Smokeless So riddle me this frustration...........

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Smokeless

TN Larry

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Baxter, Tennessee
I have a 45/70 Encore conversion and shooting 60 gr of H4198 and 195 BE. I think that I've been shooting this since 2013 without having to knurl or anything like that. Anyways, I shot my son's 7mm-08 this past Sunday before church to make sure it was on. I had a few extra minutes so decided to get the muzzleloaders out to shoot. They were still loaded from last year. I got mine, made sure the bullet was still seated good, and fired. I missed the entire target. Scratching my head, I couldn't figure out what happened. I then remembered that the last time I was out with it that I shot a buck at a fast walk after a doe and gut shot him. He stopped, I reloaded as fast as I could and then dropped him. I then reloaded again so the barrel had to be super hot and assumed that I had melted the sabot on the reload which I did one time before.

So fast forward to this afternoon, I decided to shoot again. Loaded up with powder premeasured from last year, fired, and missed the target again. This is a big target, and at that point, I am super, super frustrated. So, I moved the target to about 40 yards and made sure all my screws were tight on my scope mounts which they were. I waited a few minutes to let the barrel cool, loaded back with another load of powder from last year and fired again. I shot about 1" high and perfect left and right. Ok, that's great but not sure how to explain the target miss. Maybe still some plastic in the barrel, ?????

So, I had to go downstairs and measure some more powder. When I came back out, it was getting dark, and I could barely see. I moved the target back to 100 yards and fired again. I hit about 2" high and 2" left. I could have pulled the left as I couldn't see the target good. At that point, I was just hoping to hit somewhere close to the center of the target. I'm assuming right now that shot was me.

So, how did I miss the entire target??? Any ideas as I am stumped??? I don't think cleaning could throw it off that much. It just makes me lose confidence in a gun that has historical shot very well and killed several deer with. I will shoot a 3 shot group here in a day or two just to see what it does. I guess that if it shoots a good 3 shot group that I write it off as something crazy that I can't explain. I don't like that but can't fix it if it don't stay broke.
 
Sounds like you have some of the bad Barnes 195's. The bottom corner radius is not right which causes sabot failure. They corrected the issue after a while. I have a few packs of the good ones that I will never use. If you are interested in buying them cheap just let me know.
 
jlanecr500":2irl612r said:
Sounds like you have some of the bad Barnes 195's. The bottom corner radius is not right which causes sabot failure. They corrected the issue after a while. I have a few packs of the good ones that I will never use. If you are interested in buying them cheap just let me know.

Thanks! This went through my mind as these are some that I bought last year. I thought they were supposed to be good though as I came across this when purchasing last year. How do you tell what are good or bad? PM sent on the purchase of known good ones.
 
I've been doing some research and found that thread. What I have looks bad but still not 100%, however, my confidence is not that good with them right now.

Do these look like the bad ones?
 
get a sizing die, some 250 accumax from Pittman bullets and do away with the sabot altogether, 10 years ago they were a necessity but today they are just another thing to fail. IF you still feel the need to use the sabot Kyle sells a .40 225 Accumax that will solve your problems
 
Just fyi. My cva scout v2 shot the 195be awesome for about 20 shots and then everything went south. I tried buying new batches, knurling, not knurling, imr 4198, h4198, different sabots, cleaning like crazy and so on. Nothing would work. BUT my gun will shoot 200 sst or a 250tez half inch at 100.

Jeff Fisk (goes by Bestill on Doug's) who did my conversion said he has noticed way too much inconsistency with the Barnes both dimensions and structurally.

Take it for what its worth but im staying away from the Barnes 195s and I have a few of the new improved ones i bought from Luke ill give you if you want.

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hillbill":1tz55iop said:
get a sizing die, some 250 accumax from Pittman bullets and do away with the sabot altogether, 10 years ago they were a necessity but today they are just another thing to fail. IF you still feel the need to use the sabot Kyle sells a .40 225 Accumax that will solve your problems
How does the accumax 225 .40 do at close range? Say 25-75 yards? If they do good i may try some. Thanks.

