An observation really

[REN]

I've seen (what's seems to be) more examples of folks shooting birds where all they see or saw were the heads. Add to that on some of them there is no back drop due to the set up where the shot just keeps going beyond the bird somewhere.

To be clear I'm not pointing fingers or calling anyone out and every situation is different just not sure how I feel about it. Seems to go against a lot of hunter safety taught lessons of identification and shot safety. Videos don't show generally all angles or the whole story so again I'm not passing judgment. Add to it being on videos i feel it kinda sends the wrong message to younger hunters or new hunters, that not fully seeing your target is ok.

I'm aware shot safety while shooting uphill with no back stop isn't the same for shotguns as it is rifles but still seems odd to me.

Again not calling anyone out or anything, it may just be me and my older age is all lol. Just wasn't sure if maybe I am just off in that thinking

 

[catman529]

Well it is a shotgun not a rifle, so the backdrop issue isn't really of concern. We shoot squirrels, doves and ducks without a backdrop


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[REN]

Well it is a shotgun not a rifle, so the backdrop issue isn't really of concern. We shoot squirrels, doves and ducks without a backdrop


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Noted which is why I said as such. Although in those examples they seem slightly different (at least dove and ducks)

 

[REN]

And I want to be very clear that I'm not really calling you out or anything (although it prob seems that way). Just something I've noticed more this year is all in videos and heck I could be completely off base in that observation

 

[AT Hiker]

The logic is simple, gotta kill at all cost man.

Don't ya know it's not cool to call a turkey in and give him a pass? Doesn't make for good instagram, bro.


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[fairchaser]

I have had to pass on some gobbler heads that I was 99% sure but couldn't see the beard. Our club has a strict no jake rule which keeps us all sure. But, no turkey is worth spraying some building or someone with shot either. That being said, I pull the trigger pretty quick when I know it's a gobbler.

 

[Huntaholic]

Its awfully easy to get caught up in the "Ive got to kill out at almost any cost" mindset. Ive been guilty of it myself. In fact over on what used to be the sister board of tndeer I had quite a reputation as being the 1st one to kill out every year. If the season had been open 7 days and I wasn't done people would be checking on me to see what was wrong. LOL I outgrew it. It got to the point that when somebody would ask that I would tell them I don't reckon Ive got anything to prove. Just my own personal objective, but if I cant call a bird up and get him to do what I want, I wont kill him. My season will be over soon enough as it is, theres no reason to rush it.

 

[user 972]

Well it is a shotgun not a rifle, so the backdrop issue isn't really of concern. We shoot squirrels, doves and ducks without a backdrop


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Noted which is why I said as such. Although in those examples they seem slightly different (at least dove and ducks)

Shot angles with a turkey on the ground is different than game in the air or tree.
Still a hard judgement call. Turkey on a high spot and you can't see the ground on the other side, is there a hunter crawling up for a closer shot? I've seen it done and done it myself. Private land, easier call to make.

The situation of seeing a head and no visible beard because all the hunter can see the head, to me that's an ethical situation. I know a guy that shot a hen strutting on a log. "It's strutting so it's got to be a Tom, right?". No beard.

 

[Buzzard Breath]

I'm glad Catman put out this educational video as to why it's important to be 100% sure you identify your target before shooting. This jake decoy didn't have a beard, so it would have been illegal to shoot. I can't believe people hunt like This on public land. This is the exact reason you don't shoot something just because you are a red head pop out from behind a tree. Go to the 2:10 mark.

[youtube]JlKtzd9uES4[/youtube]

 

[deerfever]

To me it's simple the law says visible beard so I make sure that I see one. The gobbler my son killed earlier this year is an example. The first thing we seen was a big red head and fan. He waited until it come over the hill to shoot it. He is 11 and told me himself he was waiting on a better shot and " to see a beard"! It may be a gobbler but it also could have beard rot and not have a visible beard which makes it illegal. To each his own but I would rather let one get by me as to shoot a Jake or one with beard rot that has no visible strands. I am not at all downing anyone that shoots jakes just not my thing as I have seen a ton this year and hope they survive for the next. No way I would hold a decoy of any sort in front of my face like that on public , private or anywhere. I don't use them but that made me cringe!

