Burris Fastfire 3 - Bad First Impression

[Andy S.]

Add me to the group of unlucky ones. I mounted my brand new FF3 on a speedbead mount (12 gauge Rem 870 synthetic) last week and shot it for the first time this evening. To start, I left my Magnum Gobble Dot sights on my vent rib to use as a point of reference for the red dot (getting the windage and elevation real close before my first shot). I adjusted the red dot to where it aligned perfect with my gobble dot sights, which are nothing more than rifle sights with TruGlo fiber optics that are easy to see. I started out shooting high brass squirrel loads at 30 yards to check POA/POI, and my target was 36"X36". I would shoot my gun, lay it down on the ground, walk to my target, put another target up and then walk back to my gun, sit down, shoulder it, look through red dot sight, etc. Three out of the six shots, my red dot moved enough that I could tell with my own eyes when I shouldered the next time, and it moved substantially the last two times of the six, like ten clicks on the elevation. My very last shot was a hard kicking 3.5" MagBlend and it really caused the red dot to shift an unbelievable amount. I shot the MagBlend, laid my gun down, walked down to the target, put a new target up and came back and shouldered my gun and the red dot was literally pointing at my rear sight base, way way low compared to where it was just two minutes ago when I shot the MagBlend. That was enough for me. Furthermore, I had to move the elevation and windage adjustments on my last three shots just to get it back close to my Gobble Dot Sights, which are stationary and not moving, that's for certain. I packed all of my stuff up and came to the house. I can honestly say there is nothing worse than not having confidence in your gear. I am shipping back to Amazon tomorrow for a refund. This is not a slam on Burris by any means, just thought that it was worth sharing with the group.

Here's what it looked like mounted on my gun.

My plan of action at this point is to use my tried and true sights that are on the gun and in the meantime I am going to see if a Doctor red dot will mount to my speedbead mount. I have read good things about them, albeit they are more costly, that's for sure. I really like the concept of the red dot and how it looked when I aimed, but I despise a floating red dot or anything else for that matter that is a confidence killer on something as important as my turkey gun. YMMV

 

[fredfred]

WOW that sucks. I would give Burris a call before I gave up on it. I've heard nothing but great stuff about there customer service.

 

[tasaman]

That's some big bucks to shell out for something that has that many problems. I don't recall the FFII having many negative comments. Good luck with it.

 

[Big Gun]

That sucks. I just put a Truglo red dot on my 870 and it was so close that I only had to adjust it 2 clicks up to be on at 30 yards. My eyes have gotten to the point that even with fiber optic sights I couldn't see them good, this red dot is really nice, so far. After shooting several 3" loads at 45 yards, I'm happy with the Mag Blends.

 

[Andy S.]

I don't recall the FFII having many negative comments.

Look here to read about others stating similar "drifting" experiences over the last few years. http://www.gobblernation.com/phpBB3/vie ... f=2&t=4743

I found the link above discussing possible issues AFTER I ordered my FF3 and was skeptical the whole time it was en route to my house. Considering it was a Burris product that many raved about, I thought I should at least give it a chance so I did, but to no avail. With that said, the majority of reviews I have read online on various hunting forums has all been positive when it comes to Burris Red Dots. I think the drifting problem is the exception to the rule and not the norm. Just the thought of it being off one morning when I have a gobbler in killing range is enough to kill every ounce of my confidence in it. As the old saying goes, you never get a second chance to make a first impression.

 

[drrxnupe]

Sorry Andy. My experience was completely opposite of yours. For me, the FFIII is the best thing since sliced bread. Granted, I mount mine on top instead of using the speedbead. I did notice that my bead sight was quite a distance away from the red dot. I decided to aim my first shots using the red dot anyway and they were dead on. The dot did move a little in between shots but I realized that the mount screw had loosened. A squirt of loctite fixed that.

 

[muddyboots]

Thats a bummer

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

For those that didn't read throught the reference thread posted:

By the Burris Optics guy:

The FF2 is tricky to sight in. We are aware of that which is the reason we made changes on the FF3 to eliminate that problem. The dot can shift when locking it down. If you keep it in the rest, move the dot to your pattern, and then watch the dot as you tighten the lock screws you should be able to get it sighted in without too many headaches. Not the best way but it seems to work pretty good. YMMV.

The FF3 uses a clicker adjustment and no locks so there shouldn't be too many issues with sighting that one in.

The drifting issue that everyone is referring to is a complete mystery to me. We've been making that sight for 4 years and this is the first I've heard of it. If you have a sight that you know is drifting please let me know. I'll swap you out with a FF3 just so I can test it myself. Hell I'll even buy it back if you absolutely don't want a Burris product. Let me know if we have any takers.


Like you, I'm more concerned with the drifting issue that you guys are seeing, much more concerned. I use the same sight on an 835 and haven't had any issues but I'm not shooting loads that pattern like the stuff you guys are using, unfortunately. I really would like to get one of your worst sights in hand. I'll put it through my own tests and get it on video for you. Make sure you note the serial number. I just got off the phone with our QC manager and he assured me that we have all of the necessary fixtures to test the sight and the they just installed a new collimator last week that will show us a precise POI/POA shift. One way or another I will find an answer to the problem.

All I ask is that you guys give us a chance to look into this from our side before flaming us too hard. If there's an issue we WANT to know about it so we can fix it. If there's someone that just hates Burris, or me for that matter, then knock yourself out but for the rest of you I will absolutely try to get you an answer and as much documentation to back up our findings as possible. Right now it sounds like we are going to video tape it so you can see for yourself. You may want us to try something else along the way that we didn't think of so if nothing else it should be entertaining.

