Why is it?

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RKenney

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I have killed several bucks with a .50 caliber muzzle loader and there was no blood trail. I have also read on this site about other hunters experiencing the same thing. I would think with a .50 caliber size hole, there should be a good amount of blood pouring out. I know this doesn't happen to everyone, but it seems to be quite common.

Any thoughts as to why?
 
guts & organs close holes off even with broadheads & a lot of those are 1.5" or bigger ,looking for blood is like looking for a needle in a haystack at times,deer movement 1-2' out of your path & blood will never be seen
 
I rarely have a pass-thru, but rarely do I have to track one either. Shock, or energy transfer is what I strive for from a weapon/bullet combo, not so much just a pass-thru shot. Sometimes, having a pass-thru just means that the bullet went thru so fast that there was no, or minimal expansion, thus less damage to the internals. This is not much better than a broadhead shot, ie, you'll be looking for blood to track more often than having a bang-flop. Just my opinion.
 
RKenney said:
I have killed several bucks with a .50 caliber muzzle loader and there was no blood trail. I have also read on this site about other hunters experiencing the same thing. I would think with a .50 caliber size hole, there should be a good amount of blood pouring out. I know this doesn't happen to everyone, but it seems to be quite common.

Any thoughts as to why?
Click to expand...

Honestly, it is the light, high-velocity, fast expanding saboted bullets everybody is using with the new inline MZs. Go back to the solid full-caliber lead conicals used prior to the inline rage and you will see full pass-throughs every time and massive blood trails. In the past, with side-hammer guns and big, solid conicals, hunters in my camp used to laugh at the amazingly heavy blood trails produced by 50 caliber guns. Those blood trails could be seen from 50 yards away. Then we switched to inline MZs and light, fast high-tech MZ bullets. We experienced very poor results with these high-tech bullets, with no pass-throughs and no blood trails. Several MZ shot deer were nearly lost due to lack of blood trails. Since then, we've gone back to full-caliber lead conicals and had no more problems, always experiencing full pass-throughs from any angle and excellent blood trails.
 
MUP said:
I rarely have a pass-thru, but rarely do I have to track one either. Shock, or energy transfer is what I strive for from a weapon/bullet combo, not so much just a pass-thru shot. Sometimes, having a pass-thru just means that the bullet went thru so fast that there was no, or minimal expansion, thus less damage to the internals. This is not much better than a broadhead shot, ie, you'll be looking for blood to track more often than having a bang-flop. Just my opinion.
Click to expand...

I've never been a believer in the "shocking power" theory. In fact, it has little backing in true physics. "Knock downs" and instant kills generally only happen when high-velocity bullets hit bone, and won't often occur in pure soft-tissue hits.

In my personal opinion, a non-pass-through hit is a failed bullet design. Although "controlled expansion" (expanding to twice their diameter but still retaining all of their weight) is good for centerfire rifles (due to their smaller diameter), a 50 caliber bullet is plenty big enough without expanding. A half-inch diameter hole through an animal is a BIG hole. I don't want any expansion in my MZ bullets if that prevents pass-through from any angle.
 
BSK said:
MUP said:
I rarely have a pass-thru, but rarely do I have to track one either. Shock, or energy transfer is what I strive for from a weapon/bullet combo, not so much just a pass-thru shot. Sometimes, having a pass-thru just means that the bullet went thru so fast that there was no, or minimal expansion, thus less damage to the internals. This is not much better than a broadhead shot, ie, you'll be looking for blood to track more often than having a bang-flop. Just my opinion.
Click to expand...

I've never been a believer in the "shocking power" theory. In fact, it has little backing in true physics. "Knock downs" and instant kills generally only happen when high-velocity bullets hit bone, and won't often occur in pure soft-tissue hits.

