yet another ccw question

[RUGER]

Ok I saw this on another site and it baffles me.
Basically it says if someone sees your concealed weapon and calls the police you WILL be arrested and charged with a crime.
If this is true, WHAT GOOD is a CC permit then ?
Am I missing something here??
How could you be arrested and charged with a crime if you have a permit?
I ain't talking about waving it around, I mean just like it says, your shirt blows open or something and someone just sees it in your belt or whatever.



4. DISPLAY YOUR WEAPON, GO TO JAIL.

You should expect to be arrested by police at gunpoint, and be charged with a crime anytime your concealed handgun is seen by another citizen in public, regardless of how unintentional, innocent, or justified the situation might seem.

Choose a method of carry that reliably keeps your gun hidden from public view at all times. You have no control over how a stranger will react to seeing (or learning about) your concealed weapon. He of she might become alarmed and report you as a "man or woman with a gun". Depending on his or her feelings about firearms, this person might maliciously embellish their story in an attempt to have your gun seized by police or in order to get you arrested. Even though your jacket only blew open for a moment, giving a brief glimpse of your gun, that person may tell the police that you were waving it around like a homicidal maniac. An alarmed citizen who reports a "man or woman with a gun" is going to be a lot more credible to police than you are when you are stopped because you match the "suspect's" description and you are found to have a concealed handgun in your possession. Before you deliberately expose your gun in public, ask yourself "is this worth going to jail for?" The only time this question should warrant a "yes" response is when an adversary has at least both the ABILITY and INTENT and is actively seeking the OPPORTUNITY to do you great harm.

 

[Anonymous]

TN's licensure is that of a "Handgun Carry Permit". There is no obligation to conceal. Although not recommended by most, Open Carry is still legal in TN. You CANNOT be charged with a crime for open carrying (with a permit). There is also a state preemption law, meaning that local juristictions cannot impose more stringent laws on handgun carrying. That way, you don't have to worry about legality from one township to another. From Bristol to Memphis, you can openly carry WITH A PERMIT all day long, so long as you're not in a prohibited location.

It all depends on the state you're in....some states allow open carry without a permit, some prohibit it explicitly.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

You CANNOT be charged with a crime for open carrying (with a permit).

From Bristol to Memphis, you can openly carry WITH A PERMIT all day long, so long as you're not in a prohibited location.

You could be charged with creating mass histeria/riot because of people seeing your weapon and panicing.
With reasonalbe precaution and consideration of the environment your in, this shouldn't be a problem (typically). This would be the case in places like Wal-Mart or someplace where people could make a big deal out of it. In most cases management might just ask you to leave so that no one gets excited. But if your within the law to carry there, you make the call to stay or leave. LEO's might be called and help you decide though. I could try to dig up the specifics and post later if anyone wishes.

You are very correct on your last part.

 

[Trapper John]

In this state, with a permit, you can open carry all day. You won't be arrested and charged for that. You can be arrested for creating panic if a bunch of bozos freak out because of a guy with a gun in his pants.

Now let's be realistic. I've been "caught" about 3 times on accident. Once by a police officer, once by a guy at a gas station, and once by a random lady at Wal-Mart. The officer looked at my permit, grinned, said be safe and that was it. The guy simply said, "You're showing" and walked off. The lady did a double take then said nothing.

It's always better to keep your weapon concealed but chances are, as long as you're not in a prohibited area, it's just not going to be that huge of a deal. More often than not they may simply just ask you to leave. In this case, no matter how wrong you know they are, get the heck out! Don't make a scene, don't make them call the police, just leave and then complain to the owner/management later. It's not worth being shot over because if they end up calling the police all the dispatcher is going to hear is, "Man with a gun" and that's all they'll relay to the responding officers. And you know how they're going to respond to that.

 

[Anonymous]

You CANNOT be charged with a crime for open carrying (with a permit).

From Bristol to Memphis, you can openly carry WITH A PERMIT all day long, so long as you're not in a prohibited location.

You could be charged with creating mass histeria/riot because of people seeing your weapon and panicing.
With reasonalbe precaution and consideration of the environment your in, this shouldn't be a problem (typically). This would be the case in places like Wal-Mart or someplace where people could make a big deal out of it. In most cases management might just ask you to leave so that no one gets excited. But if your within the law to carry there, you make the call to stay or leave. LEO's might be called and help you decide though. I could try to dig up the specifics and post later if anyone wishes.

You are very correct on your last part.

