I dont get crazy with it, but i shoot 31" draw and 72 pounds with. 300 spine arrow and heavy fixed broadhead. I have to pull my arrows out of the ground after they go through the deer. Im amazed at how little penetration some of the hunting show guys get. Of course many are short guys with short draw lengths or are shooting mechanicals
Heavy vs. Light
- Thread starter SinningSaint33
- Start date
One of the fun things about bowhunting is playing around with your set up.
A lot of guys like to tinker. I'm one of them.
But if you really care about the truth about light vs. heavy arrow set ups...I guess you need to know the "credentials" of the person typing this page.
I am a serious whitetail deer BOWhunter. I hunt mostly Southeast Tennessee. Almost all public land that has heavy pressured (educated, spooky, wary, mature) string dropping whitetail.
I am surrounded (in my circle of friends) by serious bowhunters who do the same.
WE have collectively killed LITERALLY THOUSANDS, I mean THOUSANDS of whitetails. Over HALF by arrow. I have been involved with MANY of these friends bow set ups and often am involved with blood trailing decisions, if not physically there.
I have pictures and in may cases, videos, of ALL of my bow kills which as of the end of last 23-24 season, now totals 366 whitetail deer bow kills. And 34 gun kills. Plus 1 xbow kill.
All 366 bow kills were a compound bow. I have killed one deer with a bow but it is not included in my bow kill total.
I killed 21 whitetails last season. All vertical bow. (also 4 hogs)
I have ALL of my kill tags. Except the very first (my first deer) ,which was a bow kill, in 1981 at Arnold Air Force base in 1981.
I killed all these deer (because I don't "harvest" squirrels, fish, or any other living creatures that I consume).
I record STOOOPID amounts of data for each kill.
Including, but not limited to,
DATE
TIME OF DAY
MALE/FEMALE
NUMBER OF POINTS
DRESSED WEIGHT
WEAPON USED
DISTANCE OF SHOT
DISTANCE TO RECOVERY
ORGAN AFFECTED
WEATHER/TEMP
KILL TAG NUMBER
LOCATION OF KILL
There are countless videos documenting wound channels of almost every kill.
I have shot 600 + grain arrows tipped with a Rocky Mountain Supreme 150 grain 1.5 " fixed.
Killed several deer with them. Worked well. Slow as molasses in winter.
I've shot every kind of broadhead (type) available.
Fixed
Mechanical
Cheap/expensive
Cut on contact
Chisel tip
single bevil
2 blade
5 blade
spinning (Razorback 5)
Forward deploy
Rearward deploy
Dull
Sharp
SCARY sharp (IMMENSELY BEST)
1 piece
replaceable blade
And on and on...
I've shot light, fast and loud (High Country Safari with an over draw on 2213 aluminums. Sounded like a 22 pistol going off) OLD technology.
And heavy, quiet and slow. Jennings round wheel 46"? OLD technology. Very quiet, forgiving, slow, accurate.
I feel EXTREMELYconfident in making the following statement...
I'm certain I have either put an arrow through, or been on the blood trail of, every conceivable bow shot deer imaginable.
And many of these bow shot deer...MANY times.
I counsel MANY bowhunters every bow season concerning their hits.
So here is what my opinion is concerning light vs heavy arrow:
Like Ski said...if you don't make the right shot, you are probably gonna have problems (paraphrased).
Accuracy is KING!
After all, if you don't hit the target at all...
The NUMBER ONE reason why most bowhunters miss the bullseye (spelled killing shot) is because they do not put the pin in the correct place that corresponds with the distance.
In a perfect world...there would be no arch in archery. But there is.
Unlike rifles that shoot relatively FLAT at ranges inside 100 yards (common in the South), bows drop dramatically at distance.
So there has to be a balance between speed, noise, and most importantly...ACCURACY!
FOR ME, (not necessarily everyone), if I am at full draw on a P/Y buck at 10 yards, that looks up at me and BOLTS to 34 yards (really happened), I want to know I can make a slight adjustment on my pin position, really quick by holding a tad higher, and make the shot.
The yardage is not nearly as critical at 265fps as say 230 fps.
