I haven't hunted in 5 or 6 years until this year. I picked up a muzzleloader off of a buddy's dad for pretty cheap. It shoots great with hordady xtp. Was set at about 1 inch high at 50 yards. I shot a doe this evening at about 80 yards and made a good shot. When the smoke settled she was gone. I thought I heard her crash but I still went to search for blood. I looked for about 20 or so mins and never found the first drop. I walked the edge of the woods (shot her in a field) and seen her white belly. She only went about 50 yards total. She never bleed the first drop except where I found her. I was shooting 100 grounds of triple 7 with a hornady xtp bullet. I've had great success with that bullet and powder combination in the past. Wonder why I never found the first drop of blood?
Unusual experience with hornady xtp
- Thread starter Daniel n
- Start date
Exit wound? If I was guessing the bullet that was designed for a pistol went in and expanded rapidly, leaving no exit wound. Lots of internal bleeding and no blood pumping out
deerhunter10
Well-Known Member
I've shot many different bullets with ml, and I've seen all of them not leave hardly a blood trail. Not unusual. With that being said I've had the best luck with Hornady or tc Shockwaves but even both of them I've seen deer with little to no blood. Most of the time it is because of no exit wound but my father in law shot a 7 point about 5 years ago that didn't bleed a drop and it went through.
The higher up you shoot the longer it takes to get blood, down lower = faster blood trail. then you can get organs blocking holes that don't help, I really like that bullet and have killed several with it
Witnessed same thing this morning with Barnes. Clear pass through, found deer 60-70 yds away. Double lung, found only blood within 5 yds of deer. Not very uncommon with muzzleloader although I can't quite understand it
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- Dec 5, 2014
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Those XTP's are my favorite MZ bullet.
I think the lower velocity of MZ has a negative effect on blood trails.
I think the lower velocity of MZ has a negative effect on blood trails.
GOODWIN
Well-Known Member
Not unusual. Sounds like it worked well.
Like others have said it's not unusual for a mz. I shoot 250 grain hornady SST or tc shockwaves (same bullets basically). Have shot a few deer and fell within 50 yards with no blood trail.
oldmanelrod
Well-Known Member
I shoot the Hornady SST with 240/250 grain and 100 grains of triple 7 pellets. Seldom get a shoot thru and what you wrote about "designed for a pistol…expanded rapidly, leaving no exit wounds" makes a lot of sense to me. The load kills them for me and I do get blood trails but seldom get pass through.
Harold Money jr
Well-Known Member
I've shot XTP's from 180gr-300gr. My all time favorite muzzleloader and hunting pistol bullet. (For me) the 180grs and the 200grs didn't exit the majority of the time. The deer were dead within 30yards but, didn't exit most times had good blood, sometimes did not. The deer were dead nonetheless. I went to 240's and have always had pass throughs, the same thing 30yards and dead deer with a much better blood trail. I've shot 3-4 with the 300's and they are dead a bit sooner. I did lose a buck a couple years ago after I shot him through the lungs (actually found pieces of lung at the shot site. Joe Biden would have thought it had been shot with a 9mm). I lost sight of the deer when I had to grab the stand to keep from falling out during the recoil. Awesome blood for 30' then total stop. I know that's extremely unusual and will keep using them. I love a hole in and out.
My favorite bullets with my In-Line, 44 mag rifle, and .444 Marlin. Usually great blood trails with all of them.
I've had your experience with different makes of bullets, as well as the XTP. It's not the norm for sure.
I've had your experience with different makes of bullets, as well as the XTP. It's not the norm for sure.
I don't know what it is about muzzleloaders, but I have shot a lot of deer with them using a lot of different bullets. You need a complete pass thru to get a good blood trail. I shot a buck one morning at 25 yards with 100 grains of 777 and a TC shockwave. Double lung, complete pass thru! I watched him cover 125 yards before he went into the woods. I waited 30 minutes and went looking for blood. When I found him, I back tracked and found blood for about 50 yards going back. It still amazes me how tough deer are and how far they can run on a lethal shot, especially with a muzzleloader!
I've shot 240 grain XTP's out of my muzzleloader forever with great success. They don't typically bleed much for about 50 yards but once it starts it's normally easy to follow if they're not dead before going that far. I've killed 2 bucks the past 2 years and both ran 75-100 yards and no blood until around the 50 yard mark.
I use that bullet sabot combo and have had many outstanding, consistent, quick kills and easy tracks.. Rare to not have pass through and if no pass through usually a hard quartering shot that ended up under skin after breaking far shoulder/bone.
Looks like a nice double lung shot, assuming a level shot and probably with complete pass through but just didn't line up a spraying vein/artery.
Just my opinion but too many folks preach the high chest 300 mag (fast bullet) drop in tracks shot which again, in my opinion, makes for harder tracking with muzzleloader or trad bow or smaller mechanicals on medium fast bow/crossbow...
I high
shoot with muzzleloader or bow and usually have spray by step 3 to 5. (I think next heart beat.) Higher than heart lung connection shot takes longer as said above or if deer heads down hill sometimes the blood flow fill the cavity with little "blow out".
