State Wide Limits? Why?

[landman]

All this talk about needing state why Limts being the same makes me ask why?????

So many in unit A&B say on here they need the 3 Buck Limits cause they can't kill does, and there isn't enough does around to allow it
That seems like Hunter Data to me...I don't hunt those units, I rely on people who actually do hunt them, not a office guy in Nashville.

Per BBG who has seemed to disappear from TNDeer for some unknown reason himself stated that Unit L isn't killing enough does, and at
the same time hunters post on here that some areas in Unit L need more killed and some say its time to cut back from 3 a day to 5 per year.
it seems to me that the Hunters are stating that there SHOULD BE different limits for different parts of the state.

LOOK at the TN of the US Map, how can you say limits for any wild game should be the same from one end of the state to the other...

Yes I DO FEEL its time for TN to get rid of the state wide buck limit, make it 4 or 5 in units A & B I don't really care...

and before you say it TN IS A TROPHY STATE TO MANY, MYSELF INCLUDING, I consider bucks I kill to be Trophy's to me and to many others
Ask AL, GA, FL and MS guys why they come here, some of them tell me they can't find a 120" deer
No it will never be a Iowa or Illinois...

But WHY are SO many saying they don't want TN to become a 2 Buck or 1 Buck Limit cause they DON'T WANT TN TO BE A TROPHY STATE...
I guess they think that dropping the limit will cause that to happen? Doesn't make sense

If TN should have the same buck limit state wide, then shouldn't it have the same Doe limit state wide?

 

[WG Taxidermist]

I don't know about unit A and B but I hunt unit L and know there are plenty of deer here. NO I don't think the limits should be the same across the whole state because there is to many variables. I think if there was any change in unit L limit I think for every buck tag you must tag a doe. I know alot of the state couldn't support this but I think unit L could and it would help with the doe population.

Sent from somewhere in the sticks using Tapatalk

 

[scn]

All this talk about needing state why Limts being the same makes me ask why?????

So many in unit A&B say on here they need the 3 Buck Limits cause they can't kill does, and there isn't enough does around to allow it
That seems like Hunter Data to me...I don't hunt those units, I rely on people who actually do hunt them, not a office guy in Nashville.

Per BBG who has seemed to disappear from TNDeer for some unknown reason himself stated that Unit L isn't killing enough does, and at
the same time hunters post on here that some areas in Unit L need more killed and some say its time to cut back from 3 a day to 5 per year.
it seems to me that the Hunters are stating that there SHOULD BE different limits for different parts of the state.

LOOK at the TN of the US Map, how can you say limits for any wild game should be the same from one end of the state to the other...

Yes I DO FEEL its time for TN to get rid of the state wide buck limit, make it 4 or 5 in units A & B I don't really care...

and before you say it TN IS A TROPHY STATE TO MANY, MYSELF INCLUDING, I consider bucks I kill to be Trophy's to me and to many others
Ask AL, GA, FL and MS guys why they come here, some of them tell me they can't find a 120" deer
No it will never be a Iowa or Illinois...

But WHY are SO many saying they don't want TN to become a 2 Buck or 1 Buck Limit cause they DON'T WANT TN TO BE A TROPHY STATE...
I guess they think that dropping the limit will cause that to happen? Doesn't make sense

If TN should have the same buck limit state wide, then shouldn't it have the same Doe limit state wide?

There is no way that there should be the same antlerless limit statewide. There are Unit B counties where increased antlerless kill would be extremely counterproductive.

And, IMO, if there is not a statewide buck limit or if the state does not issue some type of physical tag for bucks, there is NO way that the buck limit can be enforced under the current check in system.

 

[scn]

I don't know about unit A and B but I hunt unit L and know there are plenty of deer here. NO I don't think the limits should be the same across the whole state because there is to many variables. I think if there was any change in unit L limit I think for every buck tag you must tag a doe. I know alot of the state couldn't support this but I think unit L could and it would help with the doe population.

Sent from somewhere in the sticks using Tapatalk

If Unit L had a "doe" problem, your idea might have merit. But, there are places in Unit L that do not need additional antlerless pressure.

Plus, under the current check in system, there is NO way to enforce having to tag a doe for every buck when all a hunter has to do is go to a computer to check in a doe for their next buck tag. It is totally unenforceable.

