Jawbone help... What's your opinion on age

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mattmillard510

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Apr 20, 2015
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308
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Kingsport, TN
I didn't get to keep the other side but based on this side, what's your guys opinion?
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There's a lot of wear on the premolars for that deer to be 3 yr old.....probably 4.
 
If it makes any difference, when I killed this deer, I thought there could be a chance he was 4.5 based of of his body, weight, and other features. When I saw the jawbone, I was a little torn between 3.5 and 4.5. I still am lol


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mattmillard510":18ixr9ea said:
If it makes any difference, when I killed this deer, I thought there could be a chance he was 4.5 based of of his body, weight, and other features. When I saw the jawbone, I was a little torn between 3.5 and 4.5. I still am lol


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I have sent 3 off to be aged and they all was older than the wear and dentine suggested.I knew the deer were older as I watched them grow.I have no faith in ageing the Jaw bone when it comes to mature deer
 
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":2xie6g5m said:
I have sent 3 off to be aged and they all was older than the wear and dentine suggested.
How old did they each age using CA?
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":2xie6g5m said:
I knew the deer were older as I watched them grow.
If you knew their age, then how close or exact was CA for your three deer?
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":2xie6g5m said:
I have no faith in ageing the Jaw bone when it comes to mature deer
It becomes an art with a fair amount of judgement exercised, and unless one accepts the fact that most hunters and biologists underage mature bucks with TR&W method, and that most bucks 3.5+ are likely a year or two older than TR&W suggests, then you are at a complete loss for even guessing their age. The jawbone above is a perfect example that looks like a "tweener", but my money is on 4.5+, notice the "+".
 
When one has history with a particular buck, it's sometimes possible to know that buck's exact age. Having experienced this a few times over the years in my hunting environments, I can tell you that a buck of a particular age will often "appear" (live, in the field) either a year younger or a year older than his actual age, and this appearance is often effected by the angle of your view, the date, and just how much viewing you get.

Among bucks I've killed that were not previously known, I've made more mistakes in pulling the trigger on bucks that ended up being younger rather than older, than what I had field guessed their ages. In each of these circumstances, I felt I'd have been less disappointed had I chosen to let that buck walk, rather than pull the trigger on him. Not to say I wasn't happy, as I consider any deer taken home a true gift to be appreciated. But it's also a great "gift" to get to watch one grow to full maturity, and then take him home.

Very healthy 2 1/2-yr-old bucks will often "look" like a 3 1/2 during the rut. Very healthy 3 1/2's can often "look" like a 4 1/2 during the rut. However, each buck is an individual, and I've seen 4 1/2-yr-old bucks, during the rut, that had the body appearance more in line with an average 2 1/2. The generalities hold, but there will always be exceptions, whether we're aging by looking at teeth or body profiles.

After having killed several top-end 2 1/2's which I believed to be 3 1/2's, I finally decided to simply not pull the trigger on any buck I thought was younger than 4 1/2. That resulted in mistakes being at least 3 1/2. Over the past few years, I've gone back & forth between trying to take bucks no younger than either 4 1/2 or 5 1/2. The last buck I killed was aged at 5 1/2 or older, and I believe he was most likely 6 1/2.

One of the problems in waiting to 5 1/2 is that the 4 1/2-yr-old you pass this year, might shift his range next year, and you might never have another opportunity at him before he dies, even if that's by natural causes. And of course, there is always the possibility he could simply die of whatever cause around 4 1/2.

During the 2014 season, I had the opportunity to take a 4 1/2-yr-old 140-class mainframe 8-pointer that I had been tracking since he was 2 1/2. His routine had changed little from 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 and then to 4 1/2. Having focused more of my attention on a larger antlered 5 1/2 or older buck (which I did kill during that 2014 muzzleloader season), I decided that "nice" 140-class 4 1/2 would be allowed to walk (at least by me, although I had absolutely zero problem with anyone else wanting to take him).

