Food Plots My woodland clearing plot

[Scioto]

Posted about this in the serious deer hunting forum. Here's my plan. I'll post some pics when I remember how to do that.

Went out last weekend and sprayed and sprayed good. Cut some. Plan to return to prep, till and seed in a couple of weeks when rain is forecast.

Didn't bother with a soil test. Lazy perhaps. Instead, I'm just going with a rule of thumb 2 tons lime per acre for this thin, clay TN highland soil. That translates to @ 640 lbs of lime for this micro plot, but I'll haul 8 40 lb bags on my ATV and spread it with my lawn spreader (with a hand spreader as backup and for the seeds). Will add 40 lbs of 13-13-13. Hope to hit it again with the remaining 320 lbs or so of lime in early October.

Will use a steel rake and focus mainly on the thin spots and strips. Wish I could burn it, but it's just me and leased ground. Will bring a pike mattock for some grass clumps adjacent to the thin areas to widen those, but plan to mostly leave the grass to continue dying and break it up mainly by running over it a lot with my ATV. I should make it two trips - (1) do the ground prep, and spray again, and (2) return and seed - but I don't think time, work and family will allow me to do that. Plan to broadcast 2-4 lbs of Imperial Clover mix, maybe 10 lbs of Jackson Wheat, and 2-3 lbs of rape and see what happens.

What do you think about spraying some of the grass areas again and broadcast seed over that grass 3 hours later? Do you think the Round Up will kill the wheat, clover and rape so soon after being applied?

 

[Scioto]

Posted about this in the serious deer hunting forum. Here's my plan. I'll post some pics when I remember how to do that.

Went out last weekend and sprayed and sprayed good. Cut some. Plan to return to prep, till and seed in a couple of weeks when rain is forecast.

Didn't bother with a soil test. Lazy perhaps. Instead, I'm just going with a rule of thumb 2 tons lime per acre for this thin, clay TN highland soil. That translates to @ 640 lbs of lime for this micro plot, but I'll haul 8 40 lb bags on my ATV and spread it with my lawn spreader (with a hand spreader as backup and for the seeds). Will add 40 lbs of 13-13-13. Hope to hit it again with the remaining 320 lbs or so of lime in early October.

Will use a steel rake and focus mainly on the thin spots and strips. Wish I could burn it, but it's just me and leased ground. Will bring a pike mattock for some grass clumps adjacent to the thin areas to widen those, but plan to mostly leave the grass to continue dying and break it up mainly by running over it a lot with my ATV. I should make it two trips - (1) do the ground prep, and spray again, and (2) return and seed - but I don't think time, work and family will allow me to do that. Plan to broadcast 2-4 lbs of Imperial Clover mix, maybe 10 lbs of Jackson Wheat, and 2-3 lbs of rape and see what happens.

What do you think about spraying some of the grass areas again and broadcast seed over that grass 3 hours later? Do you think the Round Up will kill the wheat, clover and rape so soon after being applied?

Just FYI. I answered my own question. For anyone else who might be interested, based on my research you can spray gly and broadcast the seeds same day. Anyone disagree?

 

[Hunter 257W]

Roundup has to be sprayed on the green foliage of a plant to kill it. It won't hurt your seeds at all especially if you wait a few hours after spraying so that the liquid dries up before seeding.

I agree with your 2 Tons/acre lime rate. You can skip a soil test and go with that and most of the time be close enough that you'll never know the difference.

 

[Mike Belt]

Before I had a tractor and when I did "hidey hole in the timber" plots I'd carry my rototiller on my tilt trailer to cut up my spots. If you have one you can get by with it and it does a good job. If so plan on spending a lot of down time cleaning the root systems off the tines in between tilling. My plots were small so I got by with liming and fertilizing by hand. Make sure you have plenty of sunlight. Shade plots just don't cut it.

 

[Scioto]

Roundup has to be sprayed on the green foliage of a plant to kill it. It won't hurt your seeds at all especially if you wait a few hours after spraying so that the liquid dries up before seeding.

I agree with your 2 Tons/acre lime rate. You can skip a soil test and go with that and most of the time be close enough that you'll never know the difference.

Thanks 257W.

I can definitely see the necessity of a soil sample for an acre or 1/2 acre plot. Considerable monetary difference between needing to put down one ton instead of two tons of lime. For this micro plot of mine (which might be 1/6 acre) I'll go with the guesstimate.