In my personal opinion, a non-pass-through hit is a failed bullet design. Although "controlled expansion" (expanding to twice their diameter but still retaining all of their weight) is good for centerfire rifles (due to their smaller diameter), a 50 caliber bullet is plenty big enough without expanding. A half-inch diameter hole through an animal is a BIG hole. I don't want any expansion in my MZ bullets if that prevents pass-through from any angle.
Click to expand...

I imagine that's true for soft tissue hits, but I try to hit mid to high shoulder and stay away from those soft areas if at all possible. I shoot lead conicals and have very good "mushroom" characteristics from them, and usually find the bullet just under the skin on the other side from the entrance.
 
BSK said:
RKenney said:
I have killed several bucks with a .50 caliber muzzle loader and there was no blood trail. I have also read on this site about other hunters experiencing the same thing. I would think with a .50 caliber size hole, there should be a good amount of blood pouring out. I know this doesn't happen to everyone, but it seems to be quite common.

Any thoughts as to why?
Click to expand...

Honestly, it is the light, high-velocity, fast expanding saboted bullets everybody is using with the new inline MZs. Go back to the solid full-caliber lead conicals used prior to the inline rage and you will see full pass-throughs every time and massive blood trails. In the past, with side-hammer guns and big, solid conicals, hunters in my camp used to laugh at the amazingly heavy blood trails produced by 50 caliber guns. Those blood trails could be seen from 50 yards away. Then we switched to inline MZs and light, fast high-tech MZ bullets. We experienced very poor results with these high-tech bullets, with no pass-throughs and no blood trails. Several MZ shot deer were nearly lost due to lack of blood trails. Since then, we've gone back to full-caliber lead conicals and had no more problems, always experiencing full pass-throughs from any angle and excellent blood trails.
Click to expand...

this is why you see no blood.

my question is, (because i thought about doing it) is can you take the all lead conical bullet and load it into an inline?? I'm sure you can, but my question is can it be done easily? i would assume they are tougher to get down the bore and that can be problematic in a tree stand.

As for my quick fix i just switched to bonded bullets. they stay together better and so far have produced a pass though with lots of blood.
 
MUP said:
I imagine that's true for soft tissue hits, but I try to hit mid to high shoulder and stay away from those soft areas if at all possible.
Click to expand...

The mid to high shoulder shot is THE MOST LIKELY to cause instant knock-downs. Impact with the shoulder blade can be transmitted directly to the spine and spinal cord.
 
Bone Collector said:
my question is, (because i thought about doing it) is can you take the all lead conical bullet and load it into an inline?? I'm sure you can, but my question is can it be done easily? i would assume they are tougher to get down the bore and that can be problematic in a tree stand.
Click to expand...

With today's very clean powders (Triple 7, etc.), yes, they can be reloaded fairly easily in today's inlines. However, with true black-powder (far more fouling of the barrel) it can be a bit difficult on a reload from the stand.
 
What BSK said X2. With .50 cal who needs expansion? I want 2 holes in that Buck. Penetration is king. Can't find 'em without blood.
 
STEELMAN said:
What BSK said X2. With .50 cal who needs expansion? I want 2 holes in that Buck. Penetration is king. Can't find 'em without blood.
Click to expand...

You most certainly can, if they don't take a step after being shot. ;)
 
BSK said:
MUP said:
I imagine that's true for soft tissue hits, but I try to hit mid to high shoulder and stay away from those soft areas if at all possible.
Click to expand...

The mid to high shoulder shot is THE MOST LIKELY to cause instant knock-downs. Impact with the shoulder blade can be transmitted directly to the spine and spinal cord.
Click to expand...

And I count on that for sure. The only draw back I see with that shot is the loss of some shoulder meat, but one big positive is the quick kill with very little to no suffering from the animal.
 
I seem to get the best of both worlds out of my Savage smokeless with 250 grn Hornady XTP bullets. I most always get a passthru with great bullet expansion to boot, very large exit holes not unlike some .30 cal rifles I shoot them with. Im sure this is associated with the very high velocities that the smokelss powder will push the big 250 grn bullet.
 

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