This is more of a school me thread. I've never used cameras out in the public land I hunt. I don't have access to large tracks of private land. A little private land when owners family isn't hunting it. So question is does cameras make you a better hunter. Or just hang cameras till you find a big buck then find the times and go in and kill it. I know it's not just that simple. But does it take away from the woodsman/ Hunter aspect of hunting. I'm really considering it for next year. What's everyone's honest opinion. And I'm not knocking anyone. Just trying to gain knowledge. As it would be new to my style.
thoughts on camera’s
- Thread starter DRSJ35
- Start date
JCDEERMAN
Well-Known Member
2 points here. 1) For public land, I'd get cheap camera(s). 2) cameras are traditionally not made to help you kill deer, but to help you get a grasp on the caliber of bucks (or deer numbers in general) in the area.
The only time a camera has ever helped me kill a good buck was for the velvet hunt, just due to them being so patternable during that time period. I'd keep up on the woodsmanship, as that is paramount. As long as you don't put the cameras before the learning/adjustments, your headed in the right direction.
The only time a camera has ever helped me kill a good buck was for the velvet hunt, just due to them being so patternable during that time period. I'd keep up on the woodsmanship, as that is paramount. As long as you don't put the cameras before the learning/adjustments, your headed in the right direction.
Shed Hunter
Well-Known Member
Between 23 total cameras swapped over anywhere from 70-100 locations on public land from Henderson County TN to Muhlenberg County KY I can shed a little bit of light on what you are wanting to do.
Would I know in confidence where a particular buck is without the cameras? Aside from a personal sighting or finding shed antlers-no. Does that make it easier to go kill just any random big deer? Sure. I had a few patterned pretty well this past year. Can you still be a "good hunter" if you use trail cameras? Well personally I think if I pulled off watching the highest potential deer I have on camera while electing to pass on everything else as I've already killed a deer larger.. that'd be fairly characteristic of a pretty darn good woodsman. I've also been known to set others up on the deer I won't hunt even in the 150" range. IMO, being a good woodsman is nothing more than respecting the animal you are pursuing and it also doesn't hurt to add a little camaraderie in there. Just get out there and enjoy what you are doing however it is you choose to do so as long as it is legal
Would I know in confidence where a particular buck is without the cameras? Aside from a personal sighting or finding shed antlers-no. Does that make it easier to go kill just any random big deer? Sure. I had a few patterned pretty well this past year. Can you still be a "good hunter" if you use trail cameras? Well personally I think if I pulled off watching the highest potential deer I have on camera while electing to pass on everything else as I've already killed a deer larger.. that'd be fairly characteristic of a pretty darn good woodsman. I've also been known to set others up on the deer I won't hunt even in the 150" range. IMO, being a good woodsman is nothing more than respecting the animal you are pursuing and it also doesn't hurt to add a little camaraderie in there. Just get out there and enjoy what you are doing however it is you choose to do so as long as it is legal
Shed Hunter
Well-Known Member
Also for those interested I have never had a trail camera stolen and have photographed plenty of other hunters.
Go to your local hardware store. Buy a length of 3/32 cable you feel appropriate for the tree you intend (I just cut them all about 5-6ft since I throw them on random trees) Then get some 3/32 cable ferrules. Crimp a loop on each end. Grab some luggage locks and I highly doubt your camera will be stolen
Go to your local hardware store. Buy a length of 3/32 cable you feel appropriate for the tree you intend (I just cut them all about 5-6ft since I throw them on random trees) Then get some 3/32 cable ferrules. Crimp a loop on each end. Grab some luggage locks and I highly doubt your camera will be stolen
BSK
Well-Known Member
I've been using trail-cameras since before they were commercially available. I bet I've looked at more trail-camera pictures than 99.999% of hunters. Two years ago I analyzed over 385,000 trail-camera pictures in a single season (10-12 hours per day every day for almost 6 months). In all that time have I ever seen a buck so patternable by trail-cameras that you could say he will come by this tree at this time on this date with 100% accuracy? Nope. Never. Not saying it doesn't happen, but I think it's rarer than most non-camera users assume.
