Coyotes are efficient deer killers

[fairchaser]

Attended the annual Ames banquet last night and they went over all the research they had been working on the last two years. They have done capture and collar studies including placing vaginal inserts in pregnant does to determine when they give birth to help in determining fawn recruitment.

One of the findings that shocked me was that a full 1/3 of the collared does did not survive more than a few months. I asked had they done necropsies on them and they had if there were any remains. Most if not almost all had died from canine attacks. One had died from pneumonia.

I realize it's hard to reduce any coyote population but it sure makes sense to try!

 

[DayTrader]

We have a pack of coyotes here and when they go off at 4am screaming I know they probably have a deer surrounded so I shoot off fireworks/long range bottle rockets out their way and they disperse. Strange, but it works. Trying to save the deer for my freezer.

 

[DoubleRidge]

Agree that its hard and that we should try to manage coyote numbers. Also, listened to a podcast recently where they studied where does have fawns, where they raise them, thick timber verses grown up field or burned areas and it was very interesting to see the role habitat played. I've also heard some land managers talking more about managing habitat for small game, better habitat for rabbits, etc. Creating more options for predators. Thought being that they will go after the easier meal...but again, I agree that we need to manage predators for deer and turkey, but managing the habitat, to favor the game we love, is also something to consider.

 

[squackattack]

I was at tall timbers once and the quail biologist said they put feed out on firebreaks not for quail but cotton rats. Idea was when cotton rat numbers are high, hawks eat them instead of quail.

 

[PossumSlayer]

Thank God we don't have hyenas!

 

[backyardtndeer]

Yes, they will take down adult deer, not to mention all the fawns they kill. I kill every coyote I can. I hate them.

 

[lol]

This is from a study regarding declining deer populations in the Appalachian

Mountains.

 

[BigAl]

I kill coyotes when I see them. I always say I'm going to "hunt" them but never get around to it. When I retire I really need to give it an effort.

 

[ImThere]

I will ruin a deer hunt to kill a coyote.

 

[lol]

I will ruin a deer hunt to kill a coyote.

Ruin one hunt and save two hunts.

 

[megalomaniac]

I've been stressing the importance of coyote removal for years. They are the number 1 limiting factor when it comes to deer and turkey recruitment. Nothing else is even a close second.

But it takes year round dedication to make any difference. Just shooting a couple in deer season doesn't do a bit of good.

And one more thing... I had NO idea just how effective the night time calling would be. We called up 5 or 6 that week season was open. But I also had no idea how hard it is to pull off the shot at night...

Dogs just come charging in at full speed, and by the time you pick them up, it's hard to swing on them and kill them. We only killed 2. They don't come running in, pause, run some more in, pause, etc like they do in the daytime. Plus during that week of night hunting, pups are with parents, so sometimes you get the whole pack to come charging in at once.

We have removed over 30 in the past 2 years... still know of 3 singles and 3 packs that are next door on the neighbors, so its never ending.

If you want to know if you have a problem, just ride your roads near your property and play a howl or pair howl about an hour after dark.

 

[GumbyGuy]

Being from south Mississippi we grew up hunting deer with hounds.
During those days our hounds would also run coyotes and even a mix that we called coy-dogs , I shot every one I could. We don't have rabbits like we did 40 years ago because the yotes have cleared them out. They will eat your pets too , doesn't matter, if they can catch it they will eat it.

 

[Planking]

They always tried to tell us here that coyotes didn't have much of an impact on deer. I never did agree with that because i would see dead fawns in their mouths on camera and find them dead from animal attacks.

I caught 10 coyotes last year on my place and they completely stopped showing up on camera until this last week. Cell cams over sets makes trapping much easier.

 

[mike243]

Who are they ? link?

 

[Tn_Va_Hunter]

Wish I knew how to trap. I'd love to get rid of a few around here

 

[Planking]

Wish I knew how to trap. I'd love to get rid of a few around here

I just watched some youtube videos and learned how to do it. I'm still a novice at it. It is a whole world like hunting and fishing. The main thing when starting out is to just make sure that trap is bedded solid with no wiggle. It's a great survival skill that a woodsman should master and it helps control some species that are desperately in need of it.

 

[backyardtndeer]

They will eat your pets too , doesn't matter, if they can catch it they will eat it.

Yep, and some pets will kill yotes.

Would like to find a female Anatolian for Max to have a girlfriend....

 

[wildlifefarmer]

Wish I knew how to trap. I'd love to get rid of a few around here

If you're wanting to learn, Tn Furharvesters and TWRA hold classes every year. After taking the class try to find an experienced trapper to run some lines with. Then start experiencing Christmas every time you run a line. You never know what will be under the tree. Be patient and good luck!

 

[Southern Sportsman]

And one more thing... I had NO idea just how effective the night time calling would be. We called up 5 or 6 that week season was open. But I also had no idea how hard it is to pull off the shot at night...

Dogs just come charging in at full speed, and by the time you pick them up, it's hard to swing on them and kill them.

Were you using a rifle exclusively? I can see why one might, especially if they have a rifle set up with night optics. But I've heard they come in hard and fast at night, as you referenced.

In the tungsten hand loading world, there are some who swear by a 2 or 2.25 oz load of TSS #3 or #4 for yotes. I think they are really effective, even out to 75 or 80 yards.

 

[megalomaniac]

Were you using a rifle exclusively? I can see why one might, especially if they have a rifle set up with night optics. But I've heard they come in hard and fast at night, as you referenced.

In the tungsten hand loading world, there are some who swear by a 2 or 2.25 oz load of TSS #3 or #4 for yotes. I think they are really effective, even out to 75 or 80 yards.

no, shotgun only at night, just using #2's. The problem is the dog is on top of you before you can even react. And when they get a whiff something is off, they spin and haul butt before you can spin and get the shot off.