That "mass hysteria" crap is a tough one to prosecute. For one, you'd have a hard time finding a DA in TN that will actually go that far. You cannot be held responsible for the actions of the idiot masses, unless you do something drastic to instigate them. For the most part, it's a tactic of the rabid anti-gunners to scare you from carrying. Walking into the Walmart with a gun on your hip is much different than organizing a "mob" of sorts to go armed for the purpose of intimidating someone.

By the way, the only time that "mass hysteria" clause is ever brought up is in states such as NC that don't prohibit, nor allow, open carry. There are no benchmark court cases to establish the legality of open carry. In states like that, they say you can be charged with "inciting hysteria" or something, because open carry isn't outright legal.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

I was just stating what could be possible, the chances of it happening may infact be pretty slim, but a fellow has to be aware none the less.

I try to CC most of the time anyway just for the sake of not being a thugs potential first target since I am actually carrying a weapon.

 

[RUGER]

This stuff is interesting.

GJ, I would suspect that having a weapon would make you a thugs LAST target.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

ALL that just depends on how desperate that thug is when you cross aths with him.

Quite the contrary!! If a thug notices you have a weapon, he might say to himself: I need to get that guy FIRST since he has a weapon and could harm me. So you will be his first target, then if he had a knife he now has YOUR gun to use in his crime; or he had a gun to begin with and shoots you, takes your gun, and now has 2 guns to shoot at other people with!!

Or if he doesn't have the balls to carry on with his crime says: I should wait till a better time, that guy has a gun, he could be a LEO, I might just get killed and then he decides to just leave the area.

 

[TX300mag]

The thing to keep in mind is that you may be well within the law carrying somewhere, but if a business or property owner askes you to leave over carrying a gun you have to. Or be charged with trespassing.

 

[Encore Eye Candy]

Please clarify: Handgun on school property, I know you cannot carry but if you lock it in your car is still legal, like glove compartment?????? Please again clarify.

 

[Deerhunter]

My cc instructer said you could pick up or drop off kids at school as long as you didnt touch the weapon.

 

[big 8s in Weakley county]

Automobile carry:
Firearms must be unloaded and in plain view or secured in commercial gun cases anywhere in the vehicle.



What does that mean you cant have loaded pistol in your car on you driving down the road

 

[Encore Eye Candy]

In plain view, my understanding it had to be out of site, Like glove compartment or under seat. Might start a "panic" if in plain site!!!!!!

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

My cc instructer said you could pick up or drop off kids at school as long as you didnt touch the weapon.

It cannot leave your vehicle.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Automobile carry:
Firearms must be unloaded and in plain view or secured in commercial gun cases anywhere in the vehicle.

What does that mean you cant have loaded pistol in your car on you driving down the road

I'm thinking that is for a person that DOES NOT have a HCP. If you have a valid HCP, you can carry it loaded on your person at all times anywhere it's legal to carry.

 

[Gravey]

Automobile carry:
Firearms must be unloaded and in plain view or secured in commercial gun cases anywhere in the vehicle.

What does that mean you cant have loaded pistol in your car on you driving down the road

I'm thinking that is for a person that DOES NOT have a HCP. If you have a valid HCP, you can carry it loaded on your person at all times anywhere it's legal to carry.

My understanding is you can't have it on school property even if you have the HCP. They may have relaxed it a bit where it can be in your vehicle but I know you can't walk into a school with it period.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Here code copied fron the Tn. Dept. Safety Codes:

(c) (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution. It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.

 

[Hatchee]

We dealt with one guy that had the best idea that I've heard of yet.
I'm an area supervisor for our police department.
One of my guys makes a traffic stop and the driver shows his drivers license and permit, tells the officer he's armed, then asks the officer "What do you want me to do?"
The cop was new and kinda spazzed out, so rather than just writing the guy for the traffic infraction, he gets him outta the car, pats him down and starts searching the car.
The driver remained calm and requested a supervisor.
I show up and my rookie is jacked up because the driver had a loaded pistol in a holster AND a loded pistol in the glove box.
I explained to the rookie that the driver is well within his rights and that he should probably apologize to the driver, let him be on his way and lets do something more productive that won't get us sued!!
THEN the rookie say "He told me he was going to pick up his daughter at school." Again I explain to the rookie that the driver is well within his rights as long as he stays in the car or leaves the weapon in the car if he gets out.
To make a long story not quite so long; the driver was the coolest customer I've ever dealt with. He never got flustered and once I got the rookie to apologize to him, he did the coolest thing. He said "Sarge, I've got something I'd like to give your officer, it's in the glove box." The guy pulls out a photocopy of the TCA code for CCW and GIVES IT TO THE KID!!

