TN Forest management plan

[PillsburyDoughboy]

Has anyone had the Tn Department of Forestry come out and do a 10 Year Forest Management Plan on their property ?

From what I gathered this weekend on the surface it seems pretty cool . They come out and give you a full inventory of your trees and how to grow them over the next 10 years . And that they will supply you with 100 trees ?????

After talking with someone who had looked into this he said he had a attorney look over the fine print and it may not be for me .
Wondering what people that have had it done actual experience was and any downsides ???

Please and thank you !


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[LanceS4803]

Not TN state, but had USDA do a cost sharing with me for a private company to do it.

It will be interesting to see what people say about the state plan. I'm in the middle of a podcast from MSU Deer University about cost sharing and what free programs are available.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

While I havent yet talked with the Tn Forestry department about this. I was told by someone that did check it out that if you read the fine print of the contract that they give you 100 trees to plant and you have to pay a herbitoligist to plant them. You can't plant them yourself. And then if any of the trees turn up dead you have to pay for those trees out of your pocket. IDK it seems like it could be a very expensive process. It does look interesting though to see if I can just get a elvauation on my property to see where I stand .

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

Not sure if the herbitoligist is accurate. But that is what I was told by someone that says they checked it out pretty good. He has several LARGE properties that he manages and hired a attorney to look this over. So I am just basing my comments off of what he told me. I am going to pursue this on my own and listen to what they have to say. I just wanted to hear feedback from anyone that may have done this.

 

[Boll Weevil]

Not TN state, but had USDA do a cost sharing with me for a private company to do it.

This is what I did as well. The FMP is a requirement for tree farm certification (which my property was granted several years ago). Whether you end up planting trees from Div. of Forestry or not, I'd definitely recommend working with a forester to complete a plan.

 

[treefarmer]

I agree with Boll Weevil - get forest advice from someone with a Forestry degree and let them know your objectives - wildlife or timber, etc. I spent an hour with a State Forester (Area Forester) when we bought our property 25 years ago and it was the best hour I ever spent. After that I received a paper company management plan and joined the Tree Farm program (free). Our Tree Farm is a well managed beautiful forest because of what I learned but the properties around me are a mess (oaks are mostly gone) because they had no plan of how to harvest or what to do after they harvested. Forestry seems simple but it isn't intuitive - big trees aren't always the oldest, clear-cuts are a beautiful thing if you are a critter or oak tree, if you cut only the oaks they are gone unless you cut enough forest to allow lots of sunlight to come in, diameter-limit cuts or select-cuts don't usually turn out well, etc.

Consider joining the County Forestry Association nearest you. I joined the West Highland Rim Forestry Association many years ago ($10). They have an annual meeting (tonight) in Dickson and they have a Phd Forester talking about Managing Quality White Oak.

Tree seedlings are $70 - $80 per hundred from the State Nursery delivered free to your county. I have never heard of having to hire a professional to have them planted and would be surprised if that was the case. If you have enough area to plant the Area Forester can get you free seedlings donated by a couple different companies but they may require hickory or pine to be planted. I've planted about 2,000 of 5 different nursery purchased trees over the years. I had one Shortleaf pine failure and they sent a forester to investigate and replaced the seedlings at no cost, and taught me Shortleaf needs to be planted two inches deeper for better success and the second planting was successful. If you buy trees grown North of TN they bloom late for their life and if you buy trees grown South of TN they bloom early for their life - not good either way. The State Nursery Trees are grown in Delano, TN. For more information on the State Nursery Trees see:

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/agric ... atalog.pdf

Full disclosure - I am a big fan of the Division of Forestry.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I agree with Boll Weevil - get forest advice from someone with a Forestry degree and let them know your objectives - wildlife or timber, etc. I spent an hour with a State Forester (Area Forester) when we bought our property 25 years ago and it was the best hour I ever spent. After that I received a paper company management plan and joined the Tree Farm program (free). Our Tree Farm is a well managed beautiful forest because of what I learned but the properties around me are a mess (oaks are mostly gone) because they had no plan of how to harvest or what to do after they harvested. Forestry seems simple but it isn't intuitive - big trees aren't always the oldest, clear-cuts are a beautiful thing if you are a critter or oak tree, if you cut only the oaks they are gone unless you cut enough forest to allow lots of sunlight to come in, diameter-limit cuts or select-cuts don't usually turn out well, etc.

Consider joining the County Forestry Association nearest you. I joined the West Highland Rim Forestry Association many years ago ($10). They have an annual meeting (tonight) in Dickson and they have a Phd Forester talking about Managing Quality White Oak.

Tree seedlings are $70 - $80 per hundred from the State Nursery delivered free to your county. I have never heard of having to hire a professional to have them planted and would be surprised if that was the case. If you have enough area to plant the Area Forester can get you free seedlings donated by a couple different companies but they may require hickory or pine to be planted. I've planted about 2,000 of 5 different nursery purchased trees over the years. I had one Shortleaf pine failure and they sent a forester to investigate and replaced the seedlings at no cost, and taught me Shortleaf needs to be planted two inches deeper for better success and the second planting was successful. If you buy trees grown North of TN they bloom late for their life and if you buy trees grown South of TN they bloom early for their life - not good either way. The State Nursery Trees are grown in Delano, TN. For more information on the State Nursery Trees see:

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/agric ... atalog.pdf

Full disclosure - I am a big fan of the Division of Forestry.

Thanks.. This is something I will take with me when I meet with the Local Forestry Rep. Probaly in the in the next few weeks.

