BSK

[deerhunter10]

When you go out and scout in the bachelor groups you can pick out a specific deer. We aren't going to agree on this topic. But i do not agree with you on the point i think they hurt you a whole lot. That's my experience with them. But nevertheless you have contradicted yourself.

 

[BSK]

With that said, you must be careful about where you place the cameras. All our cameras are located in food plots where the deer are use to year-round human activity. I also put the cameras in spots where I can check them from my four-wheeler. Deer are used to four-wheelers in this locations and are not spooked by them.

Great post String Music. As I help people attempt to set-up and run season-long camera census, I honestly have a tough time describing why I place cameras where I do. Much of my results are based more on trial-and-error over the years. But if I had to assess the set-ups that work best, I would have to come to exact same conclusion you have.

First, place cameras where human activity is normal throughout the year, not in areas where human intrusion is a dead give-away to the deer that "human predation season" is under way. Deer are not smart, but they have an unparalleled ability to differentiate between threatening and non-threatening human activity, and a lot of that is based off spatial orientation. Human activity "over there" is not a threat. But human activity "over here" IS a threat.

Second, check cameras right from the back of an ATV IF ATVs are not used for hunting in the area. Deer don't seem to find the smell of where an ATV has driven to be anywhere near as threatening as the smell of where a person has walked.

 

[BSK]

When you go out and scout in the bachelor groups you can pick out a specific deer.

What about those properties where the vast majority of bucks do not use the property until after summer bachelor groups have broken up? And what about those scouting bachelor groups in summer, only to have those bachelor groups break up and each buck move to a completely different fall range?

 

[BlountArrow]

When you go out and scout in the bachelor groups you can pick out a specific deer.

What about those properties where the vast majority of bucks do not use the property until after summer bachelor groups have broken up? And what about those scouting bachelor groups in summer, only to have those bachelor groups break up and each buck move to a completely different fall range?

This is a very good point, because I run cameras about 8 months out of the year on our small farm and I typically never, get a mature buck on film except between November and mid-January. I just don't see mature bucks on my property in the Spring/Summer and even early Fall. I'm not going to say that means they definitely aren't there but they sure aren't showing up for a photo-op. Likewise, my cameras are easy to get to and almost always can be driven up to. I'll branch out once in a while and put one on "Pike's Peak" just for the fun of it but it might go a month or more without being checked too.

 

[htnseymour]

My cameras haven't shown much but two young bucks, does, possums and raccoons, but they sure do let me know when the movement is and I have trails to them that are at least 20 yards from deer trails.

 

[deerhunter10]

I understand that some properties you won't be able to scout the bachelor groups but that's why going in after season can pay off big deer have a small home range. Granted a doe can change that but the majority of the time they have a small home range you find that you find your deer. Also the surprise factor is great to me at least. I am and never will be a fan of them. The only thing that's cool is that you can brag to your buddies about the big deer you've gotten pictures of but if you don't get a chance at them what's that good for? A scrap book they put a lot of pressure on the deer herd that people just do not realize.

 

[BSK]

...I run cameras about 8 months out of the year on our small farm and I typically never, get a mature buck on film except between November and mid-January. I just don't see mature bucks on my property in the Spring/Summer and even early Fall. I'm not going to say that means they definitely aren't there but they sure aren't showing up for a photo-op.

Odds are, they are not there in summer. This is actually quite common. Most hunters are now aware of the idea of a deer's "annual range"--all of the area that deer covers over an entire year--but what they don't seem to understand is that most deer do not use all of their annual range all of the time. In many cases, an individual deer only uses part of his/her annual range during different times of the year, and that individual deer may only use one portion of their range during the fall hunting months. In fact, the fall hunting months may be the only time of the year that deer uses that part of their range, hence would never be seen there at any other time of year.

 

[deerhunter10]

I gotta good question for you where do you get all this information? Are you a biologist or what source do you get it?

 

[BSK]

I understand that some properties you won't be able to scout the bachelor groups but that's why going in after season can pay off big deer have a small home range.

Many deer, and especially older bucks, can have massive home ranges, some being documented in excess of 18,000 acres. Now on average, it is not going to be anywhere close to that big, but shifting seasonal ranges can cause deer to move considerable distances from one season to another, and especially during the rut--sometimes these shifts can be measured in miles.

 

[BlountArrow]

I gotta good question for you where do you get all this information? Are you a biologist or what source do you get it?

Bingo and then some.

 

[BSK]

I gotta good question for you where do you get all this information? Are you a biologist or what source do you get it?

I'm a private lands wildlife and habitat management consultant. My personal research is geared towards whitetailed deer management and behavior issues. As part of my job, I keep up with all the latest university research.

 

[deerhunter10]

That's the complete opposite of what I've read and heard. I've read somethings on seasonal movement and home ranges. But seen nothing that proves it. But if that is the case then how can you pattern a deer with trail cams?? If that is the case how can genes be passed down?? I mean your point has a lot flaws. 18000 acres is a ton of land. Miles and miles

 

[deerhunter10]

Well that's a dream job for most i will give you that
Sounds very interesting.

 

[BSK]

That's the complete opposite of what I've read and heard.

Then you've read and heard erroneous information.

I've read somethings on seasonal movement and home ranges. But seen nothing that proves it.

This is a new field of study. That data has only been available in the scientific community for a couple of years, and yours truly is one of the few people involved in the research who is trying to bring that information to the hunting public.

But if that is the case then how can you pattern a deer with trail cams??

Most of the time, you can't pattern bucks with trail-cameras, unless the habitat forces very specific movement patterns (travel corridor options are sharply limited due to lots of surrounding open landscape). Try patterning a buck in big unbroken hilly hardwoods. Darn near impossible. But then I don't use trail-cameras to pattern deer. I use them for the purpose they were originally invented for--to assess local deer population and herd structure.

If that is the case how can genes be passed down??

What genes exactly? Every time two deer mate, genes are being passed down.

I mean your point has a lot flaws. 18000 acres is a ton of land. Miles and miles

Sure is. And that's why those findings were so amazing (determined by having deer wearing GPS collars that collect a GPS position hourly and accurate to 7 meters).

 

[deerhunter10]

Well sounds like you data is accurate i need to watch what i read better then. But still back on trail camera's i don't agree with them. I think they do a whole lot more harm then good.

 

[htnseymour]

BSK, how does one get your job? I have a biology degree and have always wondered how to get into a field like yours.

 

[BSK]

Well sounds like you data is accurate i need to watch what i read better then.

Just remember, when it comes to real biological knowledge, most outdoor writer, and virtually every TV hunting personality, doesn't know squat. They may be very good hunters, but they know diddly about biology.

 

[BSK]

BSK, how does one get your job? I have a biology degree and have always wondered how to get into a field like yours.

I would have to say I was just really lucky. At the same time, the best way into a very competitive field is having some unique skill that has wildlife management implications. I was hired into a consulting group because of my unique skills with GIS and digital mapping technology.

 

[ferg]

I gotta good question for you where do you get all this information? Are you a biologist or what source do you get it?

I'm a private lands wildlife and habitat management consultant. My personal research is geared towards whitetailed deer management and behavior issues. As part of my job, I keep up with all the latest university research.

You are WAY to modest Bryan - Way -

Bryan has authored books and hundreds of articles on this subject - his - 'authority' on the subject is without question -

That's why BSK is the 'go to' guy on this subject here -

If you wont toot it Bryan I know a couple of thousand members here that will

ferg...

 

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