 

[Scioto]

Before I had a tractor and when I did "hidey hole in the timber" plots I'd carry my rototiller on my tilt trailer to cut up my spots. If you have one you can get by with it and it does a good job. If so plan on spending a lot of down time cleaning the root systems off the tines in between tilling. My plots were small so I got by with liming and fertilizing by hand. Make sure you have plenty of sunlight. Shade plots just don't cut it.

Mike, that's exactly what it is. A "hidey hole." Should get good sun. I don't have much eqiuipment. A rake and ATV.

Excited. Taking another PTO day from work tomorrow and will get it started. Hope to get some rain this weekend. Seems like every other day there's a thunderstorm somewhere so hopefully one shows up over the hidey hole.

 

[Hunt 365]

I spray and plant all the time. Sounds like it's going to be a good plot!

 

[Scioto]

Got it done. Hard work but happy with the site. Very pleased with how the Round Up sprayed two weeks ago killed all the grass. So I cut a few little pines and sprayed some additional areas to expand the plot just a little bit. I ordered my rape and wheat from Seed Ranch. Turns out they sent me the rape but sent Buck Forage oats instead of winter wheat. I went ahead with the oats. I plan to return late Sept/early Oct to spread some more lime and see how things are coming along. Thinking of adding some red clover to the Imperial Whitetail mix, which is mostly ladino, at that time. Should I get some winter wheat to add? I hear deer love the oats but they aren't as winter hardy as the wheat. What has been your experience with Buck Forage oats?

P.S. I was also able to fix my Big Game ground blind. Both "flexi-poles" broke on initial set up. Got some replacement flexible tent poles and was able to rig it better. Love Big Game ladder stands, but their ground blinds are awful. Don't waste your money.

 

[Scioto]

Decided to take advantage of the wife being out of town and the start of a holiday weekend to get out and check out the plot. It looks great!!! Thanks to Mick, 257W, Vermin, 365, spoon, Mike B, branchwater for your advice and help. Sorry if I left anyone out. I'm pumped!!!

 

[Climber]

Sounds like you got a nice little spot worked up. I'm going to start getting mine ready this weekend. I have been experimenting with the "throw and mow" method of plotting the last few years and have had pretty good luck with it so far. I have about 3/4 acre here behind my house that I'm going to do half in durana clover and the other half with oats/crimson clover mix.

 

[MickThompson]

Buck Forage Oats is a more winter hardy variety so you should be ok. I prefer to keep my annuals and perennials separate, and the red clover will go well with the ladino.

 

[catman529]

Not trying to hijack. But why 4,000 pounds of lime per acre? Is your soil very acidic from oak trees? I live around limestone and haven't tested the pH but I would never think to put so much lime down. There's lime in the soil as far as I can tell, because of all the rock. How does the lime benefit your food plot?

 

[Vermin93]

Not trying to hijack. But why 4,000 pounds of lime per acre? Is your soil very acidic from oak trees? I live around limestone and haven't tested the pH but I would never think to put so much lime down. There's lime in the soil as far as I can tell, because of all the rock. How does the lime benefit your food plot?

When I did the first soil test on my plots back in 2014, the pH results were 4.8, which is way below the desired pH range of 6.5 - 7.5 for the clover I was planting. I had read and listened to multiple food plot experts who emphasized the importance of soil pH. Some went so far as to say that spreading fertilizer into soil with poor pH is basically a waste of money because most plants are not able to efficiently access the fertilizer nutrients in a soil with poor pH nearly as well as they can in a soil with good pH. Some of these experts also stated that deer will favor plants grown in soil with the proper pH and nutrient level because the plants will be healthier and essentially "taste" better to the deer. However, I have also heard some experts disagree with that. That said, they all agree that soil in the optimal pH range for what you are planting will yield the most productive food plots.

Here is the guidance from Whitetail Institute, which is pretty much the same guidance you get from the other seed vendors.

2. Adjust Soil pH If Low. If possible, perform a laboratory soil test for a "Giant White Clover" planting. (High quality laboratory soil test kits are available from the Whitetail Institute.) Add any lime recommended in the lab's report to the seedbed. If you don't test your soil with a laboratory soil test kit, then add a minimum of two tons of lime per acre. Disk or till the lime into the seedbed. (Note: If possible, perform Step 2 several months in advance of planting. Making sure soil pH is between 6.5 and 7.5 before you plant is the most important thing you can do to ensure food-plot success!)