My place was carefully select cut (60 Acres) by Johnathan Boggs a Local Forestry guy that represented me and I think he did a outstanding job working with the Cutters. We carefully selected the trees that needed to be thinned from the herd and kept a good balance of trees that needed to stay so I feel like a have a good stand to work with. It had been 70 Years since it had been logged last and we were losing 15 to 20 trees a year to storms and age because of size and deterioration so it was time do some cutting. Plus there was virtually no light getting on the forest floor. Now we have all sorts of trees and growth sprouting.

Im 55 years old So I do not see another cutting in my lifetime. Probably going to benefit my adult son more than me so I would like to strike a balance of a objective of wildlife VS Timber Value. Perhaps some persimmons thrown in the mix .

 

[RS]

My place was carefully select cut (60 Acres) by Johnathan Boggs a Local Forestry guy that represented me and I think he did a outstanding job working with the Cutters.

Jonathan is working with us on our farm now. He's a good guy and very knowledgeable.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

My place was carefully select cut (60 Acres) by Johnathan Boggs a Local Forestry guy that represented me and I think he did a outstanding job working with the Cutters.

Jonathan is working with us on our farm now. He's a good guy and very knowledgeable.

I went the route of putting out my trees for bidding with Boggs . I may have gotten a little less but in the end I got a much better site when it was all said and done


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[LanceS4803]

This is the podcast I was listening to. It was interesting that they start off talking about what your goals are, if it is investment property vs legacy property, etc. They said you need to look at what practices you want to do and then think 2, 3 or even 5 generations down the road.
Well worth the hour to listen to.

http://extension.msstate.edu/content/episode-028-offsetting-the-cost-conservation

 

[treefarmer]

I said select cuts don't usually turn out well. That is because it is usually the guy with the chainsaw that does the selecting and the good trees are selected. When you used Jonathan Boggs of Arbor Springs Forestry you had a select cut done in the right way, with some of the good species trees left for the next forest and all the junk trees chosen for removal. I used Jonathan for two timber sales and both turned out fine. I read a couple times if you use a Consulting Forester you will make as much money as those that don't hire a forester because the Forester knows who the wood buyers are and the buyers know it is a competitive bid situation and they have to bring a fair price. With a Forester you also get a logger that is accountable to the Forester for your harvest if he wants to bid on the next job. When a logger sees a request for bid come from a Forester they know a sale is almost certain to happen, they get a volume of wood estimate, and they aren't wasting their time whereas with a private landowner frequently a sale doesn't happen and there is no estimate of timber volume. Like all professions, there are good loggers and a few not-so-good ones and Consulting Foresters only have time to work with the good ones.

Full disclosure - I'm a big fan of Consulting Foresters.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I said select cuts don't usually turn out well. That is because it is usually the guy with the chainsaw that does the selecting and the good trees are selected. When you used Jonathan Boggs of Arbor Springs Forestry you had a select cut done in the right way, with some of the good species trees left for the next forest and all the junk trees chosen for removal. I used Jonathan for two timber sales and both turned out fine. I read a couple times if you use a Consulting Forester you will make as much money as those that don't hire a forester because the Forester knows who the wood buyers are and the buyers know it is a competitive bid situation and they have to bring a fair price. With a Forester you also get a logger that is accountable to the Forester for your harvest if he wants to bid on the next job. When a logger sees a request for bid come from a Forester they know a sale is almost certain to happen, they get a volume of wood estimate, and they aren't wasting their time whereas with a private landowner frequently a sale doesn't happen and there is no estimate of timber volume. Like all professions, there are good loggers and a few not-so-good ones and Consulting Foresters only have time to work with the good ones.

Full disclosure - I'm a big fan of Consulting Foresters.

Thanks. I feel pretty good about the Cutting we did and the discussions we had about the trees we took. It needed it bad. It was way past due. I should have done it at least 5 years sooner. I proably lost 100 trees or more to age and weather in those 5 years.

Here 6 years later you can hardly tell my place was cut. The tops left behind are almost all but gone. The stumps are pretty well covered by grasses and weeds growing and there is new growth on the forrest floor. Lots of good cover for the deer and bedding.


I now want to concentrate on reevaluating to see where I stand to see what I can do for the future.

 

[DoubleRidge]

I said select cuts don't usually turn out well. That is because it is usually the guy with the chainsaw that does the selecting and the good trees are selected. When you used Jonathan Boggs of Arbor Springs Forestry you had a select cut done in the right way, with some of the good species trees left for the next forest and all the junk trees chosen for removal. I used Jonathan for two timber sales and both turned out fine. I read a couple times if you use a Consulting Forester you will make as much money as those that don't hire a forester because the Forester knows who the wood buyers are and the buyers know it is a competitive bid situation and they have to bring a fair price. With a Forester you also get a logger that is accountable to the Forester for your harvest if he wants to bid on the next job. When a logger sees a request for bid come from a Forester they know a sale is almost certain to happen, they get a volume of wood estimate, and they aren't wasting their time whereas with a private landowner frequently a sale doesn't happen and there is no estimate of timber volume. Like all professions, there are good loggers and a few not-so-good ones and Consulting Foresters only have time to work with the good ones.

Full disclosure - I'm a big fan of Consulting Foresters.

Couldn't agree more on consulting foresters. We just wrapped up a project and we also used Jonathan Boggs. Great guy who created my dad and I a timber management plan which included hack-n-squirt guidelines, food plot recommendations, etc... Jonathan worked with the timber company so we we're able to agree on both loading deck locations...with plans of both loading decks to be converted to food plots....and the bidding process for standing timber worked out very good for use.... received nine bids and while profit wasn't the number one goal....I have zero doubt we generated more income from the timber sale using a forester than what we would have going at it alone....I say this because the company that won the bid wasn't even on our radar? Jonathan had worked with them before and was comfortable using them....we had never heard of them? I would highly recommend Arbor Spring Forestry... especially if your timber management goals include managing for wildlife.