hesitant to say that the deer are gone because of a disappointing MZ opener without considering other possibilities as well including fawn recruitment, weather, hunter recruitment, etc. especially considering MANY reported great kills and plenty of deer sightings.




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[Hunt 365]

Wishful thinking! We will all know in the next few weeks. Stay positive!

 

[J_W]

In my 14th deer season on Tndeer.com, I've come to predict certain thinks with 100% accuracy.

1. A lot will say they haven't seen as many deer as they were expecting and conclude that the population has dropped significantly

2. Many will say the hunting is better than ever

3. Some will say that more antlerless need to be killed

4. Several will say there was almost no rut, or at least that it isn't starting on time

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Like death and taxes lol.

The list of perennial issues could get pretty long!

 

[TboneD]

Generally from my experience in area with low deer population it is difficult to kill 3 does per day.

I know some real killers and very few of them have killed 3 a day more than once or twice. And that's hunting areas where there are good deer populations.


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Think about it. Just because deer are getting scarce doesn't make them quit traveling in family groups. The groups are just fewer and smaller. So all it takes is decent competency with a repeating rifle and a little luck for the shots if you're in the woods.

Bottom line, though, is that I'm glad the wildlife agencies didn't apply the same thinking back when they were trying to bring back the numbers after they'd been all shot out back in the day.


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[TX300mag]

Generally from my experience in area with low deer population it is difficult to kill 3 does per day.

I know some real killers and very few of them have killed 3 a day more than once or twice. And that's hunting areas where there are good deer populations.


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Think about it. Just because deer are getting scarce doesn't make them quit traveling in family groups. The groups are just fewer and smaller. So all it takes is decent competency with a repeating rifle and a little luck for the shots if you're in the woods.

Bottom line, though, is that I'm glad the wildlife agencies didn't apply the same thinking back when they were trying to bring back the numbers after they'd been all shot out back in the day.


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I'll admit, I don't see herds of 10-12 does feeding out in the open over and over again, but I have to admit that I saw more bucks at my main hunting ground last year on the first few days of the season than I did in the entire five years before being moved into unit L combined. The does have modified their behavior since 2009 and are tougher to hunt throughout the season.

I've hunted in public and private land in 10 or so counties off the top of my head in the last three years or so and although hunting antlerless isn't as easy as it once was I would say overall the hunting is better than ever.

In fact, two years ago during MZ I hunted almost 30 consecutive hours on four properties in three counties without a single deer sighting, so I understand your frustration. One morning the light switched flipped and it was very good for the next two weeks. Hunting public land one morning last year I saw a lone spike. I text messaged a buddy at 10 and said I'm going home. I made myself sit until noon as I was 35 miles from home and had nowhere else to be. I sat back down and counted 10 more deer between 11 and noon. Had I based my opinion of that property based on the first 5.5 hours I might have been very frustrated.

If you've recently transitioned from hunting private ground to mainly public, you have to have a different set of expectations as the results will normally be much different. Pressure makes deer scarce to a MUCH larger extent than harvest. One of the larger public tracts I hunt averages a doe killed for every 500 acres. I've averaged a doe every 30 acres for years just a few miles away and continue to see MANY more deer. Before another place was sold two years ago I averaged a doe for every six acres in the same area.

Pressure.




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[TboneD]

Generally from my experience in area with low deer population it is difficult to kill 3 does per day.

I know some real killers and very few of them have killed 3 a day more than once or twice. And that's hunting areas where there are good deer populations.


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Think about it. Just because deer are getting scarce doesn't make them quit traveling in family groups. The groups are just fewer and smaller. So all it takes is decent competency with a repeating rifle and a little luck for the shots if you're in the woods.

Bottom line, though, is that I'm glad the wildlife agencies didn't apply the same thinking back when they were trying to bring back the numbers after they'd been all shot out back in the day.


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I'll admit, I don't see herds of 10-12 does feeding out in the open over and over again, but I have to admit that I saw more bucks at my main hunting ground last year on the first few days of the season than I did in the entire five years before being moved into unit L combined. The does have modified their behavior since 2009 and are tougher to hunt throughout the season.

I've hunted in public and private land in 10 or so counties off the top of my head in the last three years or so and although hunting antlerless isn't as easy as it once was I would say overall the hunting is better than ever.

In fact, two years ago during MZ I hunted almost 30 consecutive hours on four properties in three counties without a single deer sighting, so I understand your frustration. One morning the light switched flipped and it was very good for the next two weeks. Hunting public land one morning last year I saw a lone spike. I text messaged a buddy at 10 and said I'm going home. I made myself sit until noon as I was 35 miles from home and had nowhere else to be. I sat back down and counted 10 more deer between 11 and noon. Had I based my opinion of that property based on the first 5.5 hours I might have been very frustrated.

If you've recently transitioned from hunting private ground to mainly public, you have to have a different set of expectations as the results will normally be much different. Pressure makes deer scarce to a MUCH larger extent than harvest. One of the larger public tracts I hunt averages a doe killed for every 500 acres. I've averaged a doe every 30 acres for years just a few miles away and continue to see MANY more deer. Before another place was sold two years ago I averaged a doe for every six acres in the same area.

Pressure.




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Please realize I've hunted public ground for 20 years now, so I understand what you're saying about pressure and deer there vs deer seen. I go more by lack of sign, but I'm trying to come from an objective and non-anecdotal point of view...although it would seem otherwise by the context. But just go back and read what I've posted before. It just doesn't make sense to say that all the counties they've shaded can continue to stand a 3 doe a day "limit" season after season, with no regard given for "open" public ground or even average properties. As others posted, folks will complain about not seeing deer and then shoot two or three in a group cause they can.


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