Cheating?

[Grill-n-man]

Let's spin off the subject of the states that have legalized "black powder cartridge" guns now legal during what used to be muzzleloader season. Let's see, when muzzleloader season came about there were sidekicks. Then came blackpowder substitutes, and that was cheating. Then came the percussion in lines and that was cheating. Then came the 209 shotgun primer in lines and that was cheating. Then came the smokeless guns, and that was cheating. Now you have "black powder cartridge" and that's cheating. Now let's look at archery aka bow season. When archery season came about there were longbows and recurves. Then they cut the ends of a longbow off, added some metal brackets, 2 wheels, more string/cable, rest, and sights and that was cheating. Then came the crossbows and that was cheating. Now you have compound bows reaching 360+ fps, years worth of engineering, hours of machine work, made out of space age materials, sight with fiber optic sights, yada yada, but that ain't cheating? Two facts out of all this are: First, the deer population all over the United States is extremely strong and Second, the technology that is in ALL the modern weapons used for hunting is far beyond what it was when the classification of each season was first done. So why don't we just start all over. There can be bow season that would include only longbows and recurves. Then you can have modern archery that would include compounds and crossbows. The you can have muzzleloader season that would include sidelocks, either percussion or flint. Then you could have modern black powder to include inlines, smokeless, and "black powder cartridge". Let's not leave out the gun hunters. You could have gun season that would include smoothbore shotguns, sporterized military rifles, rifles with iron sights or scope within the same specs and quality as they were at the end of WWII, no custom work done, no bedding, and so forth. Then you could have modern gun season. See easy no cheating. Really don't see what all the fuss is about the subject, we hunters are asking for this. There is a reason that with have modern compound bows, muzzleloader, low end rifles that out of the box will shoot sud moa, cameras on trees, GPS, rangefinders, etc. We have become lazy in all aspects of hunting from finding the game we pursue to marksmanship so to make up for that fact we demand the manufacturers put out products to make it easier on us. The only real cheating going on is us cheating us.

 

[WestTn Huntin man]

You could also have Deer season period. Any weapon capable of making a ETHICAL kill anytime during the legal season. Guess that would be too easy.

 

[stik]

inline muzzleloaders actually predate sidelocks

 

[BSK]

You could also have Deer season period.

And how many years have I been advocating this? Most (especially bow hunters) howl in indignation when I suggest it, but I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering about weapon capability.

 

[TheLBLman]

The only real cheating going on is us cheating us.

On that, I agree. Please think long and hard about this statement.

Everything else you said was just way too complicated, unnecessarily complicated.

. . . . . I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering . . . .

x 2

And oh so simple.
Might need a slightly shorter deer season and a 2-buck limit as off-sets to greater deer hunting opportunities.

Not that I'm personally opposed to just leaving things the way they are regarding season segments (archery, muzzleleloader, centerfire), although I do realize my doing more hunting during archery/muzzleloader may be actually cheating some other hunters out of opportunity they are just as deserving as I.

 

[TheLBLman]

I'd rather see more focus on deer herd management than weapon specifics management.

 

[BSK]

. . . . . I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering . . . .

x 2

And oh so simple.
Might need a slightly shorter deer season and a 2-buck limit as off-sets to greater deer hunting opportunities.

Without question, season lengths and bag limits might need to be adjusted. We would have to try it and see what the results are.

 

[Vermin93]

Two facts out of all this are: First, the deer population all over the United States is extremely strong and Second, the technology that is in ALL the modern weapons used for hunting is far beyond what it was when the classification of each season was first done.

I'm not sure your first "fact" is a fact at all. I am sure that many hunters in certain parts of the United States disagree with you on that. I guess it depends how you define "extremely strong".

My guess is that those advocating a single, simple "deer season" these days are a minority and that it will never happen in the future. I know in some parts of the United States they are a definite minority.

 

[Shed Hunter]

You could also have Deer season period.

And how many years have I been advocating this? Most (especially bow hunters) howl in indignation when I suggest it, but I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering about weapon capability.

