Another 300 WSM Quest

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Since I can actually seem to get responses here, I have another question about "working up a load". While I'm not new to reloading, I am new to starting a load from scratch.

background. I'm going elk hunting for the 1st time this October, so I picked up a Ruger 300 M77 Mark II 300 wsm. Since shells seem to average around $50 a pop, I got some free hulls & a set of dies.

I researched bullets & narrowed it down to Barnes TSX 165 grain which several people have said shoots good out of their rugers. Nosler Accubond was a close second. 180 grain bullets had mixed results. Some shot good, others didn't, but 165 was pretty consistently accurate and very capable of taking Elk sized animals.

I already had some IMR 4350, which is supposed to be a good Short Mag powder.

Now to the questions. How do "you" go about working up loads? Do you start at min? Start in the middle? Do you move up in 1/2 grain increments? i'm not one of those who believe I must shoot max.

The min-max listed on barnes site for this bullet is 61.0 min, and 68.0 max (compressed with 108% case capacity).

Thanks !
 
I would advise to start at the bottom and work up. Now that being said I normaly start in the middle and work up, it just seems to work out for me. 1/2 grs is about right.
 
i start 3 grains be low max and work up if .5 grain increments till the last grain before max the i do it in .2 grains


in your case

65 65.5 66 66.5 67

67.2 67.4 .6 .8 68
 
I start 10% off book max and load one round in one grain increments until I see pressure,from this I try and figure what the max safe load will be which is usually 2-3% below where I can see pressure,,

then with the max safe load I shoot for accuracy and work down,,I like the fastest load I can get that is accurate and this process seems to get me to that load using the least amount of components,,

68 grs is listed as max in your example,,I would load one round at 61,62,63,64,65,66,67,68,69,70,71,,

I would shoot those looking closely at the fired brass and bolt lift ,primers and everything,,take it slow and shoot each round with cold barrel for consistant test data,

the first round that showed me excess pressure or velocity spikes I would stop and back down 2-3 grains and start trying for accuracy..
 
very good info... keep it coming :)

mr.big. Why do I "want" to shoot until I see pressure signs? Just get get max velocity ? Wouldn't I just want to stop once I got good groups? Shooting till I see pressure dangers, scares me, but remember, I'm new to this :)

One person suggested to test for pressure increases, I need to measure the base of the shell, and once I see increases of .003 to back off (that number may be wrong, as its off the top of my head)


I was going to load up about 5 rounds in each increment, seeing what shot best. Once I got a good group, stick with it :)

Again, thx for the comments.
 
if you are happy with just accuracy by all means just start at 62 or so and shoot groups until you get the results you want,,sometimes you will run into pressure before you get accuracy or reach book max loads though,,

thats when you reach for a different powder or bullet,,
 
Well, i am happy with accuracy, but do you get better bullet performance the faster you push it? What are teh reasons to load for max..
 
OAL question..

Are the benefits of sizing your rifles shells to "just off lands" really that beneficial, or will the books published "max OAL" suffice ? A good "load" for me would be a 2" to 2.5" group at 200 yards.. I think that would suffice to kill an elk ..
 
I just like to hit an animal with as much force as possible ,,I have never been on an elk hunt but if I did I would want all the energy I could get,,
 
I'm with mr big on this. Get all the speed you can without sacrificing too much accuracy. A 2" group at 200 yards is great in my book. As far as seating the bullet, there are tests you can do to see if your gun likes the bullet seated on the lands all the way to having a bit of jump. Personally I want mine as close as possible without touching. Book oal means little to me.
 
mr.big said:
I just like to hit an animal with as much force as possible ,,I have never been on an elk hunt but if I did I would want all the energy I could get,,
Click to expand...
I agree, but how much difference in energy would a grain or 1/2 make overall? Guess i could answer my own question by running it through a ballistics calculator....

Again yall, thanks for the answers. I have read my reloading manual over & over, but there is nothing like "real world" experience. I visit a lot of forums, but this thread has given me more insight than all the other reading i've done yet.
 
