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#10 TSS --- Anyone experimented with it?

TheLBLman

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I'm pondering setting up kinda a "guest" and/or youth gun for turkey hunting.
It's going to be a 20 ga with a Fastfire sight and
probably going with either an improved cylinder, modified, or improved modified choke.

Here's my thinking:

Don't need anything tighter than these chokes for head-shooting turkeys under 30 yds.
Going to smaller #10 TSS (with a more open choke) will provide a somewhat comparable pattern density to #6 lead thru a full choke.

The big advantage is much less chance for a miss, on an otherwise easy shot,
which seems to be the most over-looked aspect of novice turkey hunting.

In other words, when a novice hunter is afield with a rifle-like "turkey" choke, he/she may have more chance of missing an easy close-range shot, than failing to connect on a long-range shot.

And, I'm wanting to help novices appreciate "up close & personal", actually calling up a strutting Tom, rather than just shooting one seen in the distance.

There is a difference between shooting and hunting, albeit shooting is a part of most hunting.
This idea is about placing more emphasis on the hunting than the shooting.

Thoughts?
 

scn

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Not needed. There is enough #9 TSSshot in the current loads to provide an even pattern even if you open up the choke a little.
 

Southern Sportsman

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scn is absolutely right that there are enough 9s to give adequate pattern density, even with an open choke. So10s aren’t “needed.” But 10s will absolutely pulverize a turkey skull at 30 yards. And there is no denying that using 10 will give you more pellets in the payload and thus more pattern density.

I would bet good money that most 20 gauges shooting a 1 1/2 oz load of 10s would give you a lethal pattern out to 30 yards even if you used a cylinder choke. The only downside I can think of would be increasing the number of pellets you’ll find in the breast meat.
 

Andy S.

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#9s or #10s TSS will kill them dead as a hammer, just open the choke up to modified for 30 yards. Tell me more about your shells. Do you plan to source them commercially or load them yourself? To my knowledge, 20G #10 TSS is not commercially available outside of the Federal blend of #8s and #10s
 

Andy S.

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True #10 TSS (18 g/cc) run about 500 pellets per ounce, and true #12 TSS (18g/cc) run about 1430 pellets per ounce.
 

megalomaniac

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I've thought about going to 9.5s or 10s in 20g with 1oz or 1 1/8oz loads for my daughter to really reduce recoil.

In that case, same lethal pattern, but smaller payload. Also a bit cheaper.
 

TheLBLman

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scn is absolutely right that there are enough 9s to give adequate pattern density, even with an open choke. So10s aren’t “needed.” But 10s will absolutely pulverize a turkey skull at 30 yards. And there is no denying that using 10 will give you more pellets in the payload and thus more pattern density.

I would bet good money that most 20 gauges shooting a 1 1/2 oz load of 10s would give you a lethal pattern out to 30 yards even if you used a cylinder choke. The only downside I can think of would be increasing the number of pellets you’ll find in the breast meat.
Thanks for all the comments, and please keep them coming :)

No doubt, the 9's will get the job done out to 30 yds with a pretty open choke.

What I failed to mention earlier is am also wanting to make this a reduced load, probably 1 1/8 oz.

I still have a few 20ga 1 1/8 oz "reduced" loads of the old Federal HW's in #7 (which are "heavier than lead" but not the heavier TSS). I personally killed my 1st longbeard of last year (with these) at under 20 yards, getting to watch him strut, gobble, spit & drum under 40 yards for several minutes before pulling the trigger.
To me, this is just so much more what turkey hunting is all about.

I'm not aware of any #10 TSS being commercially available, so this would be a handload.

I guess one concern becomes would the #10 TSS completely penetrate a turkey's skull at a little greater range, let's just say 40 to 45 yds. I suspect, even with a modified or improved modified choke, the pattern density might be adequate for this to still be a 40-plus-yard turkey killer.
 

TN Larry

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As said above, #10 will absolutely kill them. However, if I already had #9, I would shoot those with either a modified or full choke and should be just fine for anyone.
 

TN Larry

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Thanks for all the comments, and please keep them coming :)

No doubt, the 9's will get the job done out to 30 yds with a pretty open choke.

What I failed to mention earlier is am also wanting to make this a reduced load, probably 1 1/8 oz.