Now have trail-cameras made me a more knowledgeable hence better hunter? Oh absolutely! Constantly experimenting with camera locations will teach you worlds about how deer use habitat and terrain. I would say trail-cameras have taught more about how to hunt deer than all the observations I've made in 40+ years of sitting in a tree, times 10!
Now have trail-cameras made me a more knowledgeable hence better hunter? Oh absolutely! Constantly experimenting with camera locations will teach you worlds about how deer use habitat and terrain. I would say trail-cameras have taught more about how to hunt deer than all the observations I've made in 40+ years of sitting in a tree, times 10!
I just tried them last year, so I'm new to cameras, but hunted deer since 1984.
One thing they've done is give me confidence that a class of deer I'm after is using the property I hunt. The bucks around me get hammered, and just knowing certain ones have survived keeps my spirits up.
But, I've got a lot to learn about using them.
One thing they've done is give me confidence that a class of deer I'm after is using the property I hunt. The bucks around me get hammered, and just knowing certain ones have survived keeps my spirits up.
But, I've got a lot to learn about using them.
One thing that I have struggled with as a hunter is understanding and acknowledging where I am as a hunter and where I want to be. While I have never killed a true monster a few years ago I found myself season after season passing on bucks in hopes of that once in a lifetime deer getting within range of my rifle. Why? Hadn't I put in the time and money to reward myself with actually harvesting a deer? Filled a few tags with the biggest deer that I had ever killed and now I have moved on to solely bowhunting. Killed an 8 this year which was somewhat comparable to other deer I have killed. No monster, but again I accomplished what I hoped to prove that I could do. Moving forward my next goal is to put myself in position to harvest a mature buck with my bow which will require me to make significant changes to how I do things, including the inclusion of more cameras to see what trophies are even available. Point being, cameras can be beneficial to help hunters set realistic expectations for themselves. A 115" trophy may be the best your land has to offer so why not reward yourself by harvesting it??
I grew up when cameras weren't a thing. We didn't have cell phones, internet, or trail cams. I've had the experience of hunting and scouting sign, terrain, and sheer gut feeling. And now that I'm running dozens of cameras, I still hunt that way.
Cameras aren't a crutch. They don't substitute anything. They're a tool that if used correctly can enhance/aid the hunt by confirming scouting. Take inventory over salt in the summer or watch a scrape in fall, that kind of stuff. But they can be a double edge sword, too. If you leave a bunch of scent or check too often or even lack an understanding of how & where to put them, they can ruin a spot. They can spook deer and you checking them can spook deer. They aren't the given miracle advertising paints them to be.
That said, I rely on them. Maybe not in the way you'd think, though. I've never been able to pattern a deer with a camera. All I can learn is which deer are making and using sign I scouted. And I know when deer begin showing in daylight, in general, during late pre-rut. In that regard the cameras save me lots of wasted time hunting a deer that when I finally see, is not one I want to take. It also saves me from blowing an area out by hunting it while deer are still largely nocturnal. But above all, I enjoy watching bucks grow up through the years and then pick one or two to hunt because I know they are the dominant, most mature deer in the area. Cams are invaluable in many aspects. Just don't let them cripple you.
Cameras aren't a crutch. They don't substitute anything. They're a tool that if used correctly can enhance/aid the hunt by confirming scouting. Take inventory over salt in the summer or watch a scrape in fall, that kind of stuff. But they can be a double edge sword, too. If you leave a bunch of scent or check too often or even lack an understanding of how & where to put them, they can ruin a spot. They can spook deer and you checking them can spook deer. They aren't the given miracle advertising paints them to be.
That said, I rely on them. Maybe not in the way you'd think, though. I've never been able to pattern a deer with a camera. All I can learn is which deer are making and using sign I scouted. And I know when deer begin showing in daylight, in general, during late pre-rut. In that regard the cameras save me lots of wasted time hunting a deer that when I finally see, is not one I want to take. It also saves me from blowing an area out by hunting it while deer are still largely nocturnal. But above all, I enjoy watching bucks grow up through the years and then pick one or two to hunt because I know they are the dominant, most mature deer in the area. Cams are invaluable in many aspects. Just don't let them cripple you.
