How far is too far?

[fairchaser]

I tried a 50 yard shot on a doe Saturday with my cross bow. You might say that was too risky. I have killed two this year and made perfect shots on both. Not bragging just saying I have some proficiency. I had passed several does on this one trail and had ranged it at 50 yards. I thought if I had one that was broadside and stopped with a two elbow rest, I would try a shot. Well I got the chance but the doe was staring at me. When I shot it seemed as if she was gone before the bolt arrived. I watched the illuminok in slow motion. Nothing on the bolt but humility.

My question is how much reaction time does a deer need to jump the string and how fast does your bow need to be to eliminate this problem?

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I tried a 50 yard shot on a doe Saturday with my cross bow. You might say that was too risky. I have killed two this year and made perfect shots on both. Not bragging just saying I have some proficiency. I had passed several does on this one trail and had ranged it at 50 yards. I thought if I had one that was broadside and stopped with a two elbow rest, I would try a shot. Well I got the chance but the doe was staring at me. When I shot it seemed as if she was gone before the bolt arrived. I watched the illuminok in slow motion. Nothing on the bolt but humility.

My question is how much reaction time does a deer need to jump the string and how fast does your bow need to be to eliminate this problem?

That's a loaded question. I think it will vary between a archers ability and his equipment.

I know you see TV archers shooting deer at 60 yards all the time. Gotta wonder?? How many edits are on the cutting room floor of misses??? The things that make you go HMMMMMMM

Bow speeds and technologies are improving greatly. 15 years ago my comfortable outside range was 25 yards with long shot being 30 yards. My bow now shoots about 30 FPS faster. My arrow shoots 2 inches high at 20 dead at 27 1 inch low at 30 and 6 inches low at 35. So 0 to 30 I am dead nuts. 35 I feel very comfortable shooting but have to have a range finder. 40 yards my arrow drops 9 inches and I consider that my OUTSIDE range or my maximum I am willing to shoot.

I shoot 50 and 60 yards alot at the range and get very respectable groups. By no means would I try to shoot at a deer at those ranges with my current set up because with a single pin and non adjustable site there are just too many varibles in place. I plan on getting a HHR adjustable single pin site in the near future. I may feel more comfortable taking longer shots then but really I have to ask myself. Most of my setups I have my shooting lanes set up where the deer are coming in well within 25 yards. I only have one or two sets where there are 40 yard shot possibility.

I think the key might be to get your sets right before demanding more out of your equipment. Food for thought.

 

[fairchaser]

By the way, I have moved my setup closer to the trail. I was just wondering if it makes a difference if they are looking at you. I nearly always stop my deer with a soft mouth grunt.

 

[tree_ghost]

depends upon the archers ability, mood of the deer, and weather conditions...all of these play a factor in how far is to far.
For example a guy who only practices @ 40 yards standing on the ground and shoots groups the size of a dinner plate probably isn't going to be successful shooting at a deer who just busted you on the draw, is now on high alert, standing at 60 yards in 20mph winds with light rain.
Ive heard guys say it before "he was a little to far but I had to take a shot!"
I practice out to 100 yards regularly with a bow thats shooting right at 310FPS. I can put coke can sized groups on the target @ 60 yards with good consistency, that still doesn't mean I'm going to poke at any deer that comes within 60 yards of my tree...there are many variables to consider before attempting a shot like that...with no "one size fits all" answer

as far as how fast a bow needs to be and how close a deer needs to be before they no longer have the ability to jump the string is a crap shoot IMO. again the demeanor of the animal plays a huge roll in weather they bolt at the sound of a squirrel fart or, its happened to me before, have deer so calm that I was talking on the phone with my wife while they were in bow range. Also the fact that deer have different physical attributes just like humans. Some people are gifted with speed, some strength, others brains, and still yet some have beauty. some deer maybe world class sprinters and could jump the 310FPS arrow at 20 yards while others couldn't jump it at 40... I realize I didn't specifically answer your question but I think in the grand scheme it does...


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[hunttherut]

To me if the deer is relaxed I may try it. If the deer is on edge no way. Practicing at 50 is much different than a real world hunting situation.


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[Southern Sportsman]

From my experience, Xbows are a lot louder than compounds and not that much faster. So, I would be less comfortable at that range with an Xbow.