Then it would need to be shortened. I know for a fact that I could have killed several mature bucks if rifle season were open the first couple of weeks of bow season. It is nothing to see 20 deer standing in a bean field at that time. Too many deer would be killed and hunting would be different... Worse.

Anyone who is only gun hunting in TN should be more than appreciative the VERY rifle long season provided.

Why shorten the season because some feel left out?

 

[tn droptine]

You could also have Deer season period. Any weapon capable of making a ETHICAL kill anytime during the legal season. Guess that would be too easy.

Unfortunately, this will never happen - too much money to be made charging people for individual weapon seasons.

 

[Thicketmaster]

You could also have Deer season period. Any weapon capable of making a ETHICAL kill anytime during the legal season. Guess that would be too easy.

Unfortunately, this will never happen - too much money to be made charging people for individual weapon seasons.

Exactly!!!!

 

[TheLBLman]

Keep in mind I'm personally content with the current season segments (archery, muzzleloader, rifle).

Anyone who is only gun hunting in TN should be more than appreciative the VERY rifle long season provided.

Why shorten the season because some feel left out?

But why not have that VERY long rifle season first?

Why not just let everyone have the first opportunity?

Archery and muzzleloader season segments COULD be placed AFTER a centerfire season.

Some people make the argument that early "special" seasons with "special" weapons are actually more about "special" privilege being given to the more avid and more accomplished deer hunters who also additionally hunt most of those rife days during rifle season. This may be why some states do not let those who hunt early archery season segments hunt in their state's rifle seasons, as some gun-only hunters consider it "cheating" that bowhunters get to hunt for weeks before the traditional deer (gun) season opens.

I'd rather see a simple "deer" season (hunt with whatever) than see any more "special" season or "more special" season segments dividing hunters, and unnecessarily complicating our hunting.

 

[Grill-n-man]

Yup I was unnecessarily complicated to make a point. Its hunting not brain surgery. I do apologize, allow me to clarify what was meant by extremely strong, the population across the United States, of what can be referred to as "deer", whitetail, blacktail, mule, coues, etc. has reached a level to allow for the hunting. Ain't brain surgery. Just another idea, how about if you don't want to do it then fine just don't do it. That's the great thing about America, you have the same amount of right to not do it as I have to do it. All you got to do is make the decision for yourself. And one more thing, all the talk on here and others like it forget to include what if any facts support why it would be bad the species involved. Really sad when you get people in a position that is supposed to be looking out foru what's best for us and the animals let their own personal opinions determine the outcome instead of keeping an open mind and make use of the facts. Just another God given right people trying to control based on their own opinions. Hey aint that how it works in them there Communist countries?

 

[BSK]

You could also have Deer season period.

And how many years have I been advocating this? Most (especially bow hunters) howl in indignation when I suggest it, but I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering about weapon capability.

Then it would need to be shortened. I know for a fact that I could have killed several mature bucks if rifle season were open the first couple of weeks of bow season. It is nothing to see 20 deer standing in a bean field at that time. Too many deer would be killed and hunting would be different... Worse.

Maybe. Your discounting the idea that deer would rapidly react to all the human pressure in the woods just before season opened and stop sanding in open fields in daylight. But I fully accept that deer season lengths and bag limits might need to adjusted (lessened) for a "weapon of choice" deer season.

Anyone who is only gun hunting in TN should be more than appreciative the VERY rifle long season provided.

I am very appreciative. And another reason I hope we never turn into KY. I grew up hunting there and still have family land there, and would NEVER want to ONLY hunt there.

Why shorten the season because some feel left out?

To jab a very large and sharp stick in the eye of bow hunters! :)

 

[BHC]

The thing is archery doesn't have near the impact on deer behavior as guns do.. I mostly gun hunt I will add... But I feel having a simple deer season, would do away with most if not all archery and MZ hunting... Ppl are gunna use the most effective weapon available... I like shooting bows more than guns, I like shooting deer more with a bow than a gun... But hunting in Tn isn't like hunting in the Midwest... I usually only see 1-3 mature bucks per entire season.. On what I would call a fairly intensely managed property...if gun season were all tr I'd be upset because, ppl would only gun hunt, the amount of pressure on deer by the rut would be tremendous!, I would like lose huntin the last couple weeks of September... One of my favorite times to hunt...

