Die?

[TRIGGER]

#1 Should I use full length dies every reload?
#2 why are some sets only two dies and some 3?

 

[Jcalder]

Personally I use full length every time. Two dies sets use a sizing die and a seater die. Three die sets are the same but they add a crimping die unless it's pistol dies. That's another subject


Big or small, kill em all

 

[TRIGGER]

Ha that leads to another question. Do I need to crimp rounds for bolt action rifles?

 

[mr.big]

imo and ime a FL die adjusted correctly for a .002 bump of the shoulder turns out the best most consistent ammo you can load,,I use Redding FL dies with the bushings to size the necks at .002 tension,

 

[TRIGGER]

imo and ime a FL die adjusted correctly for a .002 bump of the shoulder turns out the best most consistent ammo you can load,,I use Redding FL dies with the bushings to size the necks at .002 tension,

Your WAY over my head lol.

 

[DaveB]

No need to crimp any bolt action rifle rounds.

I do not crimp my 223 semi-auto. Many reloaders do crimp semi-auto rounds because the bullet in the round in the magazine can definitely seat itself deeper in to the case during firing. I have never experienced this problem but it is apparently true.

When you FL size what you are attempting to do is re-set the brass to SAAMI specifications even though you have just fire-formed your brass to your rifle's chamber. It may seem trivial if your shots are less thn 200 yards and putting multiple bullets through a single hole is not on your agenda.

Your accuracy at long distances is predicated upon your accuracy at 200 yards (this is my opinion). At 100 yards a 9/10 MOA may look awful good. Take that same load to 200 and you can get surprised at how the group begins to open up.

My BIL is kind of manic about his reloading. He weighs brass, mic's and neck turns, has a micrometer thing on his seating dies, and has more invested in his scope than his Wife's wedding ring. At 200 yards he can cover a 5-shot .222 group with a dime. I have witnessed 5 round groups trough a single hole.

Mr. Big sets the shoulder back because in his loading and shooting he gets the best results the next time he fires a round in that brass. Picture this. The primer ignites and believe it or not that ignition can move the bullet into the lands. The shoulder setback allows the chamber and bolt engineering to unite and the bullet jumps into the lands in perfect alignment. The powder is ignited, the brass expands, The gas formed by combustion (1800 times the powder volume) has no place to go and so like electricity it takes the path of least resistance, pushing the bullet out of the way which just happens to be down the barrel.

And that explanation is at roughly 20,000 feet. You get closer and closer the physics and metallurgy get kind of interesting.


Question, who has turned over a Nosler Partition and seen the marks made by pieces of IMR4350 powder in the lead? You get the impression those pieces of powder were moving pretty fast to leave a mark, right?

All of the above, and plenty more, is why you handload. It isn't doing your best. Its doing the very best that can be done. Period.

 

[sll]

#1 Should I use full length dies every reload?
#2 why are some sets only two dies and some 3?

Nothing wrong with using a F/L die every time, just don't adjust it to full-length size every time if you want your brass to last. As Mr. Big stated you just want to bump the shoulder back for reliable feeding purposes. You will need a comparator to see that you are setting the dies up correctly to do this. Most bottle-necked rifle 3 die sets include a neck-sizing only die.

 

[Hunter 257W]

I adjust all my full length sizer dies for minimum sizing by "feel". Screw the die in the press with the shell holder installed and the ram full up. Turn the die in until it contacts the shell holder then back it off 1/4 turn. Size a fired case and try it in the rifle. Hopefully it won't fit. If it does, screw the die back out a bit and try another case. Once you get a case that isn't sized enough to fit in the chamber, keep trying, while turning the die in about 1/8 turn each time, until you get one that will chamber with some "feel" of dragging on the bolt handle. You now have your die set up for the bare minimum sizing that will give good accuracy and long case life. It's that simple.

 

[Hunter 257W]

I'm thinking and I don't think I just neck size for anything including my Remington 40X-Rangemaster in 22 CHeetah. It used to shoot tiny little bug hole groups with the full length die set up as described above. I say "used to" because the barrel taint what it used to be due to too many rounds at 4,200 fps. :cry:

 

[Hunter 257W]

Some 3 die sets include a crimp die, some have an expander die for loading cast bullets. I have one of these in both 30-30 and 35 Remington so I can load cast lead bullets and not have the case mouth damage the bullet. They serve no purpose for normal jacketed bullet rifle loading.

 

[TRIGGER]

I adjust all my full length sizer dies for minimum sizing by "feel". Screw the die in the press with the shell holder installed and the ram full up. Turn the die in until it contacts the shell holder then back it off 1/4 turn. Size a fired case and try it in the rifle. Hopefully it won't fit. If it does, screw the die back out a bit and try another case. Once you get a case that isn't sized enough to fit in the chamber, keep trying, while turning the die in about 1/8 turn each time, until you get one that will chamber with some "feel" of dragging on the bolt handle. You now have your die set up for the bare minimum sizing that will give good accuracy and long case life. It's that simple.

so I don't want the shell holder and die touching in this process?

 

[mr.big]

I adjust all my full length sizer dies for minimum sizing by "feel". Screw the die in the press with the shell holder installed and the ram full up. Turn the die in until it contacts the shell holder then back it off 1/4 turn. Size a fired case and try it in the rifle. Hopefully it won't fit. If it does, screw the die back out a bit and try another case. Once you get a case that isn't sized enough to fit in the chamber, keep trying, while turning the die in about 1/8 turn each time, until you get one that will chamber with some "feel" of dragging on the bolt handle. You now have your die set up for the bare minimum sizing that will give good accuracy and long case life. It's that simple.

so I don't want the shell holder and die touching in this process?

Start backed off about half turn,,you will probably wind up just touching but to go by directions will over size brass for most chambers,,,