I've read on other forums and possibly in my manual that you can get to a point where a full grain of powder will only increase your fps by a 100 or less. To me that's wasted powder with no result. I wish I had a chronograph to to help compare my loads. But for now I make up loads until I have exceptable groups. I've switched powders and since I haven't had nothing exceptable. I like mr big's way of finding loads. Sounds more efficient and safer than my way of finding the right load.
 
if you shoot the one grain increment loads at the same target you should be able to see the sweet spot also,,when you see two or three different charges start grouping together you are on the accuracy node,,say if 64,65 and 66 grs are in a close group with the others stringing ,you will find a good shooting load around 85 grs,
 
I have found with shooting Barnes bullets that seating the bullets just off of the lands is not very good for accuracy. For some reason Barnes bullets are more accurate seated deeper. In my 300 WSM's, I have found that Varget gave me the best velocity and accuracy for the 165 grain TTSX seated down to the last ring showing. I tried all sorts of seating depth's and got on the various shooting forums and they pretty much all said that seating the bullets deeper gave them the best accuracy, and they were right.
 
Model7man. I load Barnes ttsx for a friend and with 44.6 grains of varget under that 165 grain bullet in a 308 is awesome out of his gun. And I have 2 rings showing. I guess it's all in the difference in guns.
 
So much bad info above, I don't know where to begin. Big is correct and M70man is close.

Barnes data is hotter than most. Reaching "their" max with "their" bullets is almost impossible, but that is besides the point.

Start by touching the lands. Your test loads are at max pressure here.

If you can't reach the lands, load to mag length. Your test loads are still at max pressure here.

You see if you start long (OAL) and work up to pressure, you're always safe to lessen oal.

Starting .10 off lands is stupid beyond belief. Let your gun tell you where pressure is. Not a book or not a poster on tndeer.

Good luck.
 
FWIW, I shoot a lot of Barnes.

tsx and ttsx

When possible (mag length constraints), I load them jammed 0.100 into lands.

Most of the time, a powder charge difference puts them into tiny groups without varying oal.
 
Not sure where the bad info is.
Model70. I load the Barnes for a savage model 11 hog hunter. The 44.6 grains of varget in my gun (savage mod 10) works well with sierra gameking bthp. But I load a bit under published oal to get off the lands.
 
mr.big said:
if you shoot the one grain increment loads at the same target you should be able to see the sweet spot also,,when you see two or three different charges start grouping together you are on the accuracy node,,say if 64,65 and 66 grs are in a close group with the others stringing ,you will find a good shooting load around 85 grs,
Click to expand...

So add 20 grains of powder to you best shooting group?

:grin:

You know I'm kidding Eric-
 
I do agree with ewc on max loads with Barnes bullets. I don't see how they get all that powder in the case and the bullet seated to their depth.
 
Jcalder said:
Not sure where the bad info is.
Model70. I load the Barnes for a savage model 11 hog hunter. The 44.6 grains of varget in my gun (savage mod 10) works well with sierra gameking bthp. But I load a bit under published oal to get off the lands.
Click to expand...

How fast is it going? And why did you load a lesser oal? And why are you nervous about touching the lands? (assuming you can...)

No offense, but if you can't measure some of these things, you are just guessing and reading on the internet.

Please take no offense to the questions, as they are sincere and I am only pointing out mistakes I have made.
 
I'm not taking offense by any means. I believe the published oal for that bullet is 2.750. At 2.740 I'm on the lands. A guy I work with who helped me get started suggested staying off the lands so that's been my rule of thumb. And that load has produced several good groups. Alot of 3 shot groups with 2 holes. All other loads that I've produced have generally been longer than published oal. I'm not against touching the lands if it shoots well and no pressure issues have developed. Not sure what my velocities are. I know I'm over max according to the sierra manual with the varget load
 
You are touching lands at 2.740" ?

I'm pretty certain I can't touch lands and I load to mag length @ 2.860".
 
I touch the lands with a 165 sgk bthp at 2.740. I load a 165 sgk btsp to 2.890 I believe and Barnes ttsx to 2.860.
 
I think my next investment is gonna be a bullet comparator so I can refine some of the differences
 
I don't think you are touching the lands with either load.

I think you are measuring your mag length. Look up the max col.
 

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