 

[Bigg E]

That is a bad deal. I have seen lots of good reviews about them but I went with the Tru Brite open just because it was much cheaper. I do like how low the FF mounts on the speedbead mount though. On a side note, I think I recognize that shop.

 

[Andy S.]

If you have a sight that you know is drifting please let me know. I'll swap you out with a FF3 just so I can test it myself. Hell I'll even buy it back if you absolutely don't want a Burris product. Let me know if we have any takers.

I read this and I'll agree that is top notch customer service and a great gesture on his part, but I desire much more than first class customer service when I am afield turkey hunting. I provided him a picture of my box with serial number so he could track it down and test it if he so desired. With turkey hunting, I will always demand a reliable product that will stand the test of time. Now the next 1,000 FF3s may just do that, but who has countless hours and an endless supply of costly high dollar shells to sort out which ones are dependable and which ones are not? I know I do not. Needless to say, my first experience with a Burris product was not the most favorable by a LONG shot. Would I try another Burris product, most likely yes, but it would be on their dime and not mine.

 

[Andy S.]

I do like how low the FF mounts on the speedbead mount though.

Yes indeed. The speedbead mount by and large was the determining factor for me to even try a FastFire. I really really like how low-profile it is, especially when compared to drilling and tapping my receiver and having the sight that much more elevated.

On a side note, I think I recognize that shop.

You would be correct sir.

 

[Andy S.]

For me, the FFIII is the best thing since sliced bread.

I have read this repeatedly online from various users, thus the reason I gave it a shot.

 

[Grizzly Johnson]

Andy, hope it is resolved in your favor my friend.... keep us posted.

 

[Gravey]

That sucks. Hope you get it corrected.

 

[Andy S.]

Thanks Griz & Gravey, I'm working on a solution as I type this.

 

[REN]

Man that sucks Andy. I hope everything turns out well. I am gonna shoot mine next weekend and I hope I don't have similar results.

 

[Andy S.]

Man that sucks Andy. I hope everything turns out well. I am gonna shoot mine next weekend and I hope I don't have similar results.

Thanks REN, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. I hope your experience is favorable like most others I have read about. Let us know how it goes for you.

 

[fredfred]

Man that sucks Andy. I hope everything turns out well. I am gonna shoot mine next weekend and I hope I don't have similar results.

X2 I just got my gun back from being drilled and tapped. That thing better hold up

 

[RUGER]

I didn't care for mine all that much either.

I guess it will be ok but I would never buy another one.

 

[REN]

finally got mine out and sighted in....worked great! 3 shots with bird shot and 2 magblends and good to go!

 

[ewc]

I think it may be more in the speedbead mount, than the site itself. I had a devil of a time getting the one on my daughter's gun to stay at the same POI. You can move the mount side-side and up and down by pressing on the mount.

I finally tightened it as best as I could, remembering where the dot needs to be in relation to my front sight, and carry the adjustment tools in my vest.

It worked like a charm this past Saturday. I do think I will drill and tap the receiver for next year - for a more sturdy mount.

 

[Andy S.]

I agree ewc, I think the speedbead was as much of the problem as the sight itself, if not the complete culprit. I hated how you could push the speedbead base with your thumb and the POA move constantly, even with my stock being tightened to the point that I barely got it off yesterday (with my buddy's help). The speedbead just wasn't my cup of tea, especially for something as important in my eyes as my turkey gun. I took the speedbead mount off yesterday and am returning it to Amazon today. I ordered the 336 base and will have a gunsmith drill and tap my receiver at some point for next year. In the meantime, I will go with what I know and shoot my sights that I have shot the last several years without any probelms. For me the speedbead and red dot was more of a want and not so much a need, thus I will suffice with what I got until I have more time to invest in getting the gun drilled and tapped for the 336 as well as tinkering with a red dot when I am not in a rush to hunt with it.

 

[TheLBLman]

I agree ewc, I think the speedbead was as much of the problem as the sight itself, if not the complete culprit.

I'd bet "complete culprit" was the case, since you already know there was "play" in your speedbead mount.

 

[Andy S.]

I'd bet "complete culprit" was the case, since you already know there was "play" in your speedbead mount.

Agree Wes. Unfortunately for me, I never thoroughly inspected the speedbead base until I had already sent the FFIII sight back, and it was then that I really examined the speedbead and determined it had a tiny bit of play in it, but that tiny bit equates to inches on a sight at 40 yards. I was skeptical of the speedbead mount to begin with, but I loved how low profile it was and that drove me to go with it, plus I read numerous others reviews online who liked it on their setups. Needless to say, I did not love it enough to have a constantly moving red dot though. Another thing that did not help with my hastily decision to send the FFIII back was the fact a Burris rep on another forum erroneously told me the sight was made in China. This may sound snobbish, but I did not then and still do not want ANYTHING on my hunting setups from China, especially something as important as my sight, thus I was glad to return it at the time. Knowing what I know now coupled with the fact that the FFIII is made in the Phillipines and not China like their rep originally told me, I would for sure give a FFIII another try with a solid base. I have read too many reviews of other hunters in numerous states who really like them, so I kind of thought all along that my experience was unique in all aspects.

 

[REN]

yeah i cant give a full review as i have not been through a season with it but as of now mine mounted on a picatinnay rail has been sold and held true during the sight in process off of a lead sled.

we will see how it holds up for a season though as i can be pretty hard on my gun in the month of april. I had the Mueller Quick Shot and it made it through 3 seasons so i hope this one does as well.

 

[Andy S.]

... i can be pretty hard on my gun in the month of april.

Same here REN.

 

[REN]

my other post should have said SOLID not SOLD sorry.