 

[WG Taxidermist]

I don't know about unit A and B but I hunt unit L and know there are plenty of deer here. NO I don't think the limits should be the same across the whole state because there is to many variables. I think if there was any change in unit L limit I think for every buck tag you must tag a doe. I know alot of the state couldn't support this but I think unit L could and it would help with the doe population.

Sent from somewhere in the sticks using Tapatalk

If Unit L had a "doe" problem, your idea might have merit. But, there are places in Unit L that do not need additional antlerless pressure.

Plus, under the current check in system, there is NO way to enforce having to tag a doe for every buck when all a hunter has to do is go to a computer to check in a doe for their next buck tag. It is totally unenforceable.

That's true. Just as easy as it would be to tag so called SAVED bucks under their kids or whoever name they wanted so they could kill multiples.

Sent from somewhere in the sticks using Tapatalk

 

[TX300mag]

All this talk about needing state why Limts being the same makes me ask why?????

So many in unit A&B say on here they need the 3 Buck Limits cause they can't kill does, and there isn't enough does around to allow it
That seems like Hunter Data to me...I don't hunt those units, I rely on people who actually do hunt them, not a office guy in Nashville.

Per BBG who has seemed to disappear from TNDeer for some unknown reason himself stated that Unit L isn't killing enough does, and at
the same time hunters post on here that some areas in Unit L need more killed and some say its time to cut back from 3 a day to 5 per year.
it seems to me that the Hunters are stating that there SHOULD BE different limits for different parts of the state.

LOOK at the TN of the US Map, how can you say limits for any wild game should be the same from one end of the state to the other...

Yes I DO FEEL its time for TN to get rid of the state wide buck limit, make it 4 or 5 in units A & B I don't really care...

and before you say it TN IS A TROPHY STATE TO MANY, MYSELF INCLUDING, I consider bucks I kill to be Trophy's to me and to many others
Ask AL, GA, FL and MS guys why they come here, some of them tell me they can't find a 120" deer
No it will never be a Iowa or Illinois...

But WHY are SO many saying they don't want TN to become a 2 Buck or 1 Buck Limit cause they DON'T WANT TN TO BE A TROPHY STATE...
I guess they think that dropping the limit will cause that to happen? Doesn't make sense

If TN should have the same buck limit state wide, then shouldn't it have the same Doe limit state wide?

VERY good post, Landman. Those are all excellent questions. I'll attempt to answer the ones I can and maybe it will give a little better understanding from the perspective of someone who enjoys Tennessee deer hunting for what it is (with regards to current seasons, regulations, etc).

The 3/does a day shouldn't be dropped IMO because it's hard to get hunters to kill does, especially consistently (my perspective from my experiences, not a talking point from the agency). I can narrow hunters I know into two categories: 1. those who don't kill does or occasionally kill a doe and 2. Those who kill several does. Of the hunters I know, 20% kill AT LEAST 80% or more of the does. If you limit the second group to 3 total (which I've heard proposed) then you've essentially tied the hands of the group that actually kills does. From my experience this group normally hunts several properties out of necessity and NORMALLY aren't killing LOTS of one particular property but rather several. I agree that some areas need restrictions while some need more harvest, but these variables happen even within relatively small geographical areas, certainly within the same county. Large scale regional restrictions because SOME areas might benefit from it could actually be hindering others.

There is NOTHING wrong with being a trophy hunter. There's nothing wrong with being a meat hunter. There's nothing wrong with being a casual hunter, there's nothing wrong with being a serious hunter. There's nothing wrong with hunting and rarely or never killing a deer, and there's nothing wrong with the guy that kills more deer than I think he should. As long Tennessee's deer herd is stable, a hunter has maximum flexibility to hunt until he finds whatever style suits him and then evolve to others if he wants.

I don't think a 2-buck limit will make TN a trophy state. I think it may improve SOME, but I think it would be hard to gauge how much considering to most of us buck hunting is consistently improving. I do think there is a possibility that many won't see the improvements they want to see, so something ELSE will be on the table to give up next. Could it be shortening the seasons? Further reduction in buck limits? Antler restrictions? Weapon restrictions? Who knows, but every one of these I just mentioned are regularly stated as wishes by hunters. That's why I believe the commission setting additional limits beyond what biologists tell them are necessary is a change in direction and will open doors to special interest groups all fighting for what they feel is best for EVERYBODY.

