Finally, trees hitting the ground

[BSK]

After all the wet spring conditions, the loggers are finally able to work at my place. Got my first timber check yesterday. Timber prices are holding well.

Keep cutting those trees! I need the regrowth...

 

[spoon]

:cool:

 

[Jarred525]

Good deal, I am late as usual but working on trying to line someone up for a 12 acre clearcut in July or August.

What type of timber you cutting?

 

[BSK]

What type of timber you cutting?

50 total acres in 3-5 acre patches (14 total patches). Removing everything except white, red and black oak smaller than 12 inches DBH.

Maximizing regrowth while keeping oak "seed trees" for rebuilding an oak-dominated forest.

 

[JohnnyBond]

:cool:

 

[farmin68]

You gonna get your dream tractor with this timber sale? :)

 

[Jarred525]

What type of timber you cutting?

50 total acres in 3-5 acre patches (14 total patches). Removing everything except white, red and black oak smaller than 12 inches DBH.

Maximizing regrowth while keeping oak "seed trees" for rebuilding an oak-dominated forest.

In my 10 to 12 acre tract, I have some red oak I am debating on keeping that were in the 60 inch DBH range. I am still trying to decide if I am going to cut them. My goal with the tract is as a sanctuary so I know leaving them will leave some open areas in the tract. Thoughts to sway me one way or the other? :)

I think I have found someone who will come in and log everything including junk. I am going to talk to a landowner to see if he liked dealing with the logger.

I may add another 10 acre tract if that is what it takes to get the logger in. Also debating having pines brought in and planted to some extent. Found someone who will do 10 acres for $750 (to include cost of seedlings). I have a good recommendation on this guy.

I'll PM you with one other question. Thanks as always for your advice.

 

[PickettSFHunter]

Ive heard the prices are doing alright, pulp up real good and sawtimber on the climb. I hope they hold until I can get the 30 acres cut that my forester recommended.

 

[Jarred525]

Ive heard the prices are doing alright, pulp up real good and sawtimber on the climb. I hope they hold until I can get the 30 acres cut that my forester recommended.

That is good to hear.

 

[BSK]

You gonna get your dream tractor with this timber sale? :)

That would be nice, wouldn't it. ;) I can always hope!

 

[richmanbarbeque]

Fun to see the landscape evolve.

 

[megalomaniac]

Plenty of time for browse to grow before hunting season. It'll be like shooting fish in a barrel over the browse on the 4 month old cutovers :)

 

[Chaneylake]

I like yrs 3-5 on fresh cutover in Hatchie Bottom

 

[JCDEERMAN]

I'm in the same shoes BSK! They moved all their equipment back up to our place this past weekend and started logging...FINALLY, because of the wet spring. We are cutting about 70 acres in about 5-10 acre patches (I wanted smaller patches, but my dad wanted it "easier for them"). So whatever, it will still be better than what we had. They are cutting everything bigger than 12" DBH and we went around and marked a few big white and red oaks as well. I wanna put my stands up, but I'm gonna wait to see what I can see before I put them up. I have a feeling that this year is gonna be GOOD! We will see after this years' deer season. I just hope they can get most of it done :)

 

[BSK]

Plenty of time for browse to grow before hunting season. It'll be like shooting fish in a barrel over the browse on the 4 month old cutovers :)

Actually, I doubt we'll see much regrowth in cuts started in June. Generally you have to have sunlight on the ground starting in early spring to really get much usable regrowth.

However, what we will have is downed tree-tops. I've asked the logger NOT to clean these up. We want them left in the cuts. Since these tops will hold their dead leaves through their first winter, deer will use them for bedding cover.

 

[BowGuy84]

Sounds neat guys! Im 5-10 years away from starting to cut some but some valuable info in here on how to do it. Best of luck.

 

[Jarred525]

What type of timber you cutting?

50 total acres in 3-5 acre patches (14 total patches). Removing everything except white, red and black oak smaller than 12 inches DBH.

Maximizing regrowth while keeping oak "seed trees" for rebuilding an oak-dominated forest.

BSK, One other question I thought of. When you say removing everything, i assume he is cutting pulp or junk as well? What about your small non oak trees, say less than 12 inch DBH?

I am hoping whomever I line up will indeed cut everything to include pulp or junk. If they leave the less than 12 inch DBH junk stuff, I thought I might go in with some Arsenal in September and kill those trees.

 

[BSK]

In this cut, we are cutting out everything that is not a white, red or black oak. We are trying to maximize sunlight on the ground hence maximize regrowth, and we would have cut absolutely every tree in these cuts, but the deer density would not allow oak regeneration. In essence, deer would eat all the white/red oak stump sprouts, and we have cut an oak forest only to end up with a regenerating forest of poplar and sycamore (less desireable saplings for browsing by deer). Oak regeneration from acorns produces many times more oak saplings than relying purely on stump sprouting.