I will also say I would bet the percentage of mature bucks killed/ p&y or b&c entries would drop dramatically in Tennessee...

The way it is everyone gets their turn in sequential order of difficulty, and amount of pressure applied to deer, as it should be.. Wanna hunt earlier bow hunt, if you don't wait till your preferred weapons season begins....

Think of the archer who only has access to public land. How bad would it stink for him to walk into the woods with a bunch of guns opening day? Bad enough many would give up the sport I guarantee you...

The way it is, is fair to everyone, and provides plenty opportunity to everyone...

 

[BSK]

You could also have Deer season period. Any weapon capable of making a ETHICAL kill anytime during the legal season. Guess that would be too easy.

Unfortunately, this will never happen - too much money to be made charging people for individual weapon seasons.

Exactly!!!!

Completely agree. Plus the bow lobby is very vocal (read: politically powerful).

 

[bowriter]

I am for an all in one season and paragraph breaks.



Unfortunately, this will never happen - too much money to be made charging people for individual weapon seasons.

I wouldn't bet on it. Why not have one license that costs the same as all the combined tags? It would be called a Big Game license. Sort of an abbreviated sportsmans license.

 

[catman529]

I like the traditional 3 seasons myself. Even though I still haven't shot a muzzleloader, I don't mind having the ML season and then regular gun season. Keeps it simple and lets the more primitive (aka closer range, slower loading) hunting methods go first, before the deer get too skittish and avoid bow and ML range.

 

[Tennessee Lead]

The way it is, is fair to everyone, and provides plenty opportunity to everyone...

X2 couldn't agree more. I couldn't imagine the changes that a one for all season would bring. I feel we are fortunate to have the seasons in the form and order that we have. If that ever comes to a vote I would vote no.

 

[landman]

. . . . . I'm a firm believer that we need just "Deer Season," not bow, MZ and gun seasons. Let the hunters decide what weapon they want to use. That would end all the endless bickering . . . .

x 2

And oh so simple.
Might need a slightly shorter deer season and a 2-buck limit as off-sets to greater deer hunting opportunities.

Without question, season lengths and bag limits might need to be adjusted. We would have to try it and see what the results are.

Lets put this across the top of the website....
:)

 

[landman]

It will NEVER HAPPEN
due to $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

The Industry wont allow it

The State Agencies wouldn't allow it

Too much Money to be lost........

 

[BHC]

It will NEVER HAPPEN
due to $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

The Industry wont allow it

The State Agencies wouldn't allow it

Too much Money to be lost........

I don't think the hunters would go for it on top of all that... Not a majority anyway..

 

[Shed Hunter]

To jab a very large and sharp stick in the eye of bow hunters! :)

Darn'it.. I guess I forgot who I was talking to. From what you tell us, you can't bow hunt to save your life, but I would say that was made up with the ability to aggravate bow hunters to the point of insanity! :D

 

[Shed Hunter]

Keep in mind I'm personally content with the current season segments (archery, muzzleloader, rifle).

Anyone who is only gun hunting in TN should be more than appreciative the VERY rifle long season provided.

Why shorten the season because some feel left out?

But why not have that VERY long rifle season first?

Why not just let everyone have the first opportunity?

Archery and muzzleloader season segments COULD be placed AFTER a centerfire season.

Some people make the argument that early "special" seasons with "special" weapons are actually more about "special" privilege being given to the more avid and more accomplished deer hunters who also additionally hunt most of those rife days during rifle season. This may be why some states do not let those who hunt early archery season segments hunt in their state's rifle seasons, as some gun-only hunters consider it "cheating" that bowhunters get to hunt for weeks before the traditional deer (gun) season opens.

I'd rather see a simple "deer" season (hunt with whatever) than see any more "special" season or "more special" season segments dividing hunters, and unnecessarily complicating our hunting.