 

[TNGRIZZLY_]

I think 40 yards it enough for me, I will not try any farther myself. But my Excalibur dvd recommends not to shoot past 40. But like said before, you see all these tv guys shooting around 60+. But good post

 

[fairchaser]

From my experience, Xbows are a lot louder than compounds and not that much faster. So, I would be less comfortable at that range with an Xbow.

Good point SS. I waited until I had a little leaf noise from the wind but it felt like she could see that lighted bolt coming and was having no part of it. Poser is right in that our whitetail deer are twitchy critters with lightening reflexes. Forty yards is gonna be my new maximum range and only under extremely perfect conditions. Any one ever made a fifty yard shot on an alert deer?

 

[jb3]

Never heard a crossbow, so I'm not sure how loud they are. With my bow, range is up to the shooter. My bow is not the fastest, somewhere around 275 fps, but is extremely quiet.

 

[stik]

Never heard a crossbow, so I'm not sure how loud they are.

they sound like somebody just dry-fired a compound

 

[TNDeerGuy]

I'll post the mechanics of the situation and let you guys hash out the rest. A deer can load its legs enough to drop the entire width of its torso (jumping/ducking the string) in .17 seconds on average. For realistic example purposes, a 400gr arrow traveling at 300fps with no wind, will travel 20yds in approx .23 seconds and the deer will hear the sound of the shot around the .04 mark if at 20yds. Now keep in mind, a compound next to a xbow will be quieter on average, all things being equal.

 

[catman529]

20 yards on a deer, but I like them almost under the tree


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[benellivol]

Personally, I don't feel comfortable past 30 ish yards. My longest is 32.

I know a guy that consistently sticks them out to 45 -50 but I'm not that good.

 

[ImThere]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey. Not how far you can shoot

the one and only "ImThere"

 

[Bone Collector]

A lot of people think Xbows can shoot to 60 easy... My brother bought a Parker CB at BPS and the guys told him that he should be able to kill deer to 60 yds... I told him not to shoot at deer passed 40 and he killed his first ever bow deer with it this season at 41. I think she ducked the string, cause he hit her high and back a bit, but he got lucky. I din't tell him that, because I didn't want to spoil the moment. He has limited archery hunting experience. I don't think he realized the deer ducked the string if indeed that is what happened. I think he thinks the bow is too fast for the deer. He killed his second with it this past weekend at 18 yds. Now he is telling me he is reading stuff and it is saying his bow is capable of killing at 60 and it will deliver enough kinetic energy and ft/lbs force.

He doesn't practice that far out, but has a 50 yd line on his scope that he has shot a few times. I told him not to risk it, but I know he will just to try and prove e wrong. I guess we'll see. He may get lucky the first time, but I would guess eventually it will turn out bad.

 

[Cotis]

I'll post the mechanics of the situation and let you guys hash out the rest. A deer can load its legs enough to drop the entire width of its torso (jumping/ducking the string) in .17 seconds on average. For realistic example purposes, a 400gr arrow traveling at 300fps with no wind, will travel 20yds in approx .23 seconds and the deer will hear the sound of the shot around the .04 mark if at 20yds. Now keep in mind, a compound next to a xbow will be quieter on average, all things being equal.

What he said. An alert deer (i.e. one looking at you!) can duck a shot that is greater than 25 to 30 yards. 20 and less it doesn't matter, they can't react fast enough (simple physics). You should have aimed BELOW this deer if you were going to take that shot so she would have ducked into the hit. Either way, it's a low probability shot on an alert deer staring at you at that distance. I learned this the hard way myself. At least you missed it cleanly.

 

[mike243]

My Barnet shoots 345fps had a doe bust me at 10y and was cocked to run.yugo no problem wrong! Gut shot lost deer xbow went into the closet. I will stick with a rifle. Do everybody and the deer a favor if it is loaded to run ect don't shoot it.only shoot when the deer isnt aware that you are there. Just my .02 sorry if folks don't agree

 

[TNDeerGuy]

I'll post the mechanics of the situation and let you guys hash out the rest. A deer can load its legs enough to drop the entire width of its torso (jumping/ducking the string) in .17 seconds on average. For realistic example purposes, a 400gr arrow traveling at 300fps with no wind, will travel 20yds in approx .23 seconds and the deer will hear the sound of the shot around the .04 mark if at 20yds. Now keep in mind, a compound next to a xbow will be quieter on average, all things being equal.

