rut question

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DirtyBear0311

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Sep 1, 2012
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City & State/Province
Milan, TN
So I know that the moon and other gravitational factors have nothing to do with it, but what exactly does influence the timing of the rut in particular areas? Is it that the timing really is unchanged from season to season and if so, cant all of the areas simply be mapped?
 
What plinker said.

It is the same time every single year, give or take about 7 days. Temperature is the biggest factor in seeing deer. When its warm, this is when you hear hunters say the rut hasn't started yet, when really, they are doing the majority of that activity at night. My favorite temperatures for seeing the most rut activity in my area is 28-38 degrees.
 
plinker22 said:
Secret Tip: Call your Local County Road Department. Ask what 5 days do they find/pick-up the most road kill deer?

There is your "Local Rut". Your welcome. :)


Haha, good tip. Thanks
 
DirtyBear0311 said:
Is it that the timing really is unchanged from season to season and if so, cant all of the areas simply be mapped?

Correct. In any given location, breeding will peak around the same date (give or take a couple of days) every year. And yes, this can be mapped. In fact, some state wildlife agencies publish breeding date maps for their individual state. As an example, here is one such map for the state of Mississippi:

http://www.mdwfp.com/wildlife-hunting/d ... e-map.aspx

Just remember that these average breeding dates are the average of all known conception dates for that location. However, don't think all breeding occurs on that exact date. Even in areas with a short and intense rut, 95% of conceptions are spread across 5 or 6 weeks. In areas with very strung out rut, 95% of conceptions may be strung out over several months.

When I or others discuss "peak breeding" we are often talking about the 10-14 day window within the breeding season when 50+% of does conceive. Even in areas with a tight rut that takes 5-6 weeks to complete, the conception dates are not equally spread across those weeks. Conceptions will form a very predictable pattern across this time frame, with the majority packed into a peak two week period (and sometimes as short as 10 days) towards the front end of the breeding season. As an example, below is a graph of real-world conception dates I helped compile for a research project. This local deer population had a very tightly timed rut, in that all known conceptions occurred over a 6 week period. Each data point displayed is the percent of conceptions that occurred during a 7 day period (see the dates along the bottom of the graph). Notice how conceptions peaked early in the process, with 65% of conceptions occurring during the 2nd (Nov. 15-21) and 3rd week (Nov. 22-28). In fact, more than 50% of conceptions occurred in a 10-day window within those peak two weeks, which I would refer to as the "peak of breeding" (If I remember correctly, that 10-day window was Nov. 17-26). This distribution of conception dates is quite classic for most localized deer populations, although the actual dates will be different for each location. Some locations have peak breeding windows in late October, and some not until February.




So I know that the moon and other gravitational factors have nothing to do with it, but what exactly does influence the timing of the rut in particular areas?

Peak breeding is different in different locations primarily due to Natural Selection. In essence, whatever time of the year will produce the highest fawn survival drives when breeding will occur (approximately 200 days prior to peak fawn survival conditions). So what really drives breeding dates is what fawning dates will produce the highest fawn survival. Now sometimes the reasons why particular fawning dates produce the highest fawn survival is easy to deduce, but it many situations we really have no idea why one set of fawning dates is better in location A while a different set of fawning dates is better in location B (resulting in different peak breeding dates between the two locations).

Beyond Natural Selection, other factors can contribute to changes in breeding from year to year, although often these changes only occur slowly over a number of years. For example, poor herd dynamics, such as skewed adult sex ratios and poor buck age structure (most bucks are very young) have been shown to delay breeding. However, in TN, differences in herd dynamics can probably only delay breeding dates 7-10 days. In the Deep South, they have been shown to delay breeding by a month or more. In the North, breeding dates are so strongly genetically driven that differences in herd dynamics appears to play no role in breeding timing.

In addition, poor doe health can delay breeding (something I believe many in TN witnessed during the big EHD outbreak in 2007).
 
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Great post BSK.

Have you ever considered writing a book? I'm not being sarcastic but serious...I subscribe to your info and would like to see it in print one day. Maybe the mods can make some of your best posts stickies at the top of this forum.
 