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hillbill":1qyy1zp9 said:
get a sizing die, some 250 accumax from Pittman bullets and do away with the sabot altogether, 10 years ago they were a necessity but today they are just another thing to fail. IF you still feel the need to use the sabot Kyle sells a .40 225 Accumax that will solve your problems
How does the accumax 225 .40 do at close range? Say 25-75 yards? If they do good i may try some. Thanks.

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lungpuncher1":u486xu0n said:
hillbill":u486xu0n said:
get a sizing die, some 250 accumax from Pittman bullets and do away with the sabot altogether, 10 years ago they were a necessity but today they are just another thing to fail. IF you still feel the need to use the sabot Kyle sells a .40 225 Accumax that will solve your problems
How does the accumax 225 .40 do at close range? Say 25-75 yards? If they do good i may try some. Thanks.

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We will see very soon. I have them zeroed at 200yds in my Savage Mcgowen 40 cal sabotless running at 2950 fps.

I'm sure that they will work very well saboted around 2500 fps. They shoot very well saboted or sabotless.
 
jlanecr500":ihs18egr said:
lungpuncher1":ihs18egr said:
hillbill":ihs18egr said:
get a sizing die, some 250 accumax from Pittman bullets and do away with the sabot altogether, 10 years ago they were a necessity but today they are just another thing to fail. IF you still feel the need to use the sabot Kyle sells a .40 225 Accumax that will solve your problems
How does the accumax 225 .40 do at close range? Say 25-75 yards? If they do good i may try some. Thanks.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

We will see very soon. I have them zeroed at 200yds in my Savage Mcgowen 40 cal sabotless running at 2950 fps.

I'm sure that they will work very well saboted around 2500 fps. They shoot very well saboted or sabotless.
Anyone have a clue about what my cva scout v2 45 is running with 60gr h4198 and a 200 sst?

Im guessing 2500??

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Anyone have a clue about what my cva scout v2 45 is running with 60gr h4198 and a 200 sst?

Im guessing 2500??

Your barrel minus the brake should be 23" I got 2625 out of a 24" barrel using 209 ignition.



Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk[/quote]
 
jlanecr500":s87z2wq4 said:
Anyone have a clue about what my cva scout v2 45 is running with 60gr h4198 and a 200 sst?

Im guessing 2500??

Your barrel minus the brake should be 23" I got 2625 out of a 24" barrel using 209 ignition.



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[/quote]So would i lose some being 23"?


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jlanecr500":24xmwz7p said:
Anyone have a clue about what my cva scout v2 45 is running with 60gr h4198 and a 200 sst?

Im guessing 2500??

Your barrel minus the brake should be 23" I got 2625 out of a 24" barrel using 209 ignition.



Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
[/quote]
hillbill":24xmwz7p said:
I would think 2550+ but only a guesstimate
Deer Assassin":24xmwz7p said:
2530-2550
Curiosity got me and i borrowed a buddies chronograph.

With 60gr of h4198 and a 200gr sst it shot 2640, 2637 and 2622.

Presently surprised.



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lungpuncher1":168pni5u said:
With 60gr of h4198 and a 200gr sst it shot 2640, 2637 and 2622.

Presently surprised.
Good stuff. I meant to chrono this same load in my Scout V2 yesterday evening, but I left chrono at the house.

Mine is set 2.5" high at 100, which should be dead on at 200, with an 11" drop at 300 using 2630 fps velocity and ballistic coefficient of 0.265. I have not confirmed the latter two as I rarely hunt where a 100 yard shot is an option.

Thanks for the report.
 
For some reason mine being dead on at 100 is 6.5" low at 200. Doesnt sound right with a bc of over .200

Which i only shot at 200 twice but it was consistently 6.5" low.

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