need help sniffing fairys dust

stonegraham

Active Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2020
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26
Location
atlanta
Ok, I cant stand the guy. His voice cut my soul every seconds that I watch his video. But under all that arrogant condesensing smug exterior, he make a strong argument backed by facts/experience/example. So I'm going to give it a try with some spare arrows, not buying any more arrows due to wife knowing how many arrows I already have.

Mathew Creed at 63lbs and 27DL

Carbon Express Mayhem Hunter DS 350 Spine currently at 32in 9.8GPI no insert

G5 Montec 100gr

So what would be the best way to make an 'adult' arrow?
What inserts systems should I get, how long should I cut arrow?
Can I stay with 100gr boardheads or is it better to go 125, 150, 200?

Would I be able to feel any difference practicing with heavier arrows? I am expecting slower speed and more trajectory due to lost of speed. But what else can I expect? Or is the only noticable different would be in actual hunting scenario?

Example of your arrow built is welcome.
 

tke466

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2019
Messages
14
Location
Summer County
How adult do you want to get? The stuff he talks about is all true... however the other component of the conversation is the trajectory tradeoff. This is often missed. Ashby has always stated to run the heaviest arrow for the trajectory you desire. Personally I stay in that 520 to 550 grain arrow weight range and keep foc at 15%+ on compound. Thats my whitetail and elk setup. My trad bow is at 650 grains. RF really only shoots hogs at close range... say you want to stretch out, the weight he runs really constrains you. If always less than 20 yards then he'll yeh brother sling a 700, 800, or whatever grain arrow out there.
 

Bushape

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Joined
Jan 9, 2019
Messages
296
I have been debating doing the same but stumbled upon the idea too close to hunting season to change things up
So I stuck with my "flingers" as TRF would say. I killed a pretty nice buck with a bow this year at 31 yards. I'd say my lighter setup is moving around 260-280 fps. The thought that I now can't get out of my mind is would I have even touched this deer with a "big boy" arrow? He was quartering away and dropped and spun as the arrow flew. When it comes time I'll get in the shop and try to find my best balance of FOC and speed. Shooting 220 fps may be ok when your target is under 25 yards but I don't get that many deer that close to me much less true trophy bucks.
 

tori9600

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2020
Messages
11
Location
Johnson City
I've been watching RF's videos a lot the last few weeks. He has said on more than one occasion that he recommends that shots be kept under 40 yards, even under 30. I haven't bow hunted in quite a few years and I am currently looking at getting back in and I will be going by his recommendations. I never did understand why people wanted so much speed for a hunting setup. Plus, I never tried to shoot anything past 20 yards, everywhere I hunt in the mountains of northeast Tennessee doesn't allow more than that. So, for me, what RF says makes perfect sense. That's my 2 cents on it.
 

PickettSFHunter

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2004
Messages
21,820
Location
Jamestown, TN
I just stay fairly basic. 125 gr broadhead. 100 gr brass insert. 300 spine arrow. Total weight around 550 gr. I definitely had better penetration on deer this year but I will say that I don't have a ton of test subjects down yet. I keep shots close anyway, to much a deer can do farther out. I try not to shoot over 30. I do hand sharpen my broadheads and get them absolutely razor sharp.
 

102

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Joined
Aug 1, 2002
Messages
4,424
Location
Tennessee
A subject near and dear to my heart.
Read what Bushape wrote and NEVER forget it:

"I have been debating doing the same but stumbled upon the idea too close to hunting season to change things up
So I stuck with my "flingers" as TRF would say. I killed a pretty nice buck with a bow this year at 31 yards. I'd say my lighter setup is moving around 260-280 fps. The thought that I now can't get out of my mind is would I have even touched this deer with a "big boy" arrow? He was quartering away and dropped and spun as the arrow flew. When it comes time I'll get in the shop and try to find my best balance of FOC and speed. Shooting 220 fps may be ok when your target is under 25 yards but I don't get that many deer that close to me much less true trophy bucks."

I have corresponded with RF several times. I am not certain about this but I'm pretty sure most of his hunting is hogs from a stand near a feeder where his shots are limited to well inside 25 yards.

Here's the REALITY of bowhunting run and gun style. Which is what many of us Tennessee hunters do especially on public high pressured lands.

I rarely hunt the same stand on public ground two days in a row. So I move A BUNCH!

This keeps one on their toes when always moving around because even though I frequently know what the deer are doing there at that location, and WHY they are there (i.e. traveling through, feeding, bedding etc) I frequently am surprised by what direction they take to end up in front of my stand.

This makes for some very tense and surprising moments. Often followed by VERY quick judgements on distance and shot ops. It is VERY COMMON to have shots in the 20 yard range. (my average is actually 19).
But I have taken several big mature bucks past 25 yards.

I am shooting the following setup:
Bowtech Icon 60 pounds
378 grain FINISHED arrow including a 100 grain Cut on Contact Magnus Serrazor Black Hornet 4 Blade.
Arrow speed is about 260
KE is all over 55 lbs.

My top pin shoots 1.5 inches low at 25 yards.
At 30, holding that pin low for deer drop if alert, using that pin and mistaking a quick decision distance judgement of 3 or so yards, IT'S A MISS!!!

And quieting down a bow with a heavier arrow makes that margin for error MUCH worse.
In FACT, that same top pin is now set for 20 yards.

I like to keep things simple for bowhunting. There is too much to think about as it is.

When I started bowhunting all we had to shoot were HEAVY aluminum arrows and cut on contact heads.

We all had to shoot 70 plus pounds to try to get out top pins to shoot "flat" out to 20 yards. I remember when speed bows with brittle limbs started showing up (and blowing up) on the tournament trail.

I remember the first carbon arrows with warning labels on the shaft about not consuming meat from area where there was evidence the arrow splintered.
And I remember VERY WELL the first time I shot a 60 pound bow with an 8 inch brace height (very forgiving) that shot fast enough to give me a top pin accurate to 25 yards!
That was HUGE. Because MOST of my bow 300 PLUS kills were well inside 25 yards!

I can promise you this.
There have been MANY more deer missed because of slower heavy arrows and mis judged distance than killed because of more (not adequate) penetration ability!

Here's another truth:
MOST bowhunters, especially less experienced bowhunters, are not really familiar with the anatomy of whitetails. Which wound/hit results in what blood color.
Sure most know lungs.
But pyloric artery?
Kidneys?
Aorta?
Liver?
Where the spine actually runs along a deers back/neck?
How the scapula can affect arrow placement/travel?

And in the end, what arrow hit results in what decisions to make about bloodtrailing.

We ALL would be better of to shoot a COC head, the LARGEST diameter we can accurately shoot.
With a set up that puts our top pin as far out as possible.
With a balance between speed and noise.

And then MOST of all...
Get good enough with our set ups to be able to deliver a killing shot at a deer, within our effective range, no matter what angle the deer gives us.
 

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