Safari Hunt
Well-Known Member
Interesting. You are lucky. Always heard that locks are for honest people. Would like to have a camera or two but shy about theft.
chewymalone
Well-Known Member
I personally can't stand cameras! Other than surveying a new property to see what caliber of bucks are there, I have no use for them. I have seen hunters get completely obsessed with them, checking them so often that the cameras become detrimental from a scent and deer education standpoint. If you know your hunting ground's bedding areas, food sources, travel patterns, etc... and you know there are big deer, I encourage you to forego the cameras and just hunt. I've made the mistake of hunting a huge deer due to a trail camera pic... ended up passing many great bucks and frustrated!
I let the deer sign and my knowledge and experience in the woods with big bucks tell me where to hang my cameras and normally find a couple nice ones on at least one of my cameras. Once I find one I'll go after I try to find his route and concentrate my cameras in that area and find his bedroom they will be in daylight closer to their bed and come out midday, I think about/within 100yds. I won't hesitate to put cameras on public land s long as i will be back within 2 weeks I've never had a issue. But I do put cheaper ones on public land tractor supply always had 2 for$100 stealth cam
I like Moultrie. I've had a couple go bad but generally they are rock solid dependable. As for missing pics, it could be several things. There are things to look for in a camera before buying, and things to know when setting them up. It's not complicated but it does entail more than taking out of the box & expecting it to perform. I like less than half second trigger speed, good recovery speed, and a flash that extends at least as far or farther than the detection range. I also set mine to the lowest sensitivity so I'm not dealing with a bunch of false triggers.
By no means am I a camera expert but those are things that I've found make a difference. I've got zero experience with cell cams so I can't comment on them. The standard cams are already complicated enough for me.
Shed Hunter
Well-Known Member
Fortunately I don't believe the kind of person who would steal a camera often visit the areas I do. I've had several found without locks and find several every year myself
Depends on how you use them as well. Plenty of "hunters" in my area are using
Cell cams to where they place the cam over bait behind the house. When the big one shows up, you get out of your recliner, turn the night vision on, and fire away. That certainly takes away from the hunt. Plenty of people are doing this and taking a lot of the top end bucks in that manner. For me, cell cams have made it super easy to shoot hogs, but not so much with legally hunting deer.
Cell cams to where they place the cam over bait behind the house. When the big one shows up, you get out of your recliner, turn the night vision on, and fire away. That certainly takes away from the hunt. Plenty of people are doing this and taking a lot of the top end bucks in that manner. For me, cell cams have made it super easy to shoot hogs, but not so much with legally hunting deer.
DoubleRidge
Well-Known Member
Do cameras make you a better hunter?...to the point where woodsman skills are not needed? No....is the information you gain from cameras a benefit? To me...yes.
The biggest benefit I've had from running multiple cameras on a property is confidence.....knowing that a buck (or bucks) are in the general area your hunting gives me the confidence too hunt harder and too sit for longer periods of time.....for me the number of all day sits increased dramatically after I started running cameras.....I'm also more patient and willing to let certain bucks walk knowing that there are better bucks in the area.
So in my experience.... increased confidence and patience has been the benefit gained from running cameras.
Plus I just enjoy running cameras and I really enjoy the anticipation of seeing what's on camera.
The biggest benefit I've had from running multiple cameras on a property is confidence.....knowing that a buck (or bucks) are in the general area your hunting gives me the confidence too hunt harder and too sit for longer periods of time.....for me the number of all day sits increased dramatically after I started running cameras.....I'm also more patient and willing to let certain bucks walk knowing that there are better bucks in the area.
So in my experience.... increased confidence and patience has been the benefit gained from running cameras.
Plus I just enjoy running cameras and I really enjoy the anticipation of seeing what's on camera.
