Let's get serious about Older Bucks

[TN24081]

You very well could be right. There have been others on this forum that have shared the same beliefs. Personally I have mixed feelings about it. We never shoot anything that is less than 130", which means we go several years in between killing a buck ( like this year ). That being said, we enjoy each and every day we are allowed to hunt and we hunt just as hard on January 1 as we do on November 21. Even as someone who would be considered a "trophy hunter," the time spent in the woods with my son and my friends enjoying God's wonderful creations, is worth far more to me than a truckload of 150 class bucks!

So as much as I love shooting big bucks, I enjoy every minute of the loooong deer season and would hate to see it shortened in the name of bigger bucks. That's just me, we all hunt for different reasons.

TN24081~

We DO all hunt for different reasons.

I spent many seasons doing exactly what you were doing except my sights were set much higher,mi passed on some nice 150"class bucks the farm I was hunting at the time . There were a couple of 170 class bucks there. After seeing one either too far off or too late or too early I finally got paid but it was a long road.

What I found was tag soup is not nearly as tasty as back straps.

While I am proud of my big deer. I have had way more fun and enjoyment just hunting and taking what I want when I want it,


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Yea, I take a lot of pride in the mature bucks I've taken but it's been all about the kids for me for the last ten years. I passed on some good bucks hoping that my son could kill him next time we went, then never see the joker again ! I wouldn't change a thang though.

 

[losthunter]

I like it the way it is now. If you want to kill for meat you can, if you want to kill for horns you can. Does this need to be debated all the time? Just curious.

 

[BD1]

I personally would like to see the season open two weeks later and stay open two weeks longer. I too love to archery hunt and it's just to hot opening the season in Sept. and The second rut is going on when the season ends and like this year it is just now getting cold. Also that would make waiting on turkey season a little easier(two weeks closer) . Just my two cents.

 

[Mike Belt]

I'm all for older bucks which sometimes equates to bigger antlers, and I'm not ashamed of that at all. There are several things that factor into Tn vs. other states that may have bigger bucks killed and they've been beat to death on here. With everything said and done I'm satisfied with Tn's hunting regulations as far as leading to the possibility of killing any deer and the occasional good buck. That probably fits the bill for the average hunter + or -. It's possible in some areas there could be some tweaking done concerning doe populations but overall, most hunters should be happy with our limits and length of the seasons.

 

[Wobblyshot1]

It ain't all about trophy hunting.

Who said ANYTHING about "trophy hunting"?

I said older aged class bucks.

Sorry about that. I made a quick assumption about trophy hunting....but isn't one purpose for of an older age class buck the likelihood it will have bigger horns? I'm pretty content with Tennessee's deer season the way it is. JMO

 

[farmin68]

I personally would like to see the season open two weeks later and stay open two weeks longer. I too love to archery hunt and it's just to hot opening the season in Sept. and The second rut is going on when the season ends and like this year it is just now getting cold. Also that would make waiting on turkey season a little easier(two weeks closer) . Just my two cents.

Thankfully, that will never fly. :roll:

 

[JKC]

I also ask the question what is wrong with shooting a young buck. I don't discount the idea Tennessee can, and I think, currently grows big bucks. Terrain plays the biggest role though I think in their firearms seasons. I am like some others though, I really feel fortunate having a long rifle season. I enjoy it much more than bow hunting.

If you shoot young bucks they don't get to be older bucks.

 

[AT Hiker]

Our long firearm season (mzl and rifle) covers the rut for the entire state. Thats good for everyone, doesnt give the deer much of a break though. In my area, rifle season has really tanked. If you dont hunt before rifle opener your really missing some of the best movement except for very late season food sources.

If for some reason our state went to a restricted season like KY, NE, IL, etc we would get used to it. Just like most of us took Monday off to mzl hunt.

Other states have just as much, if not more, opportunity as we do. Its just mainly in the form of archery. Im not a big archery hunter anymore, so I like TN as it is. If I was mainly a rifle hunter I would be in support of a shorter mzl season though, geographically speaking.


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[deerchaser007]

I'm all about reducing the firearm days, but in full disclosure and absolute honesty it is because I am an archer to the core. I would love to see it happen, but it never will and I really wouldn't support it--however, the archer in me would be screaming!!!!

Since I've been researching this 2-3 buck limit thing and gathering information from other States, some items have stood out like a sore thumb in the data. I always assumed that the shortened gun seasons in the Midwest had everything to do with managing for antlers and was quickly corrected by the time I got to the 3rd State. Almost everyone of these big-buck States have 2-4 times the amount of licensed hunters as we do!!

I understand that every State collects data differently as far as harvests, so I'm not going to even try to rewrite the data to make a point, but when you have States like Iowa and Illinois that have 2½ times the number of hunters and 70% of land is ag fields, you better have a very short gun season or you're not going to have a deer herd left. We have significantly less hunters and 70% woodland habitat, so I'm comfortable saying our season is at least acceptable all things being equal. (My inner bowhunter really did not like that being written)

So true. Just look at the mess the deer herd in Minnesota is now.