And my bow is lower in draw weight than it used to be. At 60 pounds and a 385 grain FINISHED arrow, I get a fairly quiet, 265fps (which gives me a top pin that is set at 25 yards). Which allows me to hold at the bottom third inside 17 yards, and middle body at 26-30 yards which allows for deer drop.
Listen, there is NO "PLAN B" for center punching the top BALL of a humerus in a large, mature whitetail with a dressed weight over 180. Especially standing at 25 plus yards. I don't care how heavy your finished arrow is. Blowing through a shoulder usually means blowing through the wide, flat part of the scapula. Not really thick bone!
Don't kid yourself.
And ANY decent set up, expandable or no, will pass clean through the scapula of almost any whitetail inside 20 yards as long as you don't hit the scapular crest. And then, ALL bets are off.
So I chose a shoulder (mine), distance, forgiving set up that is accurate, quiet, and deadly.
Heavy set ups work well too, but past 20 yards most bowhunters fall apart on quick distance judging while under pressure. And an error in distance judging of 3 yards at 30 yards is really severe for bows with bigger pin gaps.
I now and have for the last 3 season (60 bow kills), used Magnus Stingers, Buzzcuts, and Black Hornets.There is no doubt, Magnus has the BEST customer service available with the best product I have ever used. ESPECIALLY when you couple them with the stay sharp sharpening system!
Honestly if I didn't use Magnus it would be crazy expensive to bow hunt deer for me!
Shoot, find, re-sharpen OR replace...FREE
BTW...anyone can say, :"I've killed dozens or hundreds of deer with my bow, few can back it up!
I'm not claiming to be the best bowhunter, but I have killed 366 whitetails with a bow and recorded loads of data.
Actually I am claiming to be an expert on KILLING, not hunting, whitetails with a bow and arrow. Meaning where to put the arrow, how alert the deer is before the shot (reaction time/aim point), where to aim when the deer is standing at any angle to best affect a lethal outcome, how to read the sound of the hit, the sign on the arrow especially smell, appropriate wait times before trailing/grid search begins, and of course interpreting blood.
Also keep this in mind...my average shot for 366 bow kills=19 yards
deadliest shot=kidneys
Longest=52 yds
closest=UNDER my stand
As long as you have at least 40lbs KE you should be good.
Also remember this. People talk about a "Plan B" in reference to shooting a single bevel bone splitting set up. Makes me laugh.
There's a WHOLE lot more "Plan B" gut area where you really NEED the largest and sharpest broadhead available. But those frequently divert in impact. Especially on ribs but also on angled shots that divert in opening. So agin...pros and cons.
Honestly...here is what you need.
1-ACCURACY
2-a poundage you can easily pull back while sitting down drawing straight between your knees, full winter clothing.
3-ACCURACY
4-as flat shooting a set up as you can shoot ACCURATELY with the least noise.
5-Super sharp/ACCURATE broadhead.
Hope this helps.
A lot of guys like to tinker. I'm one of them.
But if you really care about the truth about light vs. heavy arrow set ups...I guess you need to know the "credentials" of the person typing this page.
I am a serious whitetail deer BOWhunter. I hunt mostly Southeast Tennessee. Almost all public land that has heavy pressured (educated, spooky, wary, mature) string dropping whitetail.
I am surrounded (in my circle of friends) by serious bowhunters who do the same.
WE have collectively killed LITERALLY THOUSANDS, I mean THOUSANDS of whitetails. Over HALF by arrow. I have been involved with MANY of these friends bow set ups and often am involved with blood trailing decisions, if not physically there.
I have pictures and in may cases, videos, of ALL of my bow kills which as of the end of last 23-24 season, now totals 366 whitetail deer bow kills. And 34 gun kills. Plus 1 xbow kill.
All 366 bow kills were a compound bow. I have killed one deer with a bow but it is not included in my bow kill total.
I killed 21 whitetails last season. All vertical bow. (also 4 hogs)
I have ALL of my kill tags. Except the very first (my first deer) ,which was a bow kill, in 1981 at Arnold Air Force base in 1981.
I killed all these deer (because I don't "harvest" squirrels, fish, or any other living creatures that I consume).
