Even more ML technologic advancements

megalomaniac

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? Both not legal? Or one of them?

They both load the projectile from the muzzle. Which is what a 'muzzleloader' is. Obviously primitive ignition source isn't a necessary restriction, since modern primers and modern smokeless powder have been allowed.

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MickThompson

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megalomaniac":1by1sp7n said:
? Both not legal? Or one of them?

They both load the projectile from the muzzle. Which is what a 'muzzleloader' is. Obviously primitive ignition source isn't a necessary restriction, since modern primers and modern smokeless powder have been allowed.

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The Traditions since the charge loads from the breach
 

infoman jr.

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I've read a statement that the Nitrofire isn't legal in TN. There shouldn't be an issue with the silencer.

Well, there shouldn't be an issue with either for that matter, but they didn't ask me.
 

Doskil

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Muzzleloaders should load both the propellant and projectile from the front to be legal.

When you change that, it ceases to be a muzzleloading deer season.
 

Hunter 257W

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The majority scream in protest when somebody wants to use straight wall cartridges for ML season but they keep bending the rules to the limit with what IS allowed to the point that they are ML's in name only. They don't even need a special season with what 99% of us use in "ML season" now.
 

scn

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Under current regulations, the Nitrofire would not be legal during the muzzleloader season in TN.

The one with the silencer would be in question since the regulations addressing silenced firearms require the person to have a copy of their federal silencer stamp/permit/license on their person while hunting with the silenced gun. Since it appears such a stamp/permit isn't required with this set-up, it doesn't fall in line with the others, and is not currently addressed as a legal weapon. Before hunting with one, I'd have something in writing from the Law Enforcement Div. that it was legal for use.
 

scn

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megalomaniac":2plt0xfy said:
? Both not legal? Or one of them?

They both load the projectile from the muzzle. Which is what a 'muzzleloader' is. Obviously primitive ignition source isn't a necessary restriction, since modern primers and modern smokeless powder have been allowed.

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From the Manner and Means Proclamations:

(7) Muzzleloading firearms are defined as those firearms which are incapable of being loaded from the
breech

Since the charge is loaded from the breech, it would not be a legal muzzleloader in TN.
 

mike243

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Doskil":1fsuwgmp said:
(7) Muzzleloading firearms are defined as those firearms which are incapable of being loaded from the
breech

Please keep it that way
Yep or do away with a weapon requirement open season set a limit and hunt, use the weapon you want, not sure why Bow hunters get so much extra time in the woods, and a larger harvest. You would think that there being more gun hunters than bow it would have been addressed before now imo :poke: :pop:
 

MUP

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I think we're heading that way eventually Mike. With all the cwd areas being open to any weapon it seems only a matter of time before it's an any weapon season straight thru. I used to oppose the any weapon change but now I'm about if the mind to just say whatever and rifle hunt only with the rest.(When the regulations change that is)
 

mike243

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I really enjoy muzzle loader hunting and will continue to use them even if they change it, having a love of something wether its bow muzzyloader or rifle and being able to choose means a lot, i dont think any weapon should have a different opening date when it means certain weapons dont get equal time
 

megalomaniac

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scn":3cawn0p7 said:
megalomaniac":3cawn0p7 said:
? Both not legal? Or one of them?

They both load the projectile from the muzzle. Which is what a 'muzzleloader' is. Obviously primitive ignition source isn't a necessary restriction, since modern primers and modern smokeless powder have been allowed.

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From the Manner and Means Proclamations:

(7) Muzzleloading firearms are defined as those firearms which are incapable of being loaded from the
breech

Since the charge is loaded from the breech, it would not be a legal muzzleloader in TN.
The only ML I've ever owned that didnt have a charge placed in the breech was my old TC Hawken. My knight, rem 700, and encore MLs have all required ignition charges from the breech.

My biggest beef with the ML is having to discharge the weapon at the end of the season to adequately clean it. And i don't enjoy cleaning them. Back in the day when I shot a pile of deer during ML, my gun was discharged much more often than not at a deer. Lately I find myself having to shoot the ground at the end of the season and not at a deer as ive gotten more particular regarding what I want to shoot.

