fluted barrel question

[Gravey]

Other than looking cool what is the purpose of a fluted barrel?

 

[KubotaM4900]

Very good question I was wondering that too...I like my barrels fluted gives some character. Probably about as useful as a fluted bolt,now those look cool as it gets.

 

[7-08 fan]

Stiffens the barrel (more accuracy potential) and increases the surface area which aids cooling!

x2

 

[Model70Man]

Stiffens the barrel (more accuracy potential) and increases the surface area which aids cooling!

How does removing metal increase stiffness?
Fluting reduces weight of a heavier contour barrel to the weight of a smaller contour barrel. They will be more rigid because of the heavier contour and not because of the fluting. Like said earlier, it also speeds up cooling.

 

[paincave_2000]

Took from Lilja website.

Fluting barrels for both competitive target and hunting rifles is quite popular. There are two advantages to using a fluted barrel. Improved accuracy is one advantage because of increased barrel stiffness. If we compare a fluted barrel to one that is not fluted, both weighing the same, the fluted barrel is stiffer. This is because the fluted barrel will be of a larger diameter than the unfluted barrel of the same weight and length. Increasing the diameter of a barrel greatly increases its rigidity. Fluting may also allow for a longer barrel, if weight is a consideration. Another advantage to fluting is the increased cooling rate of the barrel because of the greater amount of surface area exposed to the air.

 

[FULLDRAWXX75]

Took from Lilja website.

Fluting barrels for both competitive target and hunting rifles is quite popular. There are two advantages to using a fluted barrel. Improved accuracy is one advantage because of increased barrel stiffness. If we compare a fluted barrel to one that is not fluted, both weighing the same, the fluted barrel is stiffer. This is because the fluted barrel will be of a larger diameter than the unfluted barrel of the same weight and length. Increasing the diameter of a barrel greatly increases its rigidity. Fluting may also allow for a longer barrel, if weight is a consideration. Another advantage to fluting is the increased cooling rate of the barrel because of the greater amount of surface area exposed to the air.

As stated above:

"Fluting" the barrel does not increase the stiffness/rigidity of the barrel.................the use of a larger diameter barrel does that, the fluting decreases the added wieght and adds in the cooling process.(more surface area)

FDXX75

 

[Backwudz]

I'm getting ready to send my .243 with the varmit barrel to Kampfeld Custom basically to reduce the weight a little....

 

[Gravey]

Thanks all. The reason I was asking is I was comparing the Winchester model 70 Featherweight Stainless with the Extreme Weather edition. The EW has a fluted barrel and I've never really thought about why.

 

[KPH]

I have read that fluttung also takes the harmonics out.

 

[FULLDRAWXX75]

Took from Lilja website.

Fluting barrels for both competitive target and hunting rifles is quite popular. There are two advantages to using a fluted barrel. Improved accuracy is one advantage because of increased barrel stiffness.

As stated above:
"Fluting" the barrel does not increase the stiffness/rigidity of the barrel.................the use of a larger diameter barrel does that, the fluting decreases the added wieght and adds in the cooling process.(more surface area)

FDXX75

The above article states that fluting the barrel DOES increase barrel stiffness...
The increase in the barrels circumfrence is also acheived by the fluting process, NOT by starting out with a larger diameter barrel to begin with....

example...
Take a 1 inch solid rod, it has a set outside circumfrence( measured around the rod) AND diameter(measured thru the rod)...now flute the rod and the outside circumfrence of the very same 1" rod is increased. It may still fit into a sleeve the same size as before because the diameter is the same, but the distance into and out of the fluted groves actualy adds to the total distance the rod measures around the circumfrence of it. As the number and depth of the grooves increases, so does the OUTSIDE circumfrence of the SAME 1" rod or barrel,... making it stiffer.

So correct me if I am wrong, by "rifling" the inside of the barrel (basically the same procedure as fluting, just on the inside) the diameter of the bore increases.................?????

FDXX75

 

[Model70Man]

Stiffens the barrel (more accuracy potential) and increases the surface area which aids cooling!

How does removing metal increase stiffness?
Fluting reduces weight of a heavier contour barrel to the weight of a smaller contour barrel. They will be more rigid because of the heavier contour and not because of the fluting. Like said earlier, it also speeds up cooling.

How does fluting increase stiffness of a barrel? I would say much the same way that the corrigation in a thin peice of sheet metal like a metal roofing panel tremendously increases its stiffness and load capacity...Just because any proceedure is done for one primary reason doesn't mean that it doesn't create other physical characteristics as well.
quote]

Took from Lilja website.

Fluting barrels for both competitive target and hunting rifles is quite popular. There are two advantages to using a fluted barrel. Improved accuracy is one advantage because of increased barrel stiffness.