 

[TN Whitetail Freak]

i kind of like white lettering on the outside of my tires

 

[WRbowhunter]

Again another great thing about TN hunting . You can pretty much hunt the way you want. There is nothing limiting a hunter or club from making their land a no gun zone or limiting the gun season to 10 days or what ever they want. You can also limit yourself just to one Mature buck and call it a season if you want. Not a thing in the req. from preventing this.

 

[Mike Belt]

Going on years now I've advocated not hunting until prime time hunting in your immediate area. I still think that's a great idea. The only problem with reduced statewide season dates is not everyone would be able to hunt "their" prime time. The seasons set as they are allow for that to happen. I'd rather take my chances keeping those seasons and hunting pressured deer at prime time than to have to hunt dates where unpressured deer weren't moving.

 

[Vermin93]

I'm all about reducing the firearm days, but in full disclosure and absolute honesty it is because I am an archer to the core. I would love to see it happen, but it never will and I really wouldn't support it--however, the archer in me would be screaming!!!!

Since I've been researching this 2-3 buck limit thing and gathering information from other States, some items have stood out like a sore thumb in the data. I always assumed that the shortened gun seasons in the Midwest had everything to do with managing for antlers and was quickly corrected by the time I got to the 3rd State. Almost everyone of these big-buck States have 2-4 times the amount of licensed hunters as we do!!

I understand that every State collects data differently as far as harvests, so I'm not going to even try to rewrite the data to make a point, but when you have States like Iowa and Illinois that have 2½ times the number of hunters and 70% of land is ag fields, you better have a very short gun season or you're not going to have a deer herd left. We have significantly less hunters and 70% woodland habitat, so I'm comfortable saying our season is at least acceptable all things being equal. (My inner bowhunter really did not like that being written)

Can you share the data that you found on number of licensed deer hunters per state? Those numbers would be interesting to see. With states like Iowa and Kansas having a population that's less than half the size of Tennessee, it would be pretty impressive if they have over 2 times as many licensed deer hunters as Tennessee. I can see that being the case in Illinois, Ohio and Pennsylvania because they have a much bigger overall population than Tennessee. Indiana would be an interesting one to see the numbers on because it's total population is about the same as Tennessee.

 

[AXL78]

I'm all about reducing the firearm days, but in full disclosure and absolute honesty it is because I am an archer to the core. I would love to see it happen, but it never will and I really wouldn't support it--however, the archer in me would be screaming!!!!

Since I've been researching this 2-3 buck limit thing and gathering information from other States, some items have stood out like a sore thumb in the data. I always assumed that the shortened gun seasons in the Midwest had everything to do with managing for antlers and was quickly corrected by the time I got to the 3rd State. Almost everyone of these big-buck States have 2-4 times the amount of licensed hunters as we do!!

I understand that every State collects data differently as far as harvests, so I'm not going to even try to rewrite the data to make a point, but when you have States like Iowa and Illinois that have 2½ times the number of hunters and 70% of land is ag fields, you better have a very short gun season or you're not going to have a deer herd left. We have significantly less hunters and 70% woodland habitat, so I'm comfortable saying our season is at least acceptable all things being equal. (My inner bowhunter really did not like that being written)

Can you share the data that you found on number of licensed deer hunters per state? Those numbers would be interesting to see. With states like Iowa and Kansas having a population that's less than half the size of Tennessee, it would be pretty impressive if they have over 2 times as many licensed deer hunters as Tennessee. I can see that being the case in Illinois, Ohio and Pennsylvania because they have a much bigger overall population than Tennessee. Indiana would be an interesting one to see the numbers on because it's total population is about the same as Tennessee.

Just guessing, but I think Kansas and Iowa have a pretty large amount of out of state hunters. Kansas I know does, it also supports a large population of non-licensed hunters I hear. lol

 

[Bone Collector]

You could tell me that having a shorter gun season would magically make the deer's antlers keeping growing bigger even after you mounted them on the wall and I wouldn't give up any rifle season days. You could tell me that there would magically be more B&C bucks than hunters in the woods if only we gave up a significant chunk of our rifle season and I would pass on the offer. I am simply not interested in a shorter rifle season under any circumstance barring disease, major die off or some other significant event or circumstance that drastically reduced the herd over a large area.


http://www.GoCarnivore.com

Ditto! I am against anything law change that is made with larger antlers in mind. Don't quote this post and rebut that older deer in the herd is a biological reason, so therefore its not all about antlers, cause I'm throwing the BS flag right now. The guys that want lower limits and shorter gun seasons want one thing and one thing only larger antlered bucks. Old bucks are not a necessary requirement of a healthy, breeding deer population that provides opportunity to put good lean protein in the freezer.