I'm sure night hunting is just like any other shooting skill and I'll get better the more I do it.

And I'm sure #4 TSS's will kill the crap out of them at 80 yards! Most of the shots we get at night are within 20, so no need to spend the $$$ on TSS, though.

 

[BSK]

Really, really interesting info on night-hunting coyotes Mega.

They always tried to tell us here that coyotes didn't have much of an impact on deer.

I don't know who "they" are, but you sure won't hear that message from me. Coyotes are major fawn killers (and it sound like on Ames, major killers of all deer). The only thing worse are bears. But luckily bears never live at such high densities as coyotes do. Removing coyotes is a great idea if you do it at the right time and with the right intensity. But as others have pointed out, shooting a few yotes during deer season - although the right idea - has little effect.

 

[BSK]

Here's an odd question: I've always heard (and seen in trail-camera data) that coyotes are major predators of fox. And usually, your fox population is an indicator of your coyote population, as in lots of coyotes means few foxes. Lots of foxes means few coyote. However, over the last couple of years, my local fox population has been exploding, even though my coyote population appears stable or even rising. I get a LOT of coyotes on trail-cam. Yet at the same time, I'm now getting entire families of foxes on cam, and I mean ever single night.

Thoughts?

 

[backyardtndeer]

Here's an odd question: I've always heard (and seen in trail-camera data) that coyotes are major predators of fox. And usually, your fox population is an indicator of your coyote population, as in lots of coyotes means few foxes. Lots of foxes means few coyote. However, over the last couple of years, my local fox population has been exploding, even though my coyote population appears stable or even rising. I get a LOT of coyotes on trail-cam. Yet at the same time, I'm now getting entire families of foxes on cam, and I mean ever single night.

Thoughts?

We rarely get pics of fox and it's rare that we see them. The most I saw or got pics of them was a year that I killed 6 coyotes one spring, and a couple the deer season over the prior fall/winter. Think all total I had killed 9 in about 6 or 7 months.

 

[BSK]

I'm getting entire families of foxes romping and play (and often hunting mice) in my food plots at night. And not just one or two plots, but most of them.

 

[megalomaniac]

Here's an odd question: I've always heard (and seen in trail-camera data) that coyotes are major predators of fox. And usually, your fox population is an indicator of your coyote population, as in lots of coyotes means few foxes. Lots of foxes means few coyote. However, over the last couple of years, my local fox population has been exploding, even though my coyote population appears stable or even rising. I get a LOT of coyotes on trail-cam. Yet at the same time, I'm now getting entire families of foxes on cam, and I mean ever single night.

Thoughts?

Coyotes take special joy out of killing foxes. The only foxes we have seen in the past 20 years have been those who den and raise kits where coyotes don't go (like in my farmhouse yard and barn).

If your coyote population hasn't declined as the reason for an increase in foxes, I bet it wont be long before they kill all the foxes.

 

[TheLBLman]

. . . . . my local fox population has been exploding, even though my coyote population appears stable or even rising. I get a LOT of coyotes on trail-cam.

Thoughts?

I am also seeing an increase in foxes only a few miles north of you.

My take is the foxes have made some adaptions to being preyed upon by coyotes, i.e. survival of the fittest.

Another take is we both have in our areas an increase in rabbits (and probably mice, rats, other small food items which both fox & coyotes eat).

Lastly, I expect you also have an increase in your deer density?

When you have good fawning cover, it is also good for rabbits.
The increase in rabbits shifts some of the coyotes' preying on deer to rabbits.
And, I suspect deer herds preyed upon for years by coyotes, have also evolved a bit to be less susceptible.

At present, in my areas, I believe the coyote population is comparable to what it's been for many years, yet we have seen an increase in the deer population. At the same time, the coyotes might be increasing their populations with all these rabbits, they may then over-eat the rabbits, then start eating more deer?

The dynamics made always be "boom or bust" every few years, effecting by all the above and much more.

 

[TheLBLman]

I hate coyotes, and they do kill both fawns & adult deer.

But I continue to believe much of the answer to minimizing coyote predation is via providing diverse habitat with good fawning cover. I believe coyotes are first & foremost opportunist scavengers, often seen carrying a dead fawn that had died before the coyote found it. Same for our trail cam pics of coyotes walking by with a an adult deer leg.

When it comes to hunting down & killing their prey, coyotes prefer rabbit hunting to deer hunting.

Wage war on the coyotes best you can, but don't overlook the merits of diverse habitat x a healthy deer herd to minimize coyote predation on deer (and turkeys).

 

[DoubleRidge]

I'm getting entire families of foxes romping and play (and often hunting mice) in my food plots at night. And not just one or two plots, but most of them.

Interesting topic...hadnt thought about it before now but on the property where I live I've only seen a coyote a couple of times...red fox on the other hand are pretty common....drive 15 minutes north to the family land we hunt and manage....rarely ever see a fox...but coyotes are more common...but the coyotes seem cyclic...some years we see several....some years not so many?
Another observation I have thought about but dont understand is the fact that as a kid we saw gray fox often and very rarely a red fox...today I honestly couldn't tell you the last gray fox I've seen...only reds.

 

[Griswold]

Zero foxes here in years

 

[lol]

Here's an odd question: I've always heard (and seen in trail-camera data) that coyotes are major predators of fox. And usually, your fox population is an indicator of your coyote population, as in lots of coyotes means few foxes. Lots of foxes means few coyote. However, over the last couple of years, my local fox population has been exploding, even though my coyote population appears stable or even rising. I get a LOT of coyotes on trail-cam. Yet at the same time, I'm now getting entire families of foxes on cam, and I mean ever single night.

Thoughts?

You'd think foxes would have a good defense against coyotes considering they can climb trees and the dogs can't.