When I say I appreciate TN for what it is, I'm not implying that others don't-just simply stating I think we have SEVERAL things going for us that other states don't. 1. Lots of public hunting opportunity, and QUALITY at that 2. Long seasons 3. Liberal bag limits that allow hunters to manage 4. Good weapons opportunity 5. A healthy deer herd with lots of deer to hunt

I hate to see any of these taken away, even little by little. Most of my hunting is done here because of the opportunity. My season in TX is basically over on opening day as our bucks show up and we shoot them. There are PLENTY of them, trust me. It's not unusual to see 10 bucks in a sitting and several of them be nice bucks. But the state decides to limit us to one because of the special interest groups. Sure, they throw you a bone by letting you shoot a spike, but I don't shoot yearlings. Does aren't legal without tags in general season, so unless I'm given one my hunting's done. Ohio is one buck, but I understand the reasoning is different as to why. I don't hunt during the rut because I'm not sure I would make the drive back during gun season if my one tag is filled. That's when my friends are there, that's when I want to be there.

I don't have access to large tracts of land under management in TN. Since I don't want to put too much pressure (harvest OR hunting) I'm hoping to hunt 8-10 different properties next year both public and private. If I DID kill two bucks during the first week of MZ, that would only cover 20-25% of the areas I would hunt. That third buck tag is a great opportunity to keep hunting. Tennessee doesn't force these type of limitations on me. When it's necessary to restrict everyone to keep the deer herd afloat, I'll be first in line to support restrictions.

 

[timberjack86]

Heres whats going to happen, when you decrease the buck limits east TN will move to unit L myself included.

 

[fishboy1]

Why state wide?

1. simplicity. do you want to carry around a phone book full of regulations to keep track of what the limits are on each individual property you hunt? Or do you want to risk getting arrested for poaching if you inadvertently cross a boundary and kill something that is legal 100yds away but not on this side of the boundary? (Old Hickory and Cordell Hull WMA's both have different zones with different seasons so you better know where you are hunting and where the line is )

2. Enforcement. Enforcing the laws we have on the books already is a huge job. Chopping the state up into small pieces to manage them on a micro level would be impossible to enforce. IF an officer does catch somebody, the judge is likely to let them off due to things being too complicated.

In a perfect world, each property would be individually managed, and that management plan would be blended with surrounding properties to produce the healthiest deer herd possible. BUT a governmental agency is not set up to do that and imagine the level of intrusion that would be necessary for them TO do that.... No thanks.

 

[Mike Belt]

All valid points but (always a but, lol) do you think simplicity just for the sake of simplicity outweighs what might be the better resource options? Just speaking for myself, if I was hunting a particular area (for the first or hundredth time) I'd know and understand the rules. If I didn't I'd clarify them beforehand. I'd like to give that much credit to anyone else that might be carrying a gun around me in the woods.

 

[tn droptine]

Shoot, if you really want to get technical, then how's come there is a statewide season? Why not break it down into zones where those who are further south get to hunt more of their rut as well.

Nothing anyone does will ever make everyone happy - I say just leave things as they are

 

[contendershooter]

I posted this question in another blog, but what is driving all of this? Is there private hunting groups or guides wanting this 2 buck limit? Do we really have a unspoken buck/doe ratio problem? Are we in unit L not killing enough does? I mean last year I got a good 9pt the opening day of muzzleloader, seen another good 8 point 15 minutes after I shot the 9 point and never seen another deer period the remainder of the year, and I hunt in Unit L near the Cheatham/Davidson county line. Another issue is I have my deer processed and if I can get a buck over a doe I will due to the processing costs. I will take a doe as deer meat is deer meat, but I would prefer to bag a buck as I don't see that many dear year over year. We have plenty of does around as I see tons of them in the spring and early fall, but I hunt hollows and thick woods, no cornfields, soybean fields, food plots, etc around... When I hunted Macon county on near 500 acres years ago that was woods surrounded by corn and soybean fields, the pickings were more plentyful for both bucks and big does

I guess I don't understand what dropping the buck limit to a two buck limit will accomplish