What he said. An alert deer (i.e. one looking at you!) can duck a shot that is greater than 25 to 30 yards. 20 and less it doesn't matter, they can't react fast enough (simple physics). You should have aimed BELOW this deer if you were going to take that shot so she would have ducked into the hit. Either way, it's a low probability shot on an alert deer staring at you at that distance. I learned this the hard way myself. At least you missed it cleanly.

Actually they can duck the shot under 20yds. I shot a doe at 18yds two years ago with a borrowed xbow, because I was having arm problems. It was loud, I knew it was loud, so I held really low--- like bottom of one lung low, anticipating she would react. She did and I hit her in the spine and had to quickly follow up. So, yes they can react and duck at 20yds and under.

 

[fairchaser]

I'll post the mechanics of the situation and let you guys hash out the rest. A deer can load its legs enough to drop the entire width of its torso (jumping/ducking the string) in .17 seconds on average. For realistic example purposes, a 400gr arrow traveling at 300fps with no wind, will travel 20yds in approx .23 seconds and the deer will hear the sound of the shot around the .04 mark if at 20yds. Now keep in mind, a compound next to a xbow will be quieter on average, all things being equal.

Good info TNdeer guy. I've seen the slow motion proof on tv whenever one of the pros shoots over a deer they show the slow motion how the deer ducks to run right as the arrow passes over their back. I almost always stop the deer with a soft mouth grunt because I don't want a moving target. I've never had one duck the arrow this bad but she had plenty of time based on your explanation. My Excalibur shoots 325 fps so it took slightly more than 1/2 second to get there and she could have ducked and run before the bolt reached her. That's what it looked like to me but I was skeptical it was possible until now. Thanks

 

[Realtree]

I've killed one deer at 50 and made a terrible shot but didn't go far. 40 yds is where I'm comfortable with being my max. But I've also missed at 20yds. I guess to me it depends on the reaction of the deer whether them being comfortable at the time of the shot or cautious.

 

[Buzzard Breath]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

 

[catman529]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey. Not how far you can shoot

the one and only "ImThere"

x1000


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[catman529]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

considering your odds of the deer moving forward or ducking the string increase with longer shots, it makes sense to take the closest shot you can get.


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[ImThere]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

If you say so. I was just voicing my opinion. If I was only going to shoot deer at a long distance I would wait for Rifle.

the one and only "ImThere"

 

[FLTENNHUNTER1]

Not sure if this matters but the farther away you are from the deer the quieter the bow is and it might effect how they react.

 

[Buzzard Breath]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

considering your odds of the deer moving forward or ducking the string increase with longer shots, it makes sense to take the closest shot you can get.

To a degree you are right, but of the dozens of times I've assisted with finding shot deer, the straight down, closest you can get shots are the worst with the least amount of blood, if any blood at all. In this case, letting them walk out a little would give you a much better angle for a kill.

 

[catman529]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

considering your odds of the deer moving forward or ducking the string increase with longer shots, it makes sense to take the closest shot you can get.

To a degree you are right, but of the dozens of times I've assisted with finding shot deer, the straight down, closest you can get shots are the worst with the least amount of blood, if any blood at all. In this case, letting them walk out a little would give you a much better angle for a kill.

if the arrow comes out at a steep shot it generally bleeds more... All my best kill shots were 10 yards and under.


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[Buzzard Breath]

Bow hunting is about how close you can get to your prey.

That may be what bow hunting is about for you. But not for me. For me it's about killing animals by utilizing a bow and arrow. Being close is just one of the necessities needed to accomplish this. For some people, it's closer than for others.

If you say so. I was just voicing my opinion. If I was only going to shoot deer at a long distance I would wait for Rifle.

I'm certainly not condoning far shots. I'm just saying that you made a definitive statement about what bow hunting is. But, I've never once walked into the woods bow hunting and wanting to get as close to deer as I can. I only want to get as close as necessary to kill it humanely.

 

[Buzzard Breath]

... All my best kill shots were 10 yards and under.

I'm not going to hijack this thread anymore than I already have. But, I will bow out by saying that I've been bow hunting longer than you've been born and sometimes experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterward.

 

[catman529]

... All my best kill shots were 10 yards and under.

I'm not going to hijack this thread anymore than I already have. But, I will bow out by saying that I've been bow hunting longer than you've been born and sometimes experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterward.

fair enough. I'm gonna keep getting them closer until I learn to shoot better, lol


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