I use 325 FTX or 300 SST and always get great blood trails
this is the reason I chose to shoot a smokeless...tired of poor blood trails and finding deer dead.
I guess I'm not the only one. I just found it unusual. The bullet did pass through and I'm happy I found it and kept looking.
I shot a buck yesterday that did the same thing. Zero blood except where he coughed some up about 5 feet from where he died.
My shot was a touch high. Zero blood trail but when I gutted the deer his cavity inside the diaphragm had a massive amount of blood in it.
250 grain Barnes.
My shot was a touch high. Zero blood trail but when I gutted the deer his cavity inside the diaphragm had a massive amount of blood in it.
250 grain Barnes.
This post is useless without pics. Come on now! You know better.
Bullet performance....shot placement....exit wound location....size of the exit wound...all play a part in blood trails. I know many folks use them but personally, I never cared much for the XTP as a muzzleloader bullet. Best blood trails I've ever had with a muzzleloader was several years back when I was shooting a 410 gr flat point conical with 80-85 gr of Triple 7 out of an older model CVA Optima. That load never failed to give an exit wound and it produced some pretty large holes considering it was a flat point and not a hollow point. Broke my heart when Hornady quit making that weight in their conical line. Never could get the 385 gr ones to shoot near as well.
Bone Collector
Well-Known Member
This has happened to me when I started shooting ML at them. Started with Powerbelts, went to Hornady SSTs, then landed on TC Shockwaves. Had several incidents with the first two where I had little to no blood to trail. What I figured out was most of those bullets do not have a bonded core, so if you have too much powder or maybe just the way the bullet hits, it can explode, thus no exit wound and no blood trail. In thick stuff this can lead to lost deer. The TCs worked better but I made sure I bought bonded core bullets, which are more expensive.
I ultimately switched to Barnes expanders and honestly there isn't a huge cost difference vs. the TC bonded bullets, but those things are lethal. I've only shot a couple of deer with them as I have really stopped shooting does on my main spots, and I have shot a coyote too. The 2 deer went less than 50 yds and the coyote was down right there. Blood trails were present on both the deer I shot, but I didn't need them.
I ultimately switched to Barnes expanders and honestly there isn't a huge cost difference vs. the TC bonded bullets, but those things are lethal. I've only shot a couple of deer with them as I have really stopped shooting does on my main spots, and I have shot a coyote too. The 2 deer went less than 50 yds and the coyote was down right there. Blood trails were present on both the deer I shot, but I didn't need them.
bullets do weird stuff sometimes. i did some tests years ago with different muzzle loader bullets in 250 gr and 100gr of 777. i remember one big doe i hit and after hitting the high shoulder it made a 90 degree turn and embedded in the femur.
https://www.tndeer.com/threads/shockwave-bonded-the-saga-continues-pics.77589/
https://www.tndeer.com/threads/shockwave-bonded-the-saga-continues-pics.77589/
FLTENNHUNTER1
Well-Known Member
All good comments. I'll just add many things will drain very slowly, if at all, without a vent.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Not unusual for today's modern MZ bullets. But in the past, with hard maxi-ball and Maxi-hunter conicals, they always left amazing blood trails. If those old conicals weren't so hard to load, I would still use them.
megalomaniac
Well-Known Member
Its 100% about impact velocities... the heavy bullets are more likely to pass through because they leave the barrel at a lower velocity, and lower impact velocity, so they deform less travelling through tissue.
If you arent getting pass-through with the lighter bullets, simply lower your powder charge, or shoot deer further away.
If you arent getting pass-through with the lighter bullets, simply lower your powder charge, or shoot deer further away.
Use the heaviest bullet your MZ will accurately shoot.
I use the Barnes TEZ in 250 grain, with 100 grains of Blackhorn, they blow thru the largest deer.
I've never had a failure to pass thru with this.
Also, I'd second what BSK said--the best I ever had in terms of deer killing combo was the old Hawken and a heavy maxi-ball. Hit like a freight train.
And as hard to load as a freight train down the barrels of those old Hawkens with the older powders.
I use the Barnes TEZ in 250 grain, with 100 grains of Blackhorn, they blow thru the largest deer.
I've never had a failure to pass thru with this.
Also, I'd second what BSK said--the best I ever had in terms of deer killing combo was the old Hawken and a heavy maxi-ball. Hit like a freight train.
And as hard to load as a freight train down the barrels of those old Hawkens with the older powders.
I've had the same experience with the 240gr XTP out of my ML. I've killed every deer I've shot with it, but it leaves zero blood trails. They shoot very well out of both of my MLs, but I switched to Barnes. I've had just as good accuracy and now my first blood trails using the 250gr T-EZ and the 250gr Expanders. I switched because I shot a big buck on the mountain with the XTP and had the hardest time finding him due to it being thick and steep in there. He only ran 80 yards, but that can be a long ways when you have to grid search in a dense area.
Winchester
Well-Known Member
Every shot is different could be a myriad of reasons