Never assume a cop knows the law. When in doubt, remain calm and request a supervisor.
But, having a copy of the code will remove all doubt.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Very good read, good to see there are still some real world guys (LEO's & Civilians) still out there in the community. Great job you did to "educate" that rookie, sounds like both you gentleman were very tolerant and professional of the rookie's "mistake". I know you guys have to deal with alot of bad things/people out there everyday. If the know-it-all government would just back the LEO's and law abiding permit, carrying citizens, we could take a big bite out of crime. Give us a real judicial system with real punishments and we could possibly rid this country of serious crimes.

 

[Hatchee]

This stuff is interesting.

GJ, I would suspect that having a weapon would make you a thugs LAST target.

TARGET/THREAT ASSESSMENT. Thugs do it too. ALWAYS assume you are the primary target.
A thug could notice that you're carrying and decide to go somewhere else to commit their crime
OR
A thug could notice that your carrying and decide to pop you first
Who knows what a thug will do? BE READY

 

[RUGER]

Hatchee,
VERY true statement and very wise.
BE READY and BE AWARE OF YOUR SURROUNDINGS !
My wife about freaked one time when I went into the post office late at night and there was a guy in there that gave me that "I am up to no good" feeling.
I had my keys in my hand and while walking towards the door I situated the key to her car, an Altima, in a position where if needed I could rest it against the palm of my hand and drive it into the dudes temple. The key is like 4 dang inches long !
I told her if you are one step ahead of a thug you MIGHT come out of it alive.
Same dude was arrested two nights later for kicking in the door of an elderly couple 3 houses down from my in-laws by the way.



Very cool story about the dude and rookie too.
Respect and calm, the best two things you can do / present when dealing with any law enforcement officer.


Yeah, except the one I told to stick his gun up his arse.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Keep those keys handy Ruger, no guns allowed in the post office :grin:

 

[Anonymous]

Please clarify: Handgun on school property, I know you cannot carry but if you lock it in your car is still legal, like glove compartment?????? Please again clarify.

NOT ON THE PROPERTY AT ALL.

The ONLY exception to this rule is if you're dropping off or picking up, or otherwise doing something where you stay in your car and are only on premises for a short amount of time. Just look at the kids who've been expelled for having ammo or an unloaded rifle in the truck.

 

[Anonymous]

Keep those keys handy Ruger, no guns allowed in the post office :grin:

I don't think that's "technically" correct. If I remember correctly, the USPS is actually one of those gov't sponsored enterprises (GSE's) sort of like Freddy or Fannie. So I don't think it bears the same weight as say, a federal building. Most post offices I've seen have a "Gunbuster" sign, but not the correctly worded sign as mandated by TN law. And I was apparently wrong about the flat-out ban on school guns. I thought you couldn't have one at all on the property. Thanks for clearing that one up.

 

[Gravey]

Here code copied fron the Tn. Dept. Safety Codes:

(c) (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution. It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.

That's good to know that I won't be breaking the law when dropping off or picking my kids up (which rarely happens). I always thought that was stupid that it couldn't be in your vehicle.

Hatchee...Good story about the rookie. I got pulled over one time and the officer was relatively new as I found out later. When he came to window I handed him my license and HCP and told him I had one loaded, where it was, and did he want to see it. He just said "naw that's okay but thanks for telling me" and I thought that was cool right up until he came back with my ticket.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Keep those keys handy Ruger, no guns allowed in the post office :grin:

I don't think that's "technically" correct. If I remember correctly, the USPS is actually one of those gov't sponsored enterprises (GSE's) sort of like Freddy or Fannie. So I don't think it bears the same weight as say, a federal building. Most post offices I've seen have a "Gunbuster" sign, but not the correctly worded sign as mandated by TN law. And I was apparently wrong about the flat-out ban on school guns. I thought you couldn't have one at all on the property. Thanks for clearing that one up.

No problem, that's why places like this are so helpful.... I am 99% positive the post office is a NO FIREARMS place, but I will research it and post my results...... Here is what I found:

From Handgunlaw.us FAQ page, Question 4

#4 Question:

Can I legally carry in the Post Office?
Answer: No

Title 39 - Postal Service
Chapter I - United States Postal Service
Subchapter D - Organization and Administration
Part 232 - Conduct on Postal Property
232.1 - Conduct on Postal Property.

Paragraph L
(l) Weapons and explosives. No person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.

 

[ferg]

Short answer ruger - no. not in tn.

ferg.....

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

It all just depends on whether you want to be prepared for a threat or not... I like having the odds in my favor as much as possible... :grin: