STRESS

Dean Parisian

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Pamelot, TN Ghost Ranc MT San Jose del Cabo, MX
I lived 28 years in a north Atlanta suburb. We bow hunted (on Mondays) the Atlanta Athletic Club and many of those golf clubs were beautiful fawning areas. The young bucks at the SEEK ONE crew (you tube them if you like big bucks) are testament to low stress environments putting mass (energy) into antler development. I spent Thursday at the Safari Club International annual gala in Nashville. If you hunt you should go once in your life. Once. That's my take but it was $205 to enter on Thursday. I talked to the owner-operators of 3 high fence operations. One in Indiana. One in Missouri. One in Ohio if memory serves. I was trying to gain insight on what they do for predator control within their high fence and and types of sanctuary. All three obviously agreed you need 3 things. One, No stress. Two, great nutrition. Three, sanctuary. It appears the demand for big antlers isn't going away. One owner flat out said he doesn't allow .270's to be used. One guy said he shoots a couple hundred bucks per year and only allows bucks, no does, in his 1700 acres of high fence. All have used in vitro fertilization, artificial insemination and breeding pens. Hard to believe the size of the 2.5 year deer! One guy told me in 32 years he had 3 bucks he wouldn't allow to be shot. Here is one of the bucks that scored 279 and died of natural cause at age 10.
53DB9936-D97F-4147-BB16-D753FB9C640C.jpeg

Here is the father of the deer I am holding. As you can see the doe (mother) had significant genetic traits that didn't carry thru!

C8701CDA-FFF3-4A8C-978A-DBA10E851A6A.jpeg

He said the rich Mexican Carlos Slim offered him a million dollars for this buck on the hoof for his breeding operation. No idea if that was true but I don't doubt the price if Carlos Slim was involved. That massive 6x6 I saw a year ago near BNA, Nashville Intl Airport had little stress. How does one reduce stress on open property is the issue. Coyotes, bear, everything that causes deer to take energy away from antler growth should be a focus. But how does a guy do it successfully?
 
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DoubleRidge

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I totally understand the lack of interest in high fence operations and I don't follow Seek One either....but in all fairness the question was:

How does one (a land manager) reduce stress on an open "free range" property in hopes that deer will be more likely to express their genetic potential.

I believe "no (or low) stress" and "Sanctuary" go hand in hand....it's not always easy, especially when a property is used for various forms of recreation....but dedicating a portion (or portions) of your property as Sanctuary or Refuge is a great step towards reducing stress and pressure on the herd.
 

Maude

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Oct 1, 2007
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Ooltewah, TN
Did I read that correctly, $205 to enter the show? I've always wanted to see what the SCI show was about but that's a little above my interest point.
 

Chickenrig

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Barbour County ,Al
I totally understand the lack of interest in high fence operations and I don't follow Seek One either....but in all fairness the question was:

How does one (a land manager) reduce stress on an open "free range" property in hopes that deer will be more likely to express their genetic potential.

I believe "no (or low) stress" and "Sanctuary" go hand in hand....it's not always easy, especially when a property is used for various forms of recreation....but dedicating a portion (or portions) of your property as Sanctuary or Refuge is a great step towards reducing stress and pressure on the herd.
Who really cares???
I think those of ya'll that drink the coolaide have had your fill. Antler size this ,horn size that ,look at me with my big rack buck in my latest version of camo as i post it on my facebook and forum sites!!
Tell me again what the F difference it makes in your life? Does it make up for your little Richard to show off to the entire planet that you done killed a good deer? Whooooppeeee you must be a real man !!!
Tell me again so i'll understand !!
Good Lord, just hunt
 

DoubleRidge

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Middle Tennessee
Who really cares???
I think those of ya'll that drink the coolaide have had your fill. Antler size this ,horn size that ,look at me with my big rack buck in my latest version of camo as i post it on my facebook and forum sites!!
Tell me again what the F difference it makes in your life? Does it make up for your little **** to show off to the entire planet that you done killed a good deer? Whooooppeeee you must be a real man !!!
Tell me again so i'll understand !!
Good Lord, just hunt
Wow....my comments were pertaining to land management practices. You know this is in the QDM forum right?....so not uncommon to discuss management practices here?...Creating Sanctuary areas on your property to give deer a place to be without pressure isn't drinking Kool aid?...it's more about managing for a healthy herd....over time I developed more of an interest in managing the habitat than I have actually killing deer...killing a mature buck is a bonus.
 

megalomaniac

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Oct 28, 2005
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Mississippi
It's impossible to reduce stress in a free ranging herd to the same level that can be accomplished in a high fence... BUT those properties which have less stress on their animals have much healthier animals.

Major stressors are lack of adequate nutritious food and overpopulation.

Minor stressors are lack of security cover and predators.

Aggressive habitat management will help reduce, but not eliminate all.

Let's face it... deer have to be high strung and wound tight in order to survive. High stress is just their nature. But excessive stress opens them up to weakness from disease and parasitism.
 

BSK

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Mar 11, 1999
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Nashville, TN
It's impossible to reduce stress in a free ranging herd to the same level that can be accomplished in a high fence... BUT those properties which have less stress on their animals have much healthier animals.

Major stressors are lack of adequate nutritious food and overpopulation.

Minor stressors are lack of security cover and predators.

Aggressive habitat management will help reduce, but not eliminate all.

Let's face it... deer have to be high strung and wound tight in order to survive. High stress is just their nature. But excessive stress opens them up to weakness from disease and parasitism.
Well said. I would add hunting pressure to the stressor list.
 

MickThompson

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Cookeville, Tennessee
Consider the source of the original information- is there anything more stressful for a wild animal than captivity? I suppose we are to just ignore the stress of capturing, handling, transporting, and releasing deer into unnaturally high densities. I'd argue that the best way to minimize stress is to let deer be deer- they are adapted to dealing with predators and seasonal diet shifts.
 

DoubleRidge

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Middle Tennessee
Consider the source of the original information- is there anything more stressful for a wild animal than captivity? I suppose we are to just ignore the stress of capturing, handling, transporting, and releasing deer into unnaturally high densities. I'd argue that the best way to minimize stress is to let deer be deer- they are adapted to dealing with predators and seasonal diet shifts.
Well said..."let deer be deer"....and this goes right along with the idea of creating sanctuary areas where we don't hunt or put any pressure on the deer.
 

DoubleRidge

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Middle Tennessee
I've seen a lot of deer in high fences. I've seen a lot of deer in pens and breeder pens. And what I've seen deer grow (antler-wise) in a pen is NOT relatable to real-life (in the wild). The two situations are so night-and-day different that comparing them is not realistic.
No doubt comparing wild deer verses high fence deer is not realistic....but the concept of reducing as many stressors as possible makes sense for the health of the herd.... increase cover, increase nutrition and decreased pressure can all contribute to a healthier herd and a better hunting experience.
 

ImThere

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Aug 24, 2006
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Lewisburg, Tn
You'd have to have so much land the deer could have everything they wanted and never need leave paradise it's totally unrealistic. Unless you put up that high fence!
 

Chickenrig

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Barbour County ,Al
Wow....my comments were pertaining to land management practices. You know this is in the QDM forum right?....so not uncommon to discuss management practices here?...Creating Sanctuary areas on your property to give deer a place to be without pressure isn't drinking Kool aid?...it's more about managing for a healthy herd....over time I developed more of an interest in managing the habitat than I have actually killing deer...killing a mature buck is a bonus.
Doubleridge
My bad and i apologize for going off
Sometimes i get to wandering and it comes out at the wrong time and place
 
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