 

[AT Hiker]

TDW05,

The TN law could possibly save idiots like this from being shot in the face.

Insert You Tube star, hunting turkey on public land...

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[PickettSFHunter]

I can't believe they do stuff like that, regardless if its public or private land, and show it
to the masses of YouTube. I'm sure some people watch that and find it acceptable or just don't know any better. I don't care how revered that show is here, that is completely irresponsible and unsafe. I'm sure they will defend it and say they knew no one was around, etc. Even without considering the ethical options of more traditional turkey hunters regarding decoys, that's just reckless, as is crawling through the field with the decoy as well.

 

[woodsman04]

Can't believe people think it's a good idea to had behind a decoy on any land. Chances of that happening are low, but it could still happen. And what could make it even more deadly is so many people now are using TSS in a 3.5" 12 gauge. And some may use it as large as # 7 shot which I hear could have the same energy as 4 lead? I'm not a TSS guy so I don't know a lot about it. I think it's also dangerous and maybe perhaps unethical as well because so many people are trying to shoot turkeys at 70 yards


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[Levee Jumper]

These are the ones that are recruiting new hunters lol. No wonder turkey hunting is such a googan fest.

 

[TDW05]

TDW05,

The TN law could possibly save idiots like this from being shot in the face.

Insert You Tube star, hunting turkey on public land...

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That, I agree, is utterly stupid.

 

[redblood]

Definitely looks dangerous. I wouldnt do that on my own farm

 

[th88]

You have got to be kidding me?!?!

They know better than that.

These are the ones that are recruiting new hunters lol. No wonder turkey hunting is such a googan fest.

Truth.

 

[Southern Sportsman]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

 

[catman529]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

exactly, you nailed it


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[woodsman04]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

This is how I hunt.


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[elknturkey]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

Exactly. I'd bet 90% of the turkeys we kill we never see the beard. All steep mountain with a lot of razorback ridges. See 50 yards standing and 20 yards sitting.

I've seen 1 bird a guy killed prob 15 years ago in VA that actually did have a beard but had been pulled out. Had just recently been pulled out but not sure by what. Still to this day is the best spurs I've ever seen. 1 3/4" and hooked almost like a fishing hook

 

[Shooter77]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

exactly, you nailed it


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So the law says it must have a beard and you both are saying it's ok not to positively ID your target?

Bag Limits
One (1) bearded turkey per day, not to exceed four (4) per season. Any turkey harvested during the Young Sportsman Hunt counts toward the Spring season limit of four (4).

 

[Boll Weevil]

Some years ago I killed one that strutted and gobbled his way across a field with really heavy dew; his beard was soaked and stuck to his wet breast feathers. When I walked up to him didn't initially see a beard and was actually a bit concerned thinking I'd somehow shot the wrong bird but upon inspection, it was indeed there. That's about the only instance I can recall not confirming a beard before pulling the trigger.

 

[elknturkey]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

exactly, you nailed it


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So the law says it must have a beard and you both are saying it's ok not to positively ID your target?

Bag Limits
One (1) bearded turkey per day, not to exceed four (4) per season. Any turkey harvested during the Young Sportsman Hunt counts toward the Spring season limit of four (4).

I'm sure the law is so morons don't shoot nonbearded hens. Same as states having a 3" spike rule on deer

 

[ImThere]

I also drove 72 mph on the interstate this morning

How could you? I'm so freaking offended right now!

j/k

 

[Southern Sportsman]

Except for an occasional trip to LBL, I don't hunt many true ridges. But as most know, if you're actually calling one in, you've got to put something between you and the turkey to make him come find you. If that something is the crest of a ridge, seems like more often than not, the turkey will come far enough to see over the crest and maybe not much farther if he doesn't see anything on the other side. If I call in a bird and I'm 100% sure it's a male and I'm 95% sure it's a gobbler and he periscopes his head over the ridge 30 yards away, I don't see a problem with killing him. That's what I'd do. I get what you're saying, but I don't see it as a real safety issue. If you call a gobbler up through tall grass or a thicket on flat ground, you could argue that someone could be crawling through that thicket right behind him. But it's so unlikely that it doesn't even warrant discussion. Same with a ridge topper turkey. Im usually not for killing jakes and I certainly don't intend to do it. But if a jake gobbles and acts just like a gobbler and comes to me gobbling and raises his head up in range and it doesn't look like a skinny red jake head — I guess there is just a decent chance I'll inadvertently kill a jake. I can live with that.