I record STOOOPID amounts of data for each kill.
Including, but not limited to,
DATE
TIME OF DAY
MALE/FEMALE
NUMBER OF POINTS
DRESSED WEIGHT
WEAPON USED
DISTANCE OF SHOT
DISTANCE TO RECOVERY
ORGAN AFFECTED
WEATHER/TEMP
KILL TAG NUMBER
LOCATION OF KILL
There are countless videos documenting wound channels of almost every kill.
I have shot 600 + grain arrows tipped with a Rocky Mountain Supreme 150 grain 1.5 " fixed.
Killed several deer with them. Worked well. Slow as molasses in winter.
I've shot every kind of broadhead (type) available.
Fixed
Mechanical
Cheap/expensive
Cut on contact
Chisel tip
single bevil
2 blade
5 blade
spinning (Razorback 5)
Forward deploy
Rearward deploy
Dull
Sharp
SCARY sharp (IMMENSELY BEST)
1 piece
replaceable blade
And on and on...
I've shot light, fast and loud (High Country Safari with an over draw on 2213 aluminums. Sounded like a 22 pistol going off) OLD technology.
And heavy, quiet and slow. Jennings round wheel 46"? OLD technology. Very quiet, forgiving, slow, accurate.
I feel EXTREMELYconfident in making the following statement...
I'm certain I have either put an arrow through, or been on the blood trail of, every conceivable bow shot deer imaginable.
And many of these bow shot deer...MANY times.
I counsel MANY bowhunters every bow season concerning their hits.
So here is what my opinion is concerning light vs heavy arrow:
Like Ski said...if you don't make the right shot, you are probably gonna have problems (paraphrased).
Accuracy is KING!
After all, if you don't hit the target at all...
The NUMBER ONE reason why most bowhunters miss the bullseye (spelled killing shot) is because they do not put the pin in the correct place that corresponds with the distance.
In a perfect world...there would be no arch in archery. But there is.
Unlike rifles that shoot relatively FLAT at ranges inside 100 yards (common in the South), bows drop dramatically at distance.
So there has to be a balance between speed, noise, and most importantly...ACCURACY!
FOR ME, (not necessarily everyone), if I am at full draw on a P/Y buck at 10 yards, that looks up at me and BOLTS to 34 yards (really happened), I want to know I can make a slight adjustment on my pin position, really quick by holding a tad higher, and make the shot.
The yardage is not nearly as critical at 265fps as say 230 fps.
And my bow is lower in draw weight than it used to be. At 60 pounds and a 385 grain FINISHED arrow, I get a fairly quiet, 265fps (which gives me a top pin that is set at 25 yards). Which allows me to hold at the bottom third inside 17 yards, and middle body at 26-30 yards which allows for deer drop.
Listen, there is NO "PLAN B" for center punching the top BALL of a humerus in a large, mature whitetail with a dressed weight over 180. Especially standing at 25 plus yards. I don't care how heavy your finished arrow is. Blowing through a shoulder usually means blowing through the wide, flat part of the scapula. Not really thick bone!
Don't kid yourself.
And ANY decent set up, expandable or no, will pass clean through the scapula of almost any whitetail inside 20 yards as long as you don't hit the scapular crest. And then, ALL bets are off.
So I chose a shoulder (mine), distance, forgiving set up that is accurate, quiet, and deadly.
Heavy set ups work well too, but past 20 yards most bowhunters fall apart on quick distance judging while under pressure. And an error in distance judging of 3 yards at 30 yards is really severe for bows with bigger pin gaps.
I now and have for the last 3 season (60 bow kills), used Magnus Stingers, Buzzcuts, and Black Hornets.There is no doubt, Magnus has the BEST customer service available with the best product I have ever used. ESPECIALLY when you couple them with the stay sharp sharpening system!
Honestly if I didn't use Magnus it would be crazy expensive to bow hunt deer for me!
Shoot, find, re-sharpen OR replace...FREE
BTW...anyone can say, :"I've killed dozens or hundreds of deer with my bow, few can back it up!
I'm not claiming to be the best bowhunter, but I have killed 366 whitetails with a bow and recorded loads of data.
