Outlaw Fishing for Bedding Bass?

[rsimms]

The best window of opportunity to do it is closing right now, but some fishermen think that sight fishing for bedding bass should be outlawed.

Read the arguments, pro & con, here: http://bit.ly/2py0lfR

What do you think?

 

[RUGER]

There are more than one other worse things for bass population than fishing beds.
The biggest one is not a very popular subject and very controversial / debated (if you like fishing bass tournaments)

 

[Spurhunter]

Would it not be impossible to enforce?

 

[JimFromTN]

Tournaments should be illegal while bass are bedding. They say it is only a 5% die off from tournaments but if you have ever been to a marina a day or 2 after a tournament, you will know thats a load of bull.

 

[Mike Belt]

I don't see any way to enforce a rule banning this unless bass fishing was made illegal during that time frame. I'd be more concerned with fish die off post tournament. That being said, I have had some of my best bass fishing while the fish were on bed.

 

[WTM]

the only way to accomplish this would be to outlaw fishing bedded fish during the spawn, and incidentally, some northern states have instituted this law.

there has been research on this subject and like all research, it all depends on the body of water, annual fishing pressure and most importantly fish density per acre.

one research study showed that the body of water they studied, removing larger male LMB during bedding can have an impact on recruitment and most likely cause stunted growth in those targeted species. this also holds true for bluegill, keep all of those bluegill over 9" and you will see a decline in size structure, MORE PRONE SMALLER BODIES OF WATER:

http://fishlab.nres.illinois.edu/Reprin ... hilipp.pdf

on the otherhand you have this computer model study(using the above data from that study and 2 other research studies), and they concluded that bed fishing affects northern waters more so than southern waters:

http://sfrc.ufl.edu/allenlab/Popular%20 ... y%2010.pdf


this is just my opinion, but in the smaller lakes it would be wise to watch the trap net studies and if there appears to be a decline in density it would be smart to research the cause. a lake like KY lake with 45-50lbs of LMB per acre, i doubt that a couple of tournaments per year would drastically affect LMB populations.

 

[RUGER]

. a lake like KY lake with 45-50lbs of LMB per acre, i doubt that a couple of tournaments per year would drastically affect LMB populations.

Try a couple tournaments per WEEK.
Many times there are more than one tournament going on during the same weekend.

 

[WTM]

. a lake like KY lake with 45-50lbs of LMB per acre, i doubt that a couple of tournaments per year would drastically affect LMB populations.

Try a couple tournaments per WEEK.
Many times there are more than one tournament going on during the same weekend.

but only a fraction of those tournaments occur during the short bedding period, which is actually what i meant. the most vulnerable time is after the eggs are laid and the large males are guarding the beds. how many tournaments and how many fish are caught during that time frame to affect a lake the size of KY lake plus KY lake is fairly stained during that time frame. but on those smaller and clearer lakes, it could have an affect since those fish are more easily targeted.

 

[RUGER]

Got ya.

 

[wobblegobble]

A Texas Tech study shows that the mortality rate after Tournament s is much higher than 5%! The said depends on the time of year but it's upwards of 25% and highest 50% in summer months. I'll post the article later...but I watched the FLW weight in Saturday on Tims Ford and a guy that was responsible for sending the fish into the PVC pipe back to the water also had a large cooler with ice and I ask could I peek and 17 good size bass dead on ice....However there was 7 more swimming in circles on top of the water that would soon follow the 3 floating against the bank. Most Lakes in my area have at least 1 tournament everyday of the week, plus multiple different club tournaments on weekends....I believe this is the reason fisheries are slowly dying off. Everyone wants to call themselves tournament fishermen.

 

[wobblegobble]

https://www.northcountrypublicradio.org ... t-the-fish
This isn't the Texas Tech or Auburn study but has some facts...the 5% mortality rate is for the elite series guys but the normal hack weekend guys the initial and delay mortality rate is VERY VERY high.

 

[Prowler]

The BFL guys on tims Saturday weighed 209 fish, and 20 were dead? Not even close to 25 or 50%. How many recreational anglers kept bass from tims on Saturday ?? Im sure the number is far greater than the amount that die in any tournament. every single fish that swims off during weigh in is 1 that wouldn't have been there had it been ate. And for the record I have no problem with anyone eating bass, but I know what kills many more bass than tournaments or bed fishing.

