Tarsal Glands

[Food Plot 101]

I don't know why I do this but I've noticed that several does(middle aged and up)that show up on trail came pics don't have or didn't have darkened hocks either now or during season. Does this mean anything to anyone? I wonder if: a)doe's already been bred so no need in rubbin' the legs together or b)doe has not or won't cycle this year, or c) doe didn't cycle because of environmental conditions of excess heat, drought,lack of mast(nutrition) or all the above.

 

[Mike Belt]

I always pay close attention to the hock glands on the does I see. I've never seen a doe in estrus that didn't have darkened hocks. Once they do get the dark, tarry hocks and they've been bred they may lighten up some by the end of the season but they should still be darkened. This year right up til the end of the season I was still seeing the majority of does with creamy white to light buff colored hocks seemingly not in heat or bred yet.

Over the last couple of years I've been seeing more and more fawns (very young fawns at that) late September into mid October. The late freeze and drought we had last year is said to be the blame for the late/crazy rut timing we've had this past season and will be the scape goat clause for the late fawn births this spring/summer. I'm not so convinced of that. I'm also not convinced that the doe to buck ratio heavily favoring does is the culprit because where I hunt the ratio is in good shape. I believe the rut starts on or about the same time yearly (give or take a week) in my hunting area. I also believe that for whatever reasons, there are more does yearly not entering estrus as early as before thus dropping fawns later each year. The only logical explanation I can come up with is that the more later fawns are dropped, the later into the season (and beyond the end of the season) those same doe fawns enter estrous thus expanding the typical timing of birthing. In effect the breeding seems to be swinging later into the season every year.

 

[thejedi]

I always pay close attention to the hock glands on the does I see. I've never seen a doe in estrus that didn't have darkened hocks. Once they do get the dark, tarry hocks and they've been bred they may lighten up some by the end of the season but they should still be darkened. This year right up til the end of the season I was still seeing the majority of does with creamy white to light buff colored hocks seemingly not in heat or bred yet.

Over the last couple of years I've been seeing more and more fawns (very young fawns at that) late September into mid October. The late freeze and drought we had last year is said to be the blame for the late/crazy rut timing we've had this past season and will be the scape goat clause for the late fawn births this spring/summer. I'm not so convinced of that. I'm also not convinced that the doe to buck ratio heavily favoring does is the culprit because where I hunt the ratio is in good shape. I believe the rut starts on or about the same time yearly (give or take a week) in my hunting area. I also believe that for whatever reasons, there are more does yearly not entering estrus as early as before thus dropping fawns later each year. The only logical explanation I can come up with is that the more later fawns are dropped, the later into the season (and beyond the end of the season) those same doe fawns enter estrous thus expanding the typical timing of birthing. In effect the breeding seems to be swinging later into the season every year.

That makes sense to me.

 

[gil1]

Over the last couple of years I've been seeing more and more fawns (very young fawns at that) late September into mid October. The late freeze and drought we had last year is said to be the blame for the late/crazy rut timing we've had this past season and will be the scape goat clause for the late fawn births this spring/summer. I'm not so convinced of that. I'm also not convinced that the doe to buck ratio heavily favoring does is the culprit because where I hunt the ratio is in good shape. I believe the rut starts on or about the same time yearly (give or take a week) in my hunting area. I also believe that for whatever reasons, there are more does yearly not entering estrus as early as before thus dropping fawns later each year. The only logical explanation I can come up with is that the more later fawns are dropped, the later into the season (and beyond the end of the season) those same doe fawns enter estrous thus expanding the typical timing of birthing. In effect the breeding seems to be swinging later into the season every year.

I was just thinking about all this yesterday and had some of the same conclusions (or guesses in my case). I hadn't noticed the late breeding until this year, but it was a really wacked out year. In addition to the late fawns, etc., I'm wondering if does were just stressed this year. I've witnessed the whacked out buck/doe ratio on properties before, but it's never THAT whacked out and it never effects the rut anything like the lateness of the rut this year. The drought was brutal on my lease, and we have very little water to begin with. Even though they were adaptive enough to survive the drought and less food and some had to survive EHD, could it be that they were so stressed that they went into estrous late?

It was significant enough to where the "second rut" was much more active than the "primary rut," and I'd never even seen evidence of a second rut until this year.

I know this - I learned a ton this season about deer, but I doubt all that I gleaned will resurface much in the future. It was such a freakish year that I doubt the circumstances will happen again any time soon. Learn from this year, but toss this year's data out because you can't compare the conditions to any year I can remember.

 

[BSK]

Over the last 20 years previous to this year, our rut has been fairly destinct and only varied in timing by shifting slightly earlier each year due to improvements in herd dynamics and health. I had never witnessed environmental conditions making the least bit of difference in rut timing. However, this year all of my anecdotal data suggested that our local peak rut was at least 2 weeks later than normal. I have no idea what caused this beyond physical stress in the herd.

It was significant enough to where the "second rut" was much more active than the "primary rut," and I'd never even seen evidence of a second rut until this year.

That is exactly what we experienced. We've only rarely seen any secondary rutting activity, yet this year not only was there a destinct 2nd rut 28 days after the the 1st, the 2nd rut appeared to be stronger than the 1st.

 

[Mike Belt]

I don't doubt for a minute that the conditions last year factored into the rut we saw during the season. I also know that the better sex and age structured a herd, the more closely timed the rutting should be as well as generally pushing that timing ahead. What I am saying is that in MY daylight observations, I'm seeing more and more late born fawns and more rutting going on later in the season than just 5 years prior, and that's not just reserved for this past season. I know you can't base much on daylight observations but it sure appears to me that over the last 2-3 years much of the breeding is being done later in the year.