 

[MickThompson]

Not trying to hijack. But why 4,000 pounds of lime per acre? Is your soil very acidic from oak trees? I live around limestone and haven't tested the pH but I would never think to put so much lime down. There's lime in the soil as far as I can tell, because of all the rock. How does the lime benefit your food plot?

When it's in rock form, it's not acting in the soil. It's not soluble. Our soils are highly weathered, and generally have a "natural state pH" somewhere in th 5's to low 6's of not corrected. Nutrients leach out in runoff, and fertilizers are salts- 1 part cation (usually the part the plant uses), 1 part anion (the negative charge, or what causes the soil acidity to increase). The big 3 (N, P, and K) are most soluble in the soil solution when the pH is slightly acidic to neutral. Low pH can also affect the soil biology, limiting the growth of beneficial soil microbes.

Remember that pH means "power of Hydrogen" or 10 raised to the x power, so each step on the pH scale is a 10x increase or decrease in acidity, and 2 steps is 100x, and so on. A pH of 5 is 100 times as acidic as a pH of 7

You can overwhelm the system with enough nutrients that some are forced into solution, but you are acidifying the soil when you do this. And lime is cheap-normally around $30 per ton spread on the field, whereas fertilizer is much more expensive, as it must be mined, processed, stored, transported, and mixed before applying. Lime is simply a byproduct of limestone mining.

 

[Scioto]

Not trying to hijack. But why 4,000 pounds of lime per acre? Is your soil very acidic from oak trees? I live around limestone and haven't tested the pH but I would never think to put so much lime down. There's lime in the soil as far as I can tell, because of all the rock. How does the lime benefit your food plot?

Went the lazy route and didn't get a soil test for this "micro plot,". Two tons of lime per acre is what my research suggested and what others on this forum have suggested as a rule of thumb. As Vermin pointed out, that's also WI's recommendation and I'm using their Imperial Whitetail Clover mix.

 

[Scioto]

Buck Forage Oats is a more winter hardy variety so you should be ok. I prefer to keep my annuals and perennials separate, and the red clover will go well with the ladino.

Why keep them separate? Weed control?

 

[MickThompson]

Yes, I can go over my annuals with gly in the summer after they set seed to help keep them clean. It also give me the option of drilling a summer plot into my winter annuals without worrying about competing with or stunting my perennials. I will usually put a little cereal grain in my perennial mixes as a nurse crop.

 

[Hunter 257W]

Not trying to hijack. But why 4,000 pounds of lime per acre? Is your soil very acidic from oak trees? I live around limestone and haven't tested the pH but I would never think to put so much lime down. There's lime in the soil as far as I can tell, because of all the rock. How does the lime benefit your food plot?

What you are saying sounds reasonable, Catman, but it's surprising how low the pH can be even in areas where limestone is predominant. My farm is just a few miles from a big rock quarry where they sell lime yet I had one food plot where I did a soil test and the pH was 5.8. I would have never guessed it to be so low since we'd usually put 1/2 ton per acre out on all our pastures every 2nd or 3rd year for many years. When we stopped keeping cows I quite putting out lime for about 3 years and then the above mentioned soil test was done. I don't recall exact figures but the recommended amount of lime to correct that 5.8 pH was something in the range of 2 tons/acre. I had one 3 acre field that hadn't been limed in many years that I went ahead and put 3 tons/acre lime on and turned it into a food plot. It took most of a truck load but it sure grew some good corn that year.

 

[Scioto]

No rain on the plot since the all-day rain 9/17. No rain in the weekly forecast and nothing in the Accuweather extended until 10/6-7. I don't put much faith in forecasts more than 5 days (and rely mostly on WU and NWS). So not looking good. I broadcast some red clover 9/16 but that probably is or will be a loss after this week. Since I've lived in TN, I don't recall a September this dry. Maybe 2012.

Dr Harper's TN food plot planting guide says up to 10/15 to plant oats and winter rye. Got a bag each and hope to get out there second or third weekend in October with some rain!

 

[Scioto]

It's raining on my food plot. Hurrah! Too little too late? Will see.