Huh? Say it ain’t so

[prstide]

Let's voluntarily gain our institution admittance into the NCAA and in doing so agree to abide by the governance/rules of the NCAA…..until they catch us cheating and then we are going to sue the NCAA while we are still a member.
Have any of you thought that the NCAA could just ban UT from participation in any NCAA sanctioned events until the lawsuit is settled? The SEC could do the same because there are rules within the conference as well. Just don't see how this ends well. Maybe I should practice being a mental gymnast like many of you are.

 

[bowhunterfanatic]

HOF Coach and evidently the most sly cheater to ever have existed in the coaching ranks. Head coach of multiple major D1 programs, numerous top ranked recruiting classes at 2 of those stops, and never so much as triggered an NCAA investigation in those 25+ years.

Above is the reality of the situation—you're entitled to your opinion though. Also, UT cheated—has now been caught multiple times—and is going to gain the coveted "Repeat Offender" status. Enjoy!

I don't understand fans like you…and I'll give you an example.

I'm a Duke basketball fan. Have been for a long time. There is 0 doubt in my mind that they used underhand recruiting tactics for years to land all the talent they landed. Yet they were never part of an NCAA investigation. There were whispers at a few points, but nothing ever came of it. Doesn't change how great they or Coach K was for a long time.

Bama was always the best at not getting caught. Nothing more nothing less. If you think Saban was landing all those classes without cheating you're just willfully ignorant. We KNOW other schools were cheating / trying to cheat. To think that ALL of those kids were still picking Bama with no under the table benefits when other schools were offering them all kinds of goodies is just naïveté at its finest. What's happening now with NIL is proof. Some kids take a lesser offer to go to a certain school, but a large majority of them are just looking for the largest payday. That didn't just start happening with the legalization of NIL.

 

[cbhunter]

W

I don't understand fans like you…and I'll give you an example.

I'm a Duke basketball fan. Have been for a long time. There is 0 doubt in my mind that they used underhand recruiting tactics for years to land all the talent they landed. Yet they were never part of an NCAA investigation. There were whispers at a few points, but nothing ever came of it. Doesn't change how great they or Coach K was for a long time.

Bama was always the best at not getting caught. Nothing more nothing less. If you think Saban was landing all those classes without cheating you're just willfully ignorant. We KNOW other schools were cheating / trying to cheat. To think that ALL of those kids were still picking Bama with no under the table benefits when other schools were offering them all kinds of goodies is just naïveté at its finest. What's happening now with NIL is proof. Some kids take a lesser offer to go to a certain school, but a large majority of them are just looking for the largest payday. That didn't just start happening with the legalization of NIL.

well said

 

[prstide]

I don't understand fans like you…and I'll give you an example.

I'm a Duke basketball fan. Have been for a long time. There is 0 doubt in my mind that they used underhand recruiting tactics for years to land all the talent they landed. Yet they were never part of an NCAA investigation. There were whispers at a few points, but nothing ever came of it. Doesn't change how great they or Coach K was for a long time.

Bama was always the best at not getting caught. Nothing more nothing less. If you think Saban was landing all those classes without cheating you're just willfully ignorant. We KNOW other schools were cheating / trying to cheat. To think that ALL of those kids were still picking Bama with no under the table benefits when other schools were offering them all kinds of goodies is just naïveté at its finest. What's happening now with NIL is proof. Some kids take a lesser offer to go to a certain school, but a large majority of them are just looking for the largest payday. That didn't just start happening with the legalization of NIL.

So do you think Coach K was involved in those schemes to land the talent he did or do you think that his ability to out coach others and consistently win + compete for championships might have made it a natural draw to some of the top talent in the country year after year because they knew it would be beneficial towards their end goal of getting to the next level given his track record of development and the constant national exposure that came with the programs' success?

I think we all know recruiting isn't and hasn't ever been free and clear of impermissible benefits in some way shape or form. Do I think players at Alabama received pay or items for being at Alabama…..yep. Do I think that Saban was involved in any of that? Absolutely not. The same way I don't believe Coach K was ever involved involved in those type shenanigans either.

Here is a fantastic data point from the standpoint of development:

 

[prstide]

You can recruit as highly as you want by buying recruits but if you can't coach em up and develop them it doesn't matter.

See: Jimbo Fisher

 

[bowhunterfanatic]

So do you think Coach K was involved in those schemes to land the talent he did or do you think that his ability to out coach others and consistently win + compete for championships might have made it a natural draw to some of the top talent in the country year after year because they knew it would be beneficial towards their end goal of getting to the next level given his track record of development and the constant national exposure that came with the programs' success?