Why pay for it when you can get all you want here on TNdeer for free! ;)

But honestly, yes, I have considered writing more than what I have out there now (mostly magazine articles, but also a book on management and a couple of chapters in various books). But actually sitting down and writing it is the hard part! Plus, I never feel I know enough. I don't have enough of "the answers" yet (and probably never will to be comfortable).
 
Great info BSK, thanks a lot. Has TN ever thought about attempting to map the average conception days? I now a project like that would take many years to complete but it would still be worth it to the sportsmen.

Also, if we did have a map of the average conception dates then that map would be able to help point out negative impacts on the herd when changes in the timing did occur. I know that this means a near constant herd and conception observation would need to be made but in order to really catch a major change in timing, but it could be worth it to help negate negative impacts on the herd in a certain area.
 
DirtyBear0311 said:
Great info BSK, thanks a lot. Has TN ever thought about attempting to map the average conception days? I now a project like that would take many years to complete but it would still be worth it to the sportsmen.

I'm sure BGG can comment on that in greater detail, but I have seen peak conception date data for various locations in TN (published by the TWRA).


Also, if we did have a map of the average conception dates then that map would be able to help point out negative impacts on the herd when changes in the timing did occur. I know that this means a near constant herd and conception observation would need to be made but in order to really catch a major change in timing, but it could be worth it to help negate negative impacts on the herd in a certain area.

This could possibly be helpful, but honestly in TN, changes in peak breeding dates due to "something wrong" that is fixable are often fairly subtle and slow to occur. For instance, as the herd dynamics in my are have greatly improved over the last 2 decades, breeding dates have only slowly shifted forwards about 7-10 days. If I hadn't been tracking it closely, I would have hardly noticed.
 
I guess since it takes so long for any negative effects to show up in the herd via changes in conception time that it wouldn't be helpful in anything except long-term diagnostics. But then again, there are probably better and more concise ways to determine negative effects on the herd than just what I was talking about.
 
DirtyBear0311 said:
...But then again, there are probably better and more concise ways to determine negative effects on the herd than just what I was talking about.

Unquestionably, and if the TWRA would continue to run thermal imaging censuses around the state, they would see them. Although I realize how expensive/manpower-intensive those censuses are.
 
They (TWRA) should have wildlife biology students from various colleges conduct the censuses. That and they should offer lots of non-paying internships to the same students. That would be a win-win. TWRA gets their censuses completed and have a better understanding of an areas herd while the students get the internships and volunteer work in that they all need.
 
Although in any given location, breeding occurs at the same time every year, hunters often (rightfully) claim they don't see rutting activity peak at the same time every year. Why is this? It is probably linked to weather patterns driving more breeding/rutting activity into daylight where hunters can see it.

Many hunters question the fact that deer limit most of their breeding activity to night-time hours. But think about it. Studies have indicated the average doe is mounted approximately 6 times during her 24-48 hour estrus. If an area only has 20 does, that's still around 120 mountings per rut. With that many mountings and the amount of hours many hunters spend in the woods during the rut, hunters witnessing mountings should be commonplace. Yet they aren't. Even experienced hunters, as well as researchers that work with deer daily, rarely witness mountings. Few people have ever witnessed more than a handful of mountings in their entire lifetimes. That's because the vast majority of breeding occurs at night. Yet sudden shifts in conditions (most likely weather changes) can cause a sudden surge of breeding activity into daylight hours, where hunters will see it and think "the rut is on." Yet these surges do not occur at the same time every year, hence hunters believe the rut is occurring at different times from year to year.

I once worked a major research project where we were able to collect a large number of fetuses each year and clearly establish when breeding was occurring. In this study, which lasted several years, peak breeding dates did not shift more than a day or to from year to year. Yet hunters hunting the area, when surveyed, reported that peak OBSERVED rutting activity changed dramatically from year to year, with an earliest to latest range of four weeks over the duration of the project. Interestingly, hunters would agree on when peak activity occurred in a given year, and whether it was earlier or later than normal. Because all hunters were seeing peak daylight activity occurring at the same time, the reason for peak daylight activity occurring at time other than actual peak breeding had to be something environmental. Although I could never find one conclusive cause of these peaks of daylight activity not associated with the actual peak of breeding, they often coincided with sudden changes in weather conditions, such as a cold front passing through and a sudden drop in temperatures.
 

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