As for the risk that I might possibly kill a gobbler without a beard - those odds are tiny. I've killed several with beard rot, but in my life I've only seen one gobbler truly without a beard. If I happen to do it because I shoot one that's hidden below the waddles, I'll self report it, explain what happened, and won't loose much sleep over it.

There are a LOT of things that go on in turkey hunting that I hate with all my heart and soul. But shooting gobbling turkeys when they poke their head over a ridge isn't one of them.

exactly, you nailed it


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So the law says it must have a beard and you both are saying it's ok not to positively ID your target?

Bag Limits
One (1) bearded turkey per day, not to exceed four (4) per season. Any turkey harvested during the Young Sportsman Hunt counts toward the Spring season limit of four (4).

No. The "target" is a male turkey. Not positively identifying your target is how decoys or hens or people get shot. I'm ALWAYS 100% sure I'm shooting a male turkey. Fortunately, male turkeys have beards. So if I know I'm shooting a male turkey I'm confident enough that he has a beard. I'm batting .1000. As noted, if one day I shoot a gobbler standing in waddle-tall cover and he's a 1/1,000,000 oddball without a beard, I'll handle it the right way, self report it, deal with whatever comes of it (probably nothing), and I'll shoot the next gobbler that comes in like that.

 

[megalomaniac]

Gotta be WAY more careful in MS than in TN 99% of the time, as MS has a no jake rule.

An adult (legal) bird is defined as a male bird with either a 6"plus beard, OR a male bird with a full fan. I had to pass on a couple males that hung up at 25 yards with heads periscoped up over the ridge I was just over earlier this year. I'm 100% sure they were males, but was no where near 100% sure they were adults. But it's ok by me for the turkeys to win a few matches (as long as I get to win some, too )

 

[woodsman04]

I like Alabama's rule. Gobblers only. Be sure of your target is the main thing, and what's around or beyond it.
If a gobbler pokes his head Over the ridge or log i shoot him. Lucky enough I've never killed a non bearded one but if I do I'll live with it.
Decoys are dangerous. Lots of idiots that shoot at whatever, and some idiots use rifles and not shotguns.


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[Southern Sportsman]

Gotta be WAY more careful in MS than in TN 99% of the time, as MS has a no jake rule.

An adult (legal) bird is defined as a male bird with either a 6"plus beard, OR a male bird with a full fan. I had to pass on a couple males that hung up at 25 yards with heads periscoped up over the ridge I was just over earlier this year. I'm 100% sure they were males, but was no where near 100% sure they were adults. But it's ok by me for the turkeys to win a few matches (as long as I get to win some, too )

That's a good distinction to point out. I dont want to shoot a jake, but knowing that if I do all it cost me is a
is a tag and a lot of trash talk from my buddies makes it reasonable to shoot one if I'm convinced, but not 100% certain, that it's a gobbler. If jakes weren't legal, I'd need to see a fan or a wing covert or a beard or a spur.

 

[REN]

some good points are made and I dont disagree with some of them. I am just very anti jake personally, not so much that others should not shoot them but I really dont want to shoot one. So for me just seeing a red head over a hill is not enough for me and I would 100% miss the opportunity to take the shot if I am not certain it is an adult male. I would much rather hunt another day then walk up on a jake I thought was a tom, but again thats just my own opinion.

I still find it odd to not full be able to identify your target prior to shooting. There can be a hen or another tom right behind them you dont see yet and when you shoot they happen to put there head up at the same time and you end up with 2 dead birds. IDK I just find it a big risk when the alternative is just to pass on the shot and take the chance to walk out empty handed.