I think we all know recruiting isn't and hasn't ever been free and clear of impermissible benefits in some way shape or form. Do I think players at Alabama received pay or items for being at Alabama…..yep. Do I think that Saban was involved in any of that? Absolutely not. The same way I don't believe Coach K was ever involved involved in those type shenanigans either.

Here is a fantastic data point from the standpoint of development:
View attachment 216997

Define involvement? Did Saban know about the impermissible benefits and allow / encourage them? Certainly. Was he paying the players himself? Of course not. I'd say the exact same thing about Coach K.

 

[prstide]

Define involvement? Did Saban know about the impermissible benefits and allow / encourage them? Certainly. Was he paying the players himself? Of course not. I'd say the exact same thing about Coach K.

Knowing about them likely after they happened I can agree with. Allowing or encouraging I don't agree.
If it happens outside the program(outside staff employed by university) it's outside the realm of jurisdiction from a coach's standpoint. A head coach's job is not to be these kids "life police". They have plenty other responsibilities to tend to.

 

[bowhunterfanatic]

Knowing about them likely after they happened I can agree with. Allowing or encouraging I don't agree.
If it happens outside the program(outside staff employed by university) it's outside the realm of jurisdiction from a coach's standpoint. A head coach's job is not to be these kids "life police". They have plenty other responsibilities to tend to.

Don't agree that he allowed it? He couldn't have fielded a competent roster otherwise. He played the hand he was dealt. I don't fault the man for it at all. Just amazes me fans are still naive enough to not think it was happening.

 

[cbhunter]

Nice try….

So do you think Coach K was involved in those schemes to land the talent he did or do you think that his ability to out coach others and consistently win + compete for championships might have made it a natural draw to some of the top talent in the country year after year because they knew it would be beneficial towards their end goal of getting to the next level given his track record of development and the constant national exposure that came with the programs' success?

I think we all know recruiting isn't and hasn't ever been free and clear of impermissible benefits in some way shape or form. Do I think players at Alabama received pay or items for being at Alabama…..yep. Do I think that Saban was involved in any of that? Absolutely not. The same way I don't believe Coach K was ever involved involved in those type shenanigans either.

Here is a fantastic data point from the standpoint of development:
View attachment 216997

Nice try….try again

 

[prstide]

Nice try….

Nice try….try again

What are you referring to? Try to bring something more than emojis and 4 word responses. Doesn't leave too much in the ways of context clues.

 

[prstide]

Don't agree that he allowed it? He couldn't have fielded a competent roster otherwise. He played the hand he was dealt. I don't fault the man for it at all. Just amazes me fans are still naive enough to not think it was happening.

If only you could've shown all these receipts you've had of improper recruiting tactics used by Saban all these years which fielded him a competent roster then it might've saved you the heartbreak of watching UT get their @$$es kicked year after year.
Let's just be honest; you don't actually know a d@mn thing but feel righteous with your assumptions. Just amazes me that the fanbase of such a bottom dwelling program over the last 2 decades suddenly thinks they've regained relevancy based off of one decent 10-win season, 2 years ago, suing the NCAA after they got caught cheating in multiple sports for the 2nd time in 4 years, and a coach retiring from a rival school that has historically beaten them regardless of who was at the helm.

 

[prstide]

What's the excuse going to be when Alabama lead by Kalen DeBoer is whipping that @$$ every year too?
Let me guess; HE'S NIL'ing TOO GOOD!! The NCAA hampered our collective.

Keep making those payroll deductions to the collective to try and climb the mountaintop VFLs!

 

[scn]

If only you could've shown all these receipts you've had of improper recruiting tactics used by Saban all these years which fielded him a competent roster then it might've saved you the heartbreak of watching UT get their @$$es kicked year after year.
Let's just be honest; you don't actually know a d@mn thing but feel righteous with your assumptions. Just amazes me that the fanbase of such a bottom dwelling program over the last 2 decades suddenly thinks they've regained relevancy based off of one decent 10-win season, 2 years ago, suing the NCAA after they got caught cheating in multiple sports for the 2nd time in 4 years, and a coach retiring from a rival school that has historically beaten them regardless of who was at the helm.

It's pretty obvious that the Vols didn't get caught cheating in multiple sports. When the governing body tries to retroactively change the rules in midstream, it certainly doesn't mean that their view was correct. You aren't violating or cheating when you are following the rules that are in place. Due to the Gump issues, TN made damn sure that they were crossing their Ts and dotting their Is in everything they did with the NIL issue. We saw some validation of that this week in federal court, and, I expect we will see more if the NCAA goes forward with their bullshyt.