As stated above:
"Fluting" the barrel does not increase the stiffness/rigidity of the barrel.................the use of a larger diameter barrel does that, the fluting decreases the added wieght and adds in the cooling process.(more surface area)

FDXX75

The above article states that fluting the barrel DOES increase barrel stiffness...
The increase in the barrels circumfrence is also acheived by the fluting process, NOT by starting out with a larger diameter barrel to begin with....

example...
Take a 1 inch solid rod, it has a set outside circumfrence( measured around the rod) AND diameter(measured thru the rod)...now flute the rod and the outside circumfrence of the very same 1" rod is increased. It may still fit into a sleeve the same size as before because the diameter is the same, but the distance into and out of the fluted groves actualy adds to the total distance the rod measures around the circumfrence of it. As the number and depth of the grooves increases, so does the OUTSIDE circumfrence of the SAME 1" rod or barrel,... making it stiffer.

If you take a ridged sheet of metal and a plain sheet of metal and reconfigure them into a cylindrical shape of the same overall diameter, the Moment of Inertia will now be a function of the radius and not as much as the thickness. The stiffness of a ridged versus plain sheet of metal formed into a cylinder is not much significant. Moreover, fluting a barrel means removing materials; ridging a plain sheet of metal is NOT removing material but just altering the configuration. Therefore, the ridged roof analogy does not hold water because it is not an apple-to-apple comparison. (from Snipercountry.com)

Where did you get your example from??? Just because the circumference gets larger doesn't mean the barrel will get stiffer because of the fluting. That makes absolutely no sense at all. The increased surface area created by the flutes aids in the cooling of the pipe since the flutes are 1.) closer to the rifling, and 2.) increases the surface area to dissipate the heat.

The article did NOT say fluting increases rigidity of a barrel. It said it increases the rigidity of the same weight barrel. Totally different. That means the fluted barrel has to have a larger diameter or a heavier contour which increases the diameter of the barrel. The fluting process takes metal away from the barrel which in turn reduces the weight and also WEAKENS the barrel.

Here is an example from Snipercountry.com :

Test materials
Savage 10 FP chambered in 308:
Outside Diameter: 0.840 inch
Flutes: None
Cross-sectional area: 0.493 square inch
Area Moment of Inertia: 0.024


Savage 12 BVSSF chambered in 308:
Outside Diameter: 0.840 inch
Flutes: six 3/16" side, 3/16" deep, full radius
Cross-sectional area: 0.312 square inch
Area Moment of Inertia: 0.014


Custom Made Rifle / Light Varmint Barrel chambered in 308:
Outside Diameter: 0.70 inch
Flutes: none
Cross-sectional area: 0.312
Area Moment of Inertia: 0.011
Results


12 BVSS Fluted (OD 0.850") versus 10 FP Plain (OD 0.850")
Weight: 38% less
Stiffness (as a function of Moment of Inertia): 43% less

The fluted barrel is much lighter, much less rigid, but has much more surface area than a solid barrel with the same overall outside diameter.

12 BVSS Fluted (OD 0.850") versus Light Varmint (OD 0.700")
Weight: Same
Stiffness (as a function of Area of Moment Inertia): 25% more

The fluted barrel is much more rigid, and has much more surface area than a solid barrel of the same weight.


Fluting does NOT make a barrel more rigid of the same size diameter barrel. It makes a barrel more rigid of the same weight.

 

[Tiny]

Thanks all. The reason I was asking is I was comparing the Winchester model 70 Featherweight Stainless with the Extreme Weather edition. The EW has a fluted barrel and I've never really thought about why.

Both are nice and shoot good I like the FW better but wish it had the Fluted Barrel,no big reason why except I like the Fluted barrl better on the EW.The EW stock is a little thicker/bulkier than I care for.

 

[DaveB]

In a hunting rifle, flutes are a lot like the newest fishing lure finish. They are there to catch the fisherman/hunter.

You'd have to shoot a lot, I mean a lot, for fluting to have any effect at all in the cooling department. Match shooters been using non-fluted barrels forever.

Now, fact is, I do think Flutes look cool. But as to mechanical effectiveness or barrel rigidity or weight, in a hunting rifle, me thinks not. But then again, I like my rifles to look cool.

 

[tug]

Model 70 man is correct in every respect.

Another aspect to consider is the original quality of the barrel and the technique of fluting: the machine used to cut; when in the process the flutes were cut, was the barrel heat treated before or after, or both. If you have a crummy barrel to start with, then you flute it, you will have a lighter crummy barrel with no difference in stiffness.

If you have ever carried a rifle every day, all day, then you know the difference 8 ounces can make. My Colt lightweight 6520 weighs 6.5 lbs with a sling and aftermarket stock. My father in law carried an M1 in Europe that weighed 9.5 lbs. An enormous difference.

Good luck all.

k