Going into the 2015 season, that "nice" mainframe 8, which would now be 5 1/2, became one of my most targeted bucks.
Surprisingly, not only did I fail to get a trail cam pic which could positively identify him (even during the summer, early fall), but I never saw him. I suspect he most likely died of some natural cause, although it's possible he was killed miles away and I never knew. However, I've had similar to happen before, and a buck I thought had died, suddenly reappears a year or two after he was presumed deceased.

I believe most hunter/mangers are not realizing just how far and wide most bucks range, and can periodically shift their ranges, often way beyond the hunter's property lines or hunting area. The best thing is they often do come back to a previous pattern. So a particular buck you assumed someone else killed after you passed him up as a 3 1/2, he just might surprise you by showing back up as a 5 1/2 right about where you had passed him up as a 3 1/2.

Enjoy the journey, take what makes you happy, and don't worry about what you can't control.
You control your trigger finger, and sometimes little more.
 
mattmillard510":1wnitqco said:
Here's the deer in question
As with the teeth, all I can say is he has the body profile appearance of 3 1/2 or older.

Generally, the antlers can be a poor indicator of age, although there are some generalities, yet those generalities will "generally" only get you within 2 years of the real age. Those antlers could "fit" a top-end 2 1/2 or be within the range of near average for 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 for most parts of Tennessee.

If you know this buck was indeed 4 1/2, am not surprised, and congratulations to you on taking him.
Congratulations, no matter what his age. :)
 
He was an East Tennessee deer, Sullivan County to be exact. The brow tine length on this deer would be very abnormal for a 2.5 but not impossible.

Like I said, weight wise (also a poor indicator of age) he's the heaviest deer I've taken by ten pounds almost. I've killed two deer I knew were 4.5s that were smaller bodied but bigger racked off the same property. Just for comparison. I truly thought 4.5+ when I killed him but the teeth had me thinking 3.5


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Now after all you've shared with us regarding this buck, I would now be comfortable saying my best guess on his age was 4 1/2 or older. :)

Congratulations on taking a fine, mature TN buck!
That's typically a much greater accomplishment than taking one in some other state.
 
mattmillard510":kyb8b17j said:
. . . . . . . the teeth had me thinking 3.5
Just like with humans, some individuals are just genetically born with better teeth, that wear more slowly. Others are born with poorer teeth that wear (or "age") more quickly.

Add to this the diet and food resources, and a deer of any age can "appear" either older or younger, easily by a year.

Whether visually aging on the hoof in the field, or looking at the teeth of dead deer, we're just guessing based on some generalities and reasonable assumptions. We're wrong by a year almost as often as we're correct (at least concerning deer 3 1/2 and older).

By my observations, there is a slight tendency to under-age deer by their teeth, and to over-age them by their live body profiles. This particular buck may be an example of just that.
 
Andy S.":1w6u1zgl said:
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":1w6u1zgl said:
I have sent 3 off to be aged and they all was older than the wear and dentine suggested.
How old did they each age using CA?
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":1w6u1zgl said:
I knew the deer were older as I watched them grow.
If you knew their age, then how close or exact was CA for your three deer?
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER":1w6u1zgl said:
I have no faith in ageing the Jaw bone when it comes to mature deer
It becomes an art with a fair amount of judgement exercised, and unless one accepts the fact that most hunters and biologists underage mature bucks with TR&W method, and that most bucks 3.5+ are likely a year or two older than TR&W suggests, then you are at a complete loss for even guessing their age. The jawbone above is a perfect example that looks like a "tweener", but my money is on 4.5+, notice the "+".
two of the deer was 5 1/2,and one 6 1/2,one of the bucks had a white dot between his eyes and we knew him as a fawn.the jaw bones showed a strong 3 1/2 years of age.these was all 3 mountain deer.I am sure the forage has alot to do with the wear.
 
Makes perfect sense, thanks for sharing RCH. There is nothing like killing bucks 5.5+, congrats to you and whomever else were the fortunate hunters.
 

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