The word out there is little Nicky went crying to the NCAA about TN beating him for Nico. He lost again this week.

 

[prstide]

It's pretty obvious that the Vols didn't get caught cheating in multiple sports. When the governing body tries to retroactively change the rules in midstream, it certainly doesn't mean that their view was correct. You aren't violating or cheating when you are following the rules that are in place. Due to the Gump issues, TN made damn sure that they were crossing their Ts and dotting their Is in everything they did with the NIL issue. We saw some validation of that this week in federal court, and, I expect we will see more if the NCAA goes forward with their bullshyt.

The word out there is little Nicky went crying to the NCAA about TN beating him for Nico. He lost again this week.

What did the NCAA notice of allegations say that TN did wrong regarding NIL?

 

[scn]

What did the NCAA notice of allegations say that TN did wrong regarding NIL?

Nothing, because they have never sent one.

And, if they do at this point, I fully expect TN to make bank in their lawsuit against them. TN already has likely the top lawyer in the country concerning antitrust on retainer waiting to drop the lawsuit if the NCAA is stupid enough to move forward with their shyt. It is pretty rare for this Supreme Court to agree on anything. When they vote against someone like they did the NCAA with a unanimous 9-0 vote, it should have sent the NCAA a message. Apparently they were too dumb to understand what they were being told.

 

[prstide]

Nothing, because they have never sent one.

And, if they do at this point, I fully expect TN to make bank in their lawsuit against them. TN already has likely the top lawyer in the country concerning antitrust on retainer waiting to drop the lawsuit if the NCAA is stupid enough to move forward with their shyt. It is pretty rare for this Supreme Court to agree on anything. When they vote against someone like they did the NCAA with a unanimous 9-0 vote, it should have sent the NCAA a message. Apparently they were too dumb to understand what they were being told.

Yes I agree. So what if the NOA pertains to improper recruiting tactics that have nothing to do with NIL with rules that have been on the books for decades? And to that point, why wouldn't the NCAA make the "crime" fit within those rules to prove a point?

 

[prstide]

UT is biting the hand that feeds it to some degree with this lawsuit. The NCAA could just ban them from participating in NCAA sanctioned events. It would be unprecedented but considering TN agreed to abide by the rules of the NCAA governing body but is now trying to sue the governing body over rules it originally agreed to it really doesn't seem far fetched.

 

[scn]

UT is biting the hand that feeds it to some degree with this lawsuit. The NCAA could just ban them from participating in NCAA sanctioned events. It would be unprecedented but considering TN agreed to abide by the rules of the NCAA governing body but is now trying to sue the governing body over rules it originally agreed to it really doesn't seem far fetched.

I hope they do ban them from participating. TN would own whatever few assets the NCAA has after their lawsuit.

UT agreed to abide by the actual rules of the NCAA, not some made up in midstream. Your Bama glasses are fogging up and not seeing that TN abided by all of the rules that were in place at the time. The NCAA can't go back and say, "well, gee, I wish that we had that rule a couple of years ago". Even the President of the NCAA in very public comments has said that they didn't have any NIL rules.

Had the NCAA put into rule when the court decisions opening up the NIL circus that any NIL group in a state would be considered a booster, then TN and a bunch of other schools, including your favorite, would have had to do things differently. But, that rule wasn't there, and it is next to impossible to put the toothpaste back in the tube once it it out. The NCAA is pretty well screwed as far as the NIL stuff goes. And, unfortunately, I fully expect all players to be employees of their university within the next couple of years. I don't particularly like where it is going, but, at least the playing field is being leveled a little against the ones that have openly cheated for years.

 

[volboy]

UT is biting the hand that feeds it to some degree with this lawsuit. The NCAA could just ban them from participating in NCAA sanctioned events. It would be unprecedented but considering TN agreed to abide by the rules of the NCAA governing body but is now trying to sue the governing body over rules it originally agreed to it really doesn't seem far fetched.

I guess this has to be repeated again for those that just can't understand. The University of Tennessee DID NOT sue the NCAA. The States of Tennessee and Virginia sued the NCAA. But for some on here, never let the facts get in the way of the narrative they hope to see.

 

[prstide]

I guess this has to be repeated again for those that just can't understand. The University of Tennessee DID NOT sue the NCAA. The States of Tennessee and Virginia sued the NCAA. But for some on here, never let the facts get in the way of the narrative they hope to see.

The state sued them because it's a state institution. The facts remain the same. What you said is just trying to play technicality police. Take a seat.