 

[wobblegobble]

The weight in was only half finished when I left and there was far more dead than the 20 in the cooler. 3 was floating on the bank and the 7 swimming in circles on top of the water. The delay mortality rates are super high, Sunday eve my cousin counted 17 floating fish....Tournament guys can never admit they kill high numbers of fish, the research and studies don't just make up these #'s.

 

[wobblegobble]

It's a never ending argument, tournament guys says the fish eaters are the problem and vice versus..Folks have eat fish since Jesus walked but the REAL change his how many people believe they are pro's in local tournament s and clubs. The tournament s have skyrocketed in the past 6 years and I have a study to back that one up too.

 

[WTM]

https://www.northcountrypublicradio.org/news/story/24320/20140314/how-much-do-bass-fishing-tournaments-hurt-the-fish
This isn't the Texas Tech or Auburn study but has some facts...the 5% mortality rate is for the elite series guys but the normal hack weekend guys the initial and delay mortality rate is VERY VERY high.

good observation, the delayed mortality rates for small time tournaments were studied upwards of 50%, due to poor equipment and handling as opposed to the larger tournaments.

also you have to look at the time of year those tournaments. the oklahoma study concluded that spring time tournaments had less than 6% mortality both initial and delayed, but the summer tournaments had a 7% initial but a 39% delayed mortality due to higher temps and lower oxygenated water.

which has me thinking, does the TWRA impose any regulations on how fish are handled and stored in these tournaments?

 

[Prowler]

I don't think nor ever said fish eaters are a problem, I really don't care how many anybody takes out as long as they're legal. But to think tournament or bed fishing are killing more fish than people keeping them is silly. no matter if 90% of fish caught in a tournament die, it's still less than the 100% that die if they're kept to eat.

 

[WTM]

Mr. Simms, are there problems with black bass populations on the Chick or other lakes in that area?

the reason i ask is, wow, 68lbs of bass in 3 days. what would have been a winning tournament poundage 10-15 years ago on the Chick?

on KY lake 20lbs would have won a tournament 10-15 years ago. now days that would get you a bottom placing on KY lake.

so if we are seeing those kind of poundages in tournaments that would also hold true for trap net studies or electroshock samplings, so where is the problem?

after looking at Tims Ford numbers for 6 years, it looks like their black bass numbers look stable with the exception of 2007(looks like a good spawn, increase of 100 percent catch), from the TVA sampling.

 

[wobblegobble]

I don't think nor ever said fish eaters are a problem, I really don't care how many anybody takes out as long as they're legal. But to think tournament or bed fishing are killing more fish than people keeping them is silly. no matter if 90% of fish caught in a tournament die, it's still less than the 100% that die if they're kept to eat.

People have eat fish since JESUS walked...the biggest difference now is the $$$ Grab of folks fishing tournament s. There are more and more tournament s each year and more clubs each year. 10 years ago yes there were tournaments but not 3 at each launch ramp on every lake!

 

[Prowler]

Are the tournaments hurting the fishing on tims ? If so, how ? I had 3 down there early this year and it seems like there's a healthy bass population. Almost everybody had a limit each trip. There are definitely a lot more tourneys nowadays but I don't feel it has a negative impact on the lakes I fish. IMO the biggest difference is tackle,gear, electronics. Back in the day if people had those we wouldn't have a fish left as everyone ate every fish they caught almost. i imagine tournament anglers started catch and release and I feel that's a big reason we have healthy bass populations. Guess I just don't see what the big deal is about fishing for money ? Much less fishing for them a couple weeks a year when you can see them on bed. I hope when I pre fish for watts bar tomorrow I can find some bed fish lol.

 

[wobblegobble]

Each is own, but Tournament fishermen /CPR kill alot of bass after each Tournament. You may release em but many become turtle meat. I fish a couple tournaments a year, keep some, release some...it's all good.

 

[bigquacks]

I think a big problem is all those fish are caught all over the lake and brought to one area for the weigh in, most times many miles away from where they were caught. Also with all the
tournaments every night of the week I believe this is stressing the fish. Maybe take a note from the kayak tournaments and catch, photo, and release. Fish is back in the same location
it was caught within a few minuets. Longest 5 fish wins. Will never happen though, too much money involved now.