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JCDEERMAN
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I am able to see what bucks are using particular parts of the property and which ones they aren't. Knowing what caliber of bucks that are in the area can really save some of those bucks you are on the fence about. I have killed some bucks just by barely being able to identify which ones they were by getting a glimpse of an antler characteristic. Likewise, I have been able to pass on bucks by seeing those small antler characteristics where I can identify and had pre-determined not to shoot that deer based on knowing his age from pictures.
megalomaniac
Well-Known Member
I have no interest in shooting a buck that isn't at least 4.5... I use cameras to identify general areas and confirm there is a shooter in the vicinity before I will even hunt an area. I'm blessed to have multiple places to hunt, and there just isn't any need wasting my time on a farm that doesn't have a shooter around.
I also use cameras to identify the top end bucks per age class so I don't accidentally shoot them when I encounter them in a hunting situation.
However, I only hunt actual camera sites rarely. Just the general area around the camera, usually 200-250 yards away.
All four of the mature bucks I killed last year I knew were in the general area and I was specifically hunting those particular bucks because of trail camera pictures. The closest one I killed to a camera was 250 yards, the others were 700-800 yards away from where I captured them on cameras.
Cellular cameras are great for hunting transition areas near bedding areas to avoid intruding/ invading the areas. When a new buck that is a shooter shows up in this particular location, we go in and hunt it that same day. I killed a 5.5 yo last year doing that, and this year we killed a 4.5 y/o we hadn't captured on camera for 6 weeks prior on the same day he showed up at this particular location. If there isn't a shooter on this particular community scrape in the past day or two, we don't even hunt this specific area.
I also use cameras to identify the top end bucks per age class so I don't accidentally shoot them when I encounter them in a hunting situation.
However, I only hunt actual camera sites rarely. Just the general area around the camera, usually 200-250 yards away.
All four of the mature bucks I killed last year I knew were in the general area and I was specifically hunting those particular bucks because of trail camera pictures. The closest one I killed to a camera was 250 yards, the others were 700-800 yards away from where I captured them on cameras.
Cellular cameras are great for hunting transition areas near bedding areas to avoid intruding/ invading the areas. When a new buck that is a shooter shows up in this particular location, we go in and hunt it that same day. I killed a 5.5 yo last year doing that, and this year we killed a 4.5 y/o we hadn't captured on camera for 6 weeks prior on the same day he showed up at this particular location. If there isn't a shooter on this particular community scrape in the past day or two, we don't even hunt this specific area.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Great comments DoubleRidge. One of the hunting benefits of cameras is confidence to get back out there. Sometimes, what a hunter sees while hunting gives him or her a false impression. A couple of days in a row seeing nothing from the stand often makes a hunter feel like daylight deer activity has shut down, or all the deer have left the area. That can influence a hunter to pack it in for awhile. But hot action caught on camera where the hunter wasn't hunting makes the hunter realize it was just a coincidence of several wrong stand choices in a row. Those hot action pictures can produce the confidence to get back out there and not give up.
Yooper22
New Member
my personal favorite is the Spypoint solar and cellular. Put it out and no need to go back to the camera.
LINK-MICRO-S-LTE (spypoint.com)
Just my opinion. Lots of options. Do what you enjoy and don't worry about what others think. Happy Hunting.
LINK-MICRO-S-LTE (spypoint.com)
Just my opinion. Lots of options. Do what you enjoy and don't worry about what others think. Happy Hunting.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Also good comments chewymalone. I too have seen hunters rely too much on cameras. They are a wonderful educational tool, but they are not the end-all-be-all, nor will they compensate for poor hunting techniques.
Headhunter
Well-Known Member
Don't want any cameras, don't need any cameras (well, except if there are trespasser issues) but to me cameras take away from hunting. Even though I believe cameras educate deer as much they do hunters, cameras also are the sole reason many deer are killed. Many hunters are not good at "hunting" but they are good at using cameras to locate and shoot deer. To me that is not hunting. That is shooting what the camera finds. Especially when the camera sends the pics to a phone or computer.
More importantly, cameras take away from hunting.
To each his own.
More importantly, cameras take away from hunting.
To each his own.
Kirk
Well-Known Member
I have been running cameras for at least 18 years. My camera usage started back with the old film cameras that took12-24 pictures then it was over. Cost a fortune to have them developed and printed. Didn't learn much from the cameras until the digital formats came along. Then the deer world changed for me. I finally had enough picture capacity to actually see several days, even weeks of deer movement.