You should know how that would turn out Wes.. Rifle hunters would still complain that bow hunters get more than them. Go buy a crossbow if you have a problem with it. I would bet the majority of people complaining have the money to do so (or 10 extra rifles they can trade)


Keep in mind that TN hunters are cry babies. Why? The same reason a kid is a cry baby when it doesn't have everything it wants. We are beyond spoiled, and as hunters we're jealous of everyone else. I'm not saying this rudely either. I'm a little whiny butt too lol.

 

[KPH]

I am for an all in one season and paragraph breaks.



Unfortunately, this will never happen - too much money to be made charging people for individual weapon seasons.

I wouldn't bet on it. Why not have one license that costs the same as all the combined tags? It would be called a Big Game license. Sort of an abbreviated sportsmans license.

And the Muzzle loader and Bow manufactures would go nuts

 

[WRbowhunter]

I agree with everyone. And to make it very simple we should just have BOW SEASON. Its a lot cheaper to buy a bow and some arrows then spend all that wasted money on a gun. You can shoot the arrows over and over again without having to keep buying a box of shells. then Everyone can get in the woods in September and hunt until January. How cool would that be. Plus you don't even have to be a bowhunter to hunt during the season. You can just by a crossbow

 

[Shed Hunter]

I agree with everyone. And to make it very simple we should just have BOW SEASON. Its a lot cheaper to buy a bow and some arrows then spend all that wasted money on a gun. You can shoot the arrows over and over again without having to keep buying a box of shells. then Everyone can get in the woods in September and hunt until January. How cool would that be. Plus you don't even have to be a bowhunter to hunt during the season. You can just by a crossbow

Excellent post! That would be the fairest way and that is what people are asking for

 

[Mike D]

TN Season:

Sept.1 to Jan.31

All legal weapons allowed.

3 Does per day in unit L. All other units TBD for Does.

2 Bucks can be harvested at any time and ONLY 2 per year excluding special quota hunts...etc.

$90.50 per license.

 

[Mike D]

TN Season:

Sept.1 to Jan.31

All legal weapons allowed.

3 Does per day in unit L. All other units TBD for Does.

2 Bucks can be harvested at any time during legal hours and ONLY 2 per year are allowed excluding special quota hunts...etc.

$90.50 per license.

 

[G8rntn]

Let's spin off the subject of the states that have legalized "black powder cartridge" guns now legal during what used to be muzzleloader season. Let's see, when muzzleloader season came about there were sidekicks. Then came blackpowder substitutes, and that was cheating. Then came the percussion in lines and that was cheating. Then came the 209 shotgun primer in lines and that was cheating. Then came the smokeless guns, and that was cheating. Now you have "black powder cartridge" and that's cheating. Now let's look at archery aka bow season. When archery season came about there were longbows and recurves. Then they cut the ends of a longbow off, added some metal brackets, 2 wheels, more string/cable, rest, and sights and that was cheating. Then came the crossbows and that was cheating. Now you have compound bows reaching 360+ fps, years worth of engineering, hours of machine work, made out of space age materials, sight with fiber optic sights, yada yada, but that ain't cheating? Two facts out of all this are: First, the deer population all over the United States is extremely strong and Second, the technology that is in ALL the modern weapons used for hunting is far beyond what it was when the classification of each season was first done. So why don't we just start all over. There can be bow season that would include only longbows and recurves. Then you can have modern archery that would include compounds and crossbows. The you can have muzzleloader season that would include sidelocks, either percussion or flint. Then you could have modern black powder to include inlines, smokeless, and "black powder cartridge". Let's not leave out the gun hunters. You could have gun season that would include smoothbore shotguns, sporterized military rifles, rifles with iron sights or scope within the same specs and quality as they were at the end of WWII, no custom work done, no bedding, and so forth. Then you could have modern gun season. See easy no cheating. Really don't see what all the fuss is about the subject, we hunters are asking for this. There is a reason that with have modern compound bows, muzzleloader, low end rifles that out of the box will shoot sud moa, cameras on trees, GPS, rangefinders, etc. We have become lazy in all aspects of hunting from finding the game we pursue to marksmanship so to make up for that fact we demand the manufacturers put out products to make it easier on us. The only real cheating going on is us cheating us.

Paragraphs... :)