We will be following behind the loggers and cutting down any non-oak trees the loggers didn't take.

 

[BowGuy84]

BSK, request, could we get some pics? Befores if possible, and afters for sure. Id like to see what you are having them leave it looking like. Do you have pics of any areas that were cut like this say 3 years ago? Thanks and good luck.

 

[Jarred525]

In this cut, we are cutting out everything that is not a white, red or black oak. We are trying to maximize sunlight on the ground hence maximize regrowth, and we would have cut absolutely every tree in these cuts, but the deer density would not allow oak regeneration. In essence, deer would eat all the white/red oak stump sprouts, and we have cut an oak forest only to end up with a regenerating forest of poplar and sycamore (less desireable saplings for browsing by deer). Oak regeneration from acorns produces many times more oak saplings than relying purely on stump sprouting.

We will be following behind the loggers and cutting down any non-oak trees the loggers didn't take.

Thanks, would be interested in hearing how things turn out over the next few weeks.

 

[BSK]

BSK, request, could we get some pics? Befores if possible, and afters for sure. Id like to see what you are having them leave it looking like. Do you have pics of any areas that were cut like this say 3 years ago? Thanks and good luck.

Although these pictures (summer and winter) were taken a few years ago, neither area has changed since then, and both are very close to areas that are being cut (one area being cut is just to the right of the area shown in the summer-time picture). So these would be very representative "before" pictures:

I'll get some "during" and "just after" pictures.

At 3 years of regrowth, expect to see what you would have in a power-line right-of-way that hasn't been bush-hogged in a couple of years--a waist to chest-high tangle of saplings, weeds, grasses and black-berry briers.

 

[PickettSFHunter]

Roughly how many "seed trees" do you plan on having left per acre after the cuts are done? I was thinking I would leave some of the larger oaks (30" plus DBH) in my seed tree cut area because they would put off the most acorns. But I see your leaving 12" and under, is there a reason leaving the smaller oaks works better? Thanks

 

[BSK]

Roughly how many "seed trees" do you plan on having left per acre after the cuts are done? I was thinking I would leave some of the larger oaks (30" plus DBH) in my seed tree cut area because they would put off the most acorns. But I see your leaving 12" and under, is there a reason leaving the smaller oaks works better? Thanks

We're not attempting to produce any particular basal area left standing. We're just trying to maximize sunlight on the ground while still having acorn production for oak regeneration. In addition, I hope to produce very "spotty" habitat in the cuts to maximize habitat diversity (a grove of trees left standing here and there in the cuts instead of single, individual trees).

A few mature oaks left standing would work better for acorn production, but those are also the "high dollar" trees at the mill. Since we're asking the loggers to cut in strange patterns (little scattered cuts instead of one big cut) we want to keep them happy as well (high monetary return for everyone involved).

 

[String Music]

If you had the option to hinge cut the trees, would you do that instead of completely removing them?

 

[BSK]

If you had the option to hinge cut the trees, would you do that instead of completely removing them?

No, because instead of hardwood regrowth, I would like to maximize weeds and legumes as much as possible. Cutting to stump slows down sapling production by a year or so.

Now if I was just cutting "little patch" (less than an acre) to produce cover quickly, yes I would hinge-cut. But I want to maximize natural food production for as long as possible before it becomes cover.

 

[BSK]

Honestly, if it were feasible, I would love to take half of these cuts and burn them on a three-year rotation. That would keep them in maximum food production forever. However, trying to perscribe burn super-steep hillsides, without the ability to make and maintain good firebreaks, is a scary proposition. Hillside burns have a way of really getting out of control once they start generating their own thermal winds.

The hillsides I'm having cut are so steep the loggers aren't using log-skidders to retreive the trees. They are backing down the hill with a bulldozer and cabling the trees out. A skidder at the top of the hill then drags the trees to the loading deck.

 

[Football Hunter]

thats great.your making a poke salad bed,or beds!

 

[BSK]

One thing I may attempt is spraying patches of the regrowth--those areas with the least oak regeneration--with Arsenal. This will restart the hardwood regrowth process in those patches. Spraying in patches would also increase habitat diversity.

 

[Boone 58]

Thanks for sharing!

 

[BowGuy84]

Thanks for the pic BSK. Looking forward to seeing the rest. Guess Im not clear on what Arsenal does and how that would start hardwood regrowth sooner...would it limit competition of weeds and briars to get hardwoods up and running sooner?