 

[Pinwheeled]

I think a big problem is all those fish are caught all over the lake and brought to one area for the weigh in, most times many miles away from where they were caught. Also with all the
tournaments every night of the week I believe this is stressing the fish. Maybe take a note from the kayak tournaments and catch, photo, and release. Fish is back in the same location
it was caught within a few minuets. Longest 5 fish wins. Will never happen though, too much money involved now.

Like you said, that will never happen. Too easy to cheat with the kayak method.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[wobblegobble]

I think a big problem is all those fish are caught all over the lake and brought to one area for the weigh in, most times many miles away from where they were caught. Also with all the
tournaments every night of the week I believe this is stressing the fish. Maybe take a note from the kayak tournaments and catch, photo, and release. Fish is back in the same location
it was caught within a few minuets. Longest 5 fish wins. Will never happen though, too much money involved now.

Exactly! The Major League fishing way is the best but the elite guys aren't the problem. It's the weekday and weekend tournament guys without the proper equipment.

 

[rsimms]

Mr. Simms, are there problems with black bass populations on the Chick or other lakes in that area?

I never said there is a problem... nor did the man who raised this question.

His point is that he wants to insure things remain as good as they are now. Whether I agree with him or not, I believe his intentions are noble.

As for my personal feelings on the issue, I don't agree with creating any kind of state law forbidding the practice because it would simply be too vague and virtually impossible to enforce.

But perhaps his concerns may bring others to question their own practices and alter their fishing patterns. But that is, and should be, their choice.

 

[BlountArrow]

Would it not be impossible to enforce?

This is my first thought exactly.

 

[TheLBLman]

I don't agree with creating any kind of state law forbidding the practice because it would simply be too vague and virtually impossible to enforce.

But perhaps his concerns may bring others to question their own practices and alter their fishing patterns.

Agree.

If we have a problem, reduce the limit, reduce the number of organized "tournaments", etc,
which are potential solutions more easily enforced when violated.

Often, just raising awareness can be enough to prevent a potential problem.
Sometimes, a little carburetor adjustment is needed to raise awareness.
Last year's antlered buck definition change is an example of what I'd consider a carburetor adjustment with deer regs,
although many proclaimed the sky was falling.

 

[Grnwing]

If the states sets the possession limit at a number and someone catches a fish and weighs it and releases versus keeping it for the dinner table what difference is it creating for the fishery. I assume the state sets limits based on what the fishery can support; if the fishery is declining than reduce the limits. When someone takes home a stringer of bass, you don't see it floating at the ramp. Regardless both fisherman are exercising their right to fish. I don't fish tournaments but do not have anything against them nor do I eat bass but will never judge someone for doing so. Let them fish the way they enjoy!

 

[SilverFox]

Too bad we can't outlaw the idiots instead of the fishing. Fish care is pretty simple if you think about what you're doing. Knock on wood I've only lost 1 fish since I started tourney fishing here 6 or 7 years ago. I still don't have a clue what happened to it. Some live well treatment, some ice in the summer and fin clips or fizzing them go a long way. Keeping them off the carpet does too. If I catch a fish when I'm fun fishing I want a pic of or to weigh, it goes straight in the live well and I get the scales or camera set up and then I take him back out. As soon as it's done he's back in the water. Ticks me off seeing them carried around out the water or held by the mouth with the fish parallel the floor.

 

[larry ipock]

Tournaments should be illegal while bass are bedding. They say it is only a 5% die off from tournaments but if you have ever been to a marina a day or 2 after a tournament, you will know thats a load of bull.

Ohhhh! That is so true. I've seen it too many times.

 

[wobblegobble]

Too bad we can't outlaw the idiots instead of the fishing. Fish care is pretty simple if you think about what you're doing. Knock on wood I've only lost 1 fish since I started tourney fishing here 6 or 7 years ago. I still don't have a clue what happened to it. Some live well treatment, some ice in the summer and fin clips or fizzing them go a long way. Keeping them off the carpet does too. If I catch a fish when I'm fun fishing I want a pic of or to weigh, it goes straight in the live well and I get the scales or camera set up and then I take him back out. As soon as it's done he's back in the water. Ticks me off seeing them carried around out the water or held by the mouth with the fish parallel the floor.

There is no way to know how many die, because study's have shown from tagged Tournament fish that the delayed mortality rate is more greater than the initial deaths.