Actually I am claiming to be an expert on KILLING, not hunting, whitetails with a bow and arrow. Meaning where to put the arrow, how alert the deer is before the shot (reaction time/aim point), where to aim when the deer is standing at any angle to best affect a lethal outcome, how to read the sound of the hit, the sign on the arrow especially smell, appropriate wait times before trailing/grid search begins, and of course interpreting blood.
Also keep this in mind...my average shot for 366 bow kills=19 yards
deadliest shot=kidneys
Longest=52 yds
closest=UNDER my stand
As long as you have at least 40lbs KE you should be good.
Also remember this. People talk about a "Plan B" in reference to shooting a single bevel bone splitting set up. Makes me laugh.
There's a WHOLE lot more "Plan B" gut area where you really NEED the largest and sharpest broadhead available. But those frequently divert in impact. Especially on ribs but also on angled shots that divert in opening. So agin...pros and cons.
Honestly...here is what you need.
1-ACCURACY
2-a poundage you can easily pull back while sitting down drawing straight between your knees, full winter clothing.
3-ACCURACY
4-as flat shooting a set up as you can shoot ACCURATELY with the least noise.
5-Super sharp/ACCURATE broadhead.
Hope this helps.
ImThere
Well-Known Member
I shoot Easton axis micro 27" long with 100 grain mechanicals. I have pass through 99.9% of the time. Not sure there is a need to fling heavy arrows at a white tailed deer.
TNDeerGuy
Well-Known Member
Millions of deer have died with an arrow setup in the ballpark of yours. Unless you aren't personally confident in it, then change but that would be the only way I would change—I certainly wouldn't do it for any other reason.
Joe2Kool
Well-Known Member
That's a lot of bow-killing experience. WAY more than me.
Questions for you, after all the success, any particular setup you've found that works best?
What setup are you shooting now? Specifically draw weight, total arrow finished weight and speed?
Thanks.
Joe2Kool,
Sorry it took so long to get back.
Great questions.
1-any particular set up that works best?
Everyone is different. Arm length, strength, eyesight, BALANCE, ability to judge distance, and on and on. So there is not any answer that ANYONE can give that works for everyone. It's mostly trial and error.
Last season I killed 10 deer with a brand new 34" Bowtec SS 34 (1200.00ish). 60 pound draw.
About 2 pounds (finished, rigged out) heavier than the Bowtec Icon/Zion (600.00ish) that I used for the last 11 deer I killed (plus 4 hogs) for the last half of 2023-24 season. Also 60 pound draw.
Both bows were super tuned by Doc at Harvest Archery. They are super accurate, very forgiving, relatively quiet, and I have great confidence in what I can do with them. Even though I got the SS 34 two weeks before the season opener.
And I am on my 3rd bowtec Icon now rebranded as a Bowtec Zion.
I really like the Montana Black Gold sight. I hunted out West for a few years and needed a floater pin but didn't want to give up my 3 pin sight. My bows are set up to shoot about 260 fps. That seems to be my sweet spot.
My sight window tends to get a bit cluttered with more than 3 pins. So the MBG Ascent which has a bottom pin floater works well for me.
At 260 fps my pins are set at 25/35/45. This allows me quick yardage changes while trying to stay on moving targets.
I shoot a QAD ultra.
Scott release index trigger. Itty bitty Goose and a few other index Scott releases. I like a hard trigger not a hair trigger.
Gold Tip pro hunter/Blazer Vanes x 3 (2 degree offset) tipped with Magnus Black Hornet or Serazor 4 blade 100 grain. Total finished arrow weight is 380 grains.
not a lighted nock because they can and WILL spook off a second shot.
Bohning 5 arrow quiver with matching quiver mount on all of my stands.
D loop
HUGE peep for low light and a bright sight ring to center in peep.
S coil stabilizer-CHEAP.
I've shot arrows completely through scapulas of several deer weighing in excess on 240 pounds.
Full penetration on an 800 pound elk (not complete pass through as well as a 500 pound Cow elk.
Penetration is rarely the problem with bowhunters. Accuracy is!!!
