Here we go again..sizing problem.

[Tenntrapper]

I'm not going to try to explain this..I get confused...lol
I'll just present facts..

1) 6.5x55
2) Lee dies
3) I'm using Hornady head space comparator.
4) new Norma brass (loaded and fired once) is measuring 1.765
5) some ppu brass that was loaded and fired several times in an old Swede Mauser, is 1.775 (I believe now that it had a head space issue)
6) running the ppu brass through the sizing die (shell holder touching die) is not changing the length.
7) the ppu brass will not chamber in the new CZ..bolt won't close.
If I'm going to need 1.765(or less) in the new rifle, why won't the sizing die push the shoulder back? What am I missing? Die cut wrong?

Is it time for new/better dies?

Any suggestions on what to do?

 

[bigtex]

Resizing brass does nothing for the over all length.
All brass "stretches" when fired and once it gets too long it needs to be trimmed.

 

[Tenntrapper]

Resizing brass does nothing for the over all length.
All brass "stretches" when fired and once it gets too long it needs to be trimmed.

But the comparator measures to the shoulder.. what it head spaces on. The head space on the Swede was off, and it blew the shoulder forward...fire formed. Now the die won't push it back.

 

[DaveB]

Only info I found on the 6.5x55 says brass should be 2.165 in length.
here is link to SAAMI document and on page 41 you will find specs for your caliber and the lengths
https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/20 ... g-Copy.pdf

The die should bring the brass back to SAAMI specs.

 

[MUP]

Actually in some cases (pun intended) the neck sizing ball can in fact "pull" the shoulder forward as it comes back out of the neck. Lube the necks to keep this action to a minimum.

Also, have you any adjustment left to bring the shell holder up closer to the die? If you're already bottomed out you may need to face some material from the top of the shell holder to get some additional penetration of the case up into the die to contact the shoulder more. And last, or first possibly, you need to trim the brass with a case trimmer to get the proper oal.

 

[Tenntrapper]

Only info I found on the 6.5x55 says brass should be 2.165 in length.
here is link to SAAMI document and on page 41 you will find specs for your caliber and the lengths
https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/20 ... g-Copy.pdf

The die should bring the brass back to SAAMI specs.

It should be noted that I'm not talking about overall length. I zeroed out my caliper on the comparator. I'm measuring the length from base (case head) to the median of the shoulder. The point of mentioning a specific length was to show that it wasn't pushing back the shoulder.

I may have figured out the problem though. The ppu brass had already been neck sized and primed before I realized a problem. As such, I removed the decapping pin to try to push back the shoulder. After thinking there may be some flex since the pin was removed, I just put it back and tried a Norma brass. It pushed shoulder back to 1.764. I may have solved the problem...one that was self created. Now to figure out how to deprime live primers.


Mup, thanks for the suggestion about facing the shell holder, I would like to have a little more leeway. I didn't know you could face them like that. And thanks to the others for the help. It's truly appreciated.

 

[MUP]

I've got a rcbs die set for my 300 WSM that, when bottomed out, gives only about .001" of shoulder bump. Backing it off any at all results in cases that won't chamber in my rifle.

 

[Tenntrapper]

I've got a rcbs die set for my 300 WSM that, when bottomed out, gives only about .001" of shoulder bump. Backing it off any at all results in cases that won't chamber in my rifle.

This is what I was running into...sorta. Do you have any suggestions for deprimming live primers, so I can leave the deprimming pin in the die, and bump the shoulder back? Usually, I just chamber in the rifle and pop them. These won't fit, and I no longer have the Mauser.

 

[MUP]

I've deprimed cases that I've received from someone before that I didn't know the brand of. I slowly ease the ram up on the press, and lightly contact the primer, then slowly increase pressure until the primer releases. I've not had any issues thus far. You could also drop them into a bucket of water for a few days to render them inert before removing them to be extra safe. Regardless, I would still remove them slowly.

This is my personal procedure/process for removing live primers. Be aware that there is still risk involved dealing with live primers, and personal safety equipment is recommended during this process, ie safety glasses and hearing protection.

 

[DaveB]

I have deprimed hundreds following MUP's exact procedure. Never had a problem.

However, a few modifications based on my recent unpleasant experience:

1. The live decapped primer has to have a safe place to go. A 5-gallon bucket with about 3 inches of water would suffice.

2. a leather glove on the hand that doesn't pull the press handle.

3. full coverage eye protection

4. hearing protection.

5. I use a decap die from RCBS and yep, there are two sizes.

I filled the cavities of my press with caulk. I clean it now same as before but now there is no place for anything to accumulate.

 

[fairchaser]

I've had to shorten a die but taking 20 thousands off the length and then move it up or down in the press to get the right head space. I really don't understand why it was made so long but it was.

 

[Tenntrapper]

I'm still holding off deprimming the live ones, but I did size some of the once fired Norma brass today. I measured each one, before and after sizing, and am only getting .001 shoulder setback. Thats bottoming out the shell holder. That should work in the new rifle, I'll just have to make sure I don't short stroke it. I need to either face the die or the shell holder..just for some leeway.

 

[MUP]

You should be good with that measurement, but even different hardness brass could affect that to be less, or possibly more, bc of spring back. I'd keep a close eye on each case sized for ones that may spring back out of tolerance for your chamber.

 

[Tenntrapper]

You should be good with that measurement, but even different hardness brass could affect that to be less, or possibly more, bc of spring back. I'd keep a close eye on each case sized for ones that may spring back out of tolerance for your chamber.

Without the ppu brass, all I've got is the Norma and a box of Lapua that I haven't even opened yet. Don't know what I will run into there.. hopefully nothing. I'm hoping I can get the ppu deprimmed. I've got about 75 pieces of it, and it's mostly all primed. I like using it for "plinking" loads.
Thanks again for the help Mup, it's appreciated.

 

[splatter]

that is lee dies for you. I have 2 sets one in 223 and one in 243 that do the same thing. only thing you can do is shorten die or buy some rcbs. oh and i have several sets of lee dies rifle and pistol, not trying to trash lee, just the way it is.

 

[Hardwoodmaterials]

I have a few sets of LEE dies and have never had an issue but I also use the LEE shell holders with them. I think some of the shell holders are thicker than others and that may be an issue for some.

 

[Omega]

I've only had an issue with Lee dies once, with 300Blk, with which I had to take a bit off the shell holder to get it to form correctly. But I have now switched all my shell holders to RCBS, it holds the shells much tighter, which is the reason I had a few stuck cases with 5.56 style cases. I also formed the case two or three times, size, turn, size, (hold it down a sec or two) so it could pass the gauge I used. You may be getting some spring back on the brass, though I would not think it would be as much as you state, but who knows. I would try taking some off the shell holder, until it consistently gives you the shoulder setback you are looking for, and also, depending on your press, you may have to make sure it cams over once it touches the shell holder.