 

[TN Whitetail Freak]

my opinion on rifle season....leave it.............im not a fan of taking away from the people.........the odds of success of killing a buck decreases when you take a rifle away from a hunter in most cases...i bow hunted all year and had i had a rifle i could have shot one of my target bucks...so by me not having a rifle saved that buck so i can see where people thinking that taking the rifle out of the hunters hands would decrease hunter chances at killing bucks in general thus them living on to the next year BUT...im no advocate of taking away from the hunters.....my solution....i hunt spots that are the majority of the year archery only.....or restricted hunting dates....I hunt for antlers and it wouldnt make sense for me to go hunting at a spot where statewide seasons legally exist...not saying i couldnt pull one out of those heavily hunted spots its just im a poker player and my odds are a loads better at the weapon and antler restricted spots....ive seen first hand in just one hunting season what restrictions do.....i personally restrict myself so hunting these spots do not impact me negatively.....i go to a place where im happy and the rest of the state can continue on with there legal hunting season and everyone is happy.

 

[PillsburyDoughboy]

I'm all about reducing the firearm days, but in full disclosure and absolute honesty it is because I am an archer to the core. I would love to see it happen, but it never will and I really wouldn't support it--however, the archer in me would be screaming!!!!

Since I've been researching this 2-3 buck limit thing and gathering information from other States, some items have stood out like a sore thumb in the data. I always assumed that the shortened gun seasons in the Midwest had everything to do with managing for antlers and was quickly corrected by the time I got to the 3rd State. Almost everyone of these big-buck States have 2-4 times the amount of licensed hunters as we do!!

I understand that every State collects data differently as far as harvests, so I'm not going to even try to rewrite the data to make a point, but when you have States like Iowa and Illinois that have 2½ times the number of hunters and 70% of land is ag fields, you better have a very short gun season or you're not going to have a deer herd left. We have significantly less hunters and 70% woodland habitat, so I'm comfortable saying our season is at least acceptable all things being equal. (My inner bowhunter really did not like that being written)

Perhaps not to hijack this thread but start another one.

I would love to see the data you have collected. I for one did not know that about other states issuing 2-4 time the amount of licenses that TN does. I would love to see those numbers if you have time to share them.

 

[Headhunter]

I have had the good fortune to hunt out of state quite a bit over the past couple decades or so. And one thing has REALLY impressed me when talking about older aged class deer.

I seldom see it talked about in this forum but in all seriousness, why does anyone think Tennessee can grow older aged class bucks with a rifle season (muzzleloader included) that lasts for 2 months?

If one only looks at other "big buck states" like Illinois and Ohio, they will quickly learn that their seasons are shorter and there is little or ZERO (Illinois) center fire rifle season AT ALL!

If the hunters pushing for older aged class of bucks are really serious, why not push to restrict season lengths and weapons?

Because until this is restricted, nothing else will really make as much a difference.

I have been for shorter gun seasons for years. Our incredibly long gun season for sure creates deer that are "vampires".

 

[TNDeerGuy]

Because some of you asked and it is somewhat relevant to the discussion. Anyone can do a quick search in Google and find this information out.... "[State] licensed deer hunters report"
However, one must be careful because just like with harvest reports because how they break everything down may likely be different, but it is safe to say that many of these States have far more licensed hunters than we do because many people travel to these States to hunt, unlike TN where we are not as big of a "destination State"—which is more than fine with me!

http://www.dnr.illinois.gov/hunting/dee ... 3.2014.pdf

From Ohio: The Ohio Division of Wildlife issued 535,676 deer permits in license year 2013-14, nine percent fewer
than last year and the fourth consecutive year that sales have declined (Table 1). Permit sales for
2013-14 were off by nearly 14% from the peak in 2009-10.

From Iowa: (the most recent report they had listed online)
Table 1. Results from the 2008/2009 deer season.
Reported Success Percent Percent
Licenses Harvest Rate Does Antlerless
Youth/Disabled 8,839 3,405 39% 39% 49%
Archery 84,718 21,819 26% 42% 50%
Early Muzzleloader 12,498 4,342 35% 47% 56%
November Antlerless 12,562 3,858 31% 78% 99%
Gun 1 85,629 41,501 48% 46% 56%
Gun 2 65,013 21,829 34% 53% 64%
Gun (Landowner/Tenant) 42,186 12,762 30% 55% 67%
Late Muzzleloader 36,611 10,254 28% 57% 69%
January Antlerless 29,655 10,144 34% 77% 92%
Nonresident 15,228 5,975 39% 47% 53%
Depredation 6,466 3,083 48% 82% 97%
Special hunts 6,764 3,222 48% 82% 98%
Total 406,169 142,194 35% 53% 64%

Wisconsin:
http://dnr.wi.gov/topic/WildlifeHabitat ... istory.pdf

 

[gator-n-buck]

This will be an interesting thread...

Of course if you really need meat, probably cheaper at the store in the long run. If you need antlers you now can buy mounts online. If you just want to hunt, there's all kinds of different animals you could hunt through out the year. If you hate to get up early and be cold, you could always stay home in bed.

My point is that many people hunt for different reasons and trying to make them all happy would be impossible... Carry on...