I have literally watched fawns grow into to adults using the cameras. Most deer look very similar but some are so distinctive you can name them and watch them over a couple of years. A scar, a white patch that is little wider, and even size helps me identify specific deer. I had an old doe several years ago that was nocturnal, never ever once got a daylight picture of her. She was huge compared to the other does and had a place on her shoulder that looked like and old injury. At first I thought she was an antlerless buck but changed my mind when I saw she had fawns the next year. I named her Megadoe and watched her for at least 5 years. One day the pictures of her stopped. I will admit it was upsetting that she was gone.
All this to say, cameras will educate you on the deer you have on a property. Might not see them all but it will give you a great idea of how many and what quality of deer you have.
I have literally watched fawns grow into to adults using the cameras. Most deer look very similar but some are so distinctive you can name them and watch them over a couple of years. A scar, a white patch that is little wider, and even size helps me identify specific deer. I had an old doe several years ago that was nocturnal, never ever once got a daylight picture of her. She was huge compared to the other does and had a place on her shoulder that looked like and old injury. At first I thought she was an antlerless buck but changed my mind when I saw she had fawns the next year. I named her Megadoe and watched her for at least 5 years. One day the pictures of her stopped. I will admit it was upsetting that she was gone.
All this to say, cameras will educate you on the deer you have on a property. Might not see them all but it will give you a great idea of how many and what quality of deer you have.
Me, too. I enjoy the difference in personalities. One of the bucks I shot this year was a 5.5yr old teddy bear. I'd been watching him for years and never saw him get aggressive. Even in the heavy pre-rut when the bucks were fighting, I caught him on camera with a tiny fork horn. He was toying around letting the forky push him around and spar, and he was so gentle about it. Reminded me of wrestling with my boy when he was little. That buck just wasn't even a little bit mean toward anything. I honestly kind of miss him now. As soon as I killed him a big 10pt took over the area and tore up all the scrapes like donkey kong. I won't be as sad popping that punk.
Interesting take. I'd like to hear more about why you feel that way, and what experiences you've had that lead to those feelings.
The bold quote is especially confusing to me. It reads as an oxymoron. If the bad hunter who can't find deer uses a camera to find deer, then wouldn't he have to be able to find deer in order to know where to hang the camera?
Safari Hunt
Well-Known Member
Trails cameras are an aid to hunting and learning game behavior, IMHO. No different than going into the woods and looking for tracks and other sign. As Ski mentioned, one needs to know deer behavior to know where to put the cameras. Just random placement could be wasted time and battery power. I know a writer who teaches classes/seminars on using trail cameras for critters other than deer. He has fantastic shots of bobcats, bear, deer, possum, raccoons, etc.
BSK
Well-Known Member
When it comes to camera use, I think a clear distinction needs to be made: cameras to aid hunting or cameras to manage/measure the population. As for management, I strongly feel the trail-camera is the most important deer management tool ever invented. I honestly can't image effectively managing a local deer population without the REAL data cameras provide.
On the flip side, cameras for hunting? They have helped me learn more about deer which has made me a more successful hunter in the long run. However, need them? No. Give me an aerial photo, topo map, and a day's scouting on a property and I'll know much of I what I need to know to be successful.
On the flip side, cameras for hunting? They have helped me learn more about deer which has made me a more successful hunter in the long run. However, need them? No. Give me an aerial photo, topo map, and a day's scouting on a property and I'll know much of I what I need to know to be successful.
Headhunter
Well-Known Member
I know of many, many people, who do not go into the woods, fields, etc. to try to kill a deer unless they have a camera(s) out and pictures of deer using the area. Many will not go unless they have pictures of a particular buck or class of bucks they are hunting. Since remote cameras came out (by that I mean cameras that send pictures to you, there is a reason why they are not allowed for bucks killed using remote cameras to be put into P and Y or B and C) have came out, I have been told by people they waited til a buck showed a pattern from the pics sent to their phone and they got in the stand in just enough time before the deer shows up and they kill it. That is not hunting, that is shooting what the camera showed you, when and where. No different than the guys that pay big money to kill a buck that someone else has patterned, and then tell them to get in the stand a few minutes before they kill it. Not hunting, just shooting.