I'm also a bit spoiled in MS by getting to use any weapon during ML season. No need to clean my centerfire until after the end of the season....

I was thinking the new traditions muzzleloader could be charged, loaded, then at the end of the day or season just pull the charge and leave the bullet in place (putting a taped label over the muzzle indicating it was already loaded, ofc). No need to clean, and just replace the charge the next day or year and you are good to go.

I may need to just look into going with modern centerfire propellants to solve my aggravations.

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JeepKuntry

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Hunter 257W":3j2mqqf9 said:
The majority scream in protest when somebody wants to use straight wall cartridges for ML season but they keep bending the rules to the limit with what IS allowed to the point that they are ML's in name only. They don't even need a special season with what 99% of us use in "ML season" now.

Agree. A bit different, but most shotguns cannot match the performance of a modern ML. The biggest complaint is that the reloading process is quick and "not fair". I'm all for archery, then firearms season. I feel like most places wouldn't go that route as it would cause some businesses to go under.
 

megalomaniac

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JeepKuntry":20tsvp88 said:
.... I'm all for archery, then firearms season. I feel like most places wouldn't go that route as it would cause some businesses to go under.

It's not so much as businesses themselves, but the funding for TWRA from license sales.

If there were just archery, then firearms, a large portion of sportsmans license holders would drop their sportsmans license and just opt for fishing plus big game gun and save a ton of $$$.... which would cost TRWA a huge chunk of revenue.

ML season served an important role back in the early 80s when created. Deer populations were still low in most areas, and population expansion was a priority... buck only ML allowed for an extra week afield during prime prerut and rut for many areas of TN, and 2 weeks during December when season was closed benefitting those in west TN, while not negatively impacting herd expansion. The most newfangled ML back then was a percussion cap TC Hawken, and many were actually hunting with flintlock and wheellocks.

Over the next 2 decades as populations met or even exceeded social carrying capacity, the 2 weeks in December was changed to any weapon (which benefitted west TN and extreme southern middle TN to include their first rut), but the week in mid Nov could not be changed to any weapon for fear of revenue loss due to a decline of ML season license sales.

TWRA needs and DESERVES the funding, but the entire biological reason (increased hunter opportunity without negatively impacting the resource) for a ML season has been replaced by a Frankenstein of technology advancements producing weapons that are equivalent and exceed many centerfire rifles, and are only 'muzzleloaders' in semantics, only to provide funding through additional license sales (not just in TN... many other states are in the same boat). And when you look at the kill numbers, most years MORE deer are killed day for day during ML season than during rifle season.

Those states still needing to adhere to the original concept of ML season (handicap the hunter in an attempt to generate revenue in hopes they are unsuccessful and not impact the resource) are mostly out west... where draw tags are limited, and weapons are limited to original primitive firearms, loose black powder, only iron sights, and only patch round balls or Buffalo bullets.

In TN, we have reached the point where an exclusive ML season needs to go. West TN now gets to hunt their rut with any weapon. Only middle TN is restricted, and only so for additional revenue for TWRA.

I'd rather write a check to TWRA for the thousands I've spent over the years on modernizing muzzleloaders to become more effective than keep chasing the evolution in technology. I would certainly pay extra for a ML 'season' to be able to hunt with my preference during my rut. And I still feel terrible that my children have missed out on 1st rut on my farms because they couldn't handle the recoil of a ML when they were younger. (Thankfully, my son can now shoot one without problem, but my daughters still are intimidated).

I'd like to see TN follow in MS footsteps... allow any weapon during ML season, but still have to purchase a primitive weapons tag.





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mike243

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Make a hunting License and and a fishing license , charge enuff to keep TWRA afloat and like always pay to play, if not keep the definition of Muzzle loaders the same , shotguns and straight walled cartridges have no place in muzzle loader season, Ms can call a cat a dog all they want but we know the difference here lol
 

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