Cameras are not the same as hunting to me, If you do not use cameras, all you have is your knowledge of what you observe to know what a deer is or is not doing.
Cameras not only show you where a deer is using, but when, likely what direction they are coming from, etc. Yes some people are good with cameras, take them away and see what deer they kill or how strong their drive is to hunt. To some extent, they are hunting with cameras, not their own god given abilities to physically see and listen to what is going on.
Even though there is an advantage of knowing what deer are using the area you hunt, that also takes away from the hunting aspect. With cameras, you have a good chance at knowing if there is a bigger deer there, so you pass a smaller buck up. To me, to some extent, that turns hunting into shooting. Without cameras, you go on what you have seen, sign and actual deer. With cameras, the cameras are doing the hunting, so many people base all they do on what they do or do not see on camera. They spend way less time in the woods, cameras take away a huge part of just finding deer and especially a mature deer, where they live, bed, eat, and travel. I love to HUNT, the unknown part of what deer are or are not there is a huge part of hunting to me.
When needed, I believe cameras can help with knowing if an area has deer herd issues as far as population, health, etc.
You will never see me use cameras to create a hit list, name deer, locate deer, pattern deer, or hunt deer, etc. For me it takes most, if not all the hunting experience away.
I love to be out, observing, deer, sign, weather, food, water supply, etc and trying to figure out where I need to be in order to kill the deer I want to kill. Not put cameras out, go look at pics and base my time around that, I know many that do.
And I DO NOT believe I am a better hunter or whatever because of that, bur I do believe using cameras to hunt deer takes away the HUNTING experience. I value every single minute of my hunting time and make the most of it.
Cameras are not the same as hunting to me, If you do not use cameras, all you have is your knowledge of what you observe to know what a deer is or is not doing.
Cameras not only show you where a deer is using, but when, likely what direction they are coming from, etc. Yes some people are good with cameras, take them away and see what deer they kill or how strong their drive is to hunt. To some extent, they are hunting with cameras, not their own god given abilities to physically see and listen to what is going on.
Even though there is an advantage of knowing what deer are using the area you hunt, that also takes away from the hunting aspect. With cameras, you have a good chance at knowing if there is a bigger deer there, so you pass a smaller buck up. To me, to some extent, that turns hunting into shooting. Without cameras, you go on what you have seen, sign and actual deer. With cameras, the cameras are doing the hunting, so many people base all they do on what they do or do not see on camera. They spend way less time in the woods, cameras take away a huge part of just finding deer and especially a mature deer, where they live, bed, eat, and travel. I love to HUNT, the unknown part of what deer are or are not there is a huge part of hunting to me.
When needed, I believe cameras can help with knowing if an area has deer herd issues as far as population, health, etc.
You will never see me use cameras to create a hit list, name deer, locate deer, pattern deer, or hunt deer, etc. For me it takes most, if not all the hunting experience away.
I love to be out, observing, deer, sign, weather, food, water supply, etc and trying to figure out where I need to be in order to kill the deer I want to kill. Not put cameras out, go look at pics and base my time around that, I know many that do.
And I DO NOT believe I am a better hunter or whatever because of that, bur I do believe using cameras to hunt deer takes away the HUNTING experience. I value every single minute of my hunting time and make the most of it.
BSK
Well-Known Member
Not disagreeing with you at all Headhunter. If that is the situation, I agree it's shooting and not hunting.
But I sure want to know where bucks that patternable live. I've looked at far more trail-camera pictures of deer than most hunters and I've never seen a deer that patternable. Now maybe that's because I do most of my trail-camera work in hilly "big woods." Bucks are very difficult to pattern in this situation. You may know the general area a buck is using, but not which ridge he's going to walk down on which day. Hunting in this situation is just a gamble. Pick your stand and play the odds for that hunt. Most of the time you lose and the buck wins.
Now I've heard bucks are far more patternable in agriculture habitat, especially early in bow season.
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