I still have a few 20ga 1 1/8 oz "reduced" loads of the old Federal HW's in #7 (which are "heavier than lead" but not the heavier TSS). I personally killed my 1st longbeard of last year (with these) at under 20 yards, getting to watch him strut, gobble, spit & drum under 40 yards for several minutes before pulling the trigger.
To me, this is just so much more what turkey hunting is all about.

I'm not aware of any #10 TSS being commercially available, so this would be a handload.

I guess one concern becomes would the #10 TSS completely penetrate a turkey's skull at a little greater range, let's just say 40 to 45 yds. I suspect, even with a modified or improved modified choke, the pattern density might be adequate for this to still be a 40-plus-yard turkey killer.
#9 will kill one farther than we should be shooting at one so #10 should be just fine to 40 yards. I think most 410 patterns are with #10.

What you are trying to achieve with a reduced recoil and a more open choke to 40 yards might be better suited to #10s. I would still try the #9s first just to see.

2 years ago, I shot a reduced recoil load due to a blown out disc in my neck. I either loaded 1 3/16 or 1 1/2 ozs (can't remember) where I normally load 1 5/8. It didn't change my pattern much at all. I killed two birds with them farther than I should be shooting at a turkey (open and misjudged the yardage.)
 

TheLBLman

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Tell me more about your shells. . . . . . To my knowledge, 20G #10 TSS is not commercially available outside of the Federal blend of #8s and #10s
Andy, this is all still in the "planning" stage.
I would be handloading what I'm pondering, but would be open to something "commercial" if becomes available.

As to those 20ga Federal TSS blends of #8's and #10's, intriguing, but with their payload of 1 5/8 oz, not what I'm wanting for the "novice" gun setup's goal of light recoil.

I'm thinking somewhere around 1 1/8 oz of straight #10's @ 1,000 fps could work out pretty well. Am open to considering the #12's (or #10.5, or #11 if available), but seems "iffy" regarding penetration.
 

Southern Sportsman

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I guess one concern becomes would the #10 TSS completely penetrate a turkey's skull at a little greater range, let's just say 40 to 45 yds. I suspect, even with a modified or improved modified choke, the pattern density might be adequate for this to still be a 40-plus-yard turkey killer.
There is a software program (KP Ballistics) that calculates this type of thing. I don’t have it, but I’ve seen people who do post about it regarding 10 shot.

It is generally accepted, by people smarter than me, that 1.25” of penetration into ballistics gel is adequate penetration to punch through a turkey skull. According to the KPB program, 18g/cc 10 shot will provide 1.25” penetration out to 54 yards at 1100 fps muzzle velocity and 50 yards at 1000 fps. So even with a reduced recoil load, you’ll be good at 45 yards.
 

TheLBLman

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Went back and looked at my notes LBL; that bird with the 10 pellet resting on the breastbone was at 43 lasered yards.
TSS is some pretty amazing stuff!
A few years ago I had a lady shoot a turkey at a lasered 46 yds with the old Federal #7 HW loads (which aren't close to the potency of TSS). Several those #7 pellets completely passed thru the breast bone & both sides of the breast.

I'm mainly interested in knowing how far #10 TSS would pass completely thru a turkey's head. Ditto for #12 TSS and anything in between.

I will personally always let a bird walk before taking a body shot, as what's killed is being eaten, and there is a great pride in having zero pellets in the breast. Yes, I know with the more open chokes, there is greater likelihood of pellets getting in the breast.
 

TheLBLman

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It is generally accepted, by people smarter than me, that 1.25” of penetration into ballistics gel is adequate penetration to punch through a turkey skull. According to the KPB program, 18g/cc 10 shot will provide 1.25” penetration out to 54 yards at 1100 fps muzzle velocity and 50 yards at 1000 fps. So even with a reduced recoil load, you’ll be good at 45 yards.
THAT's what I'm looking for! Thank You!

So, assume the #10 TSS pellets are adequate to 50 yds.
Next, just see out to what range a more open choke would consistently put 2 or 3 in a turkey's head. Maximum range then might be something like 35 to 45 yds, depending on the choke & payload. But hey, conceivably could be 50 yds with an Improved Modified choke?

Amazing. Just need to do some pattern testing with #10's.
 

TheLBLman

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And may have to re-think this!
Sounding like a new 28 ga. autoloader would be even better!

P.S. I don't like pump actions for turkey hunting.

Anyone have a particular brand/make 28 ga autoloader they personally recommend?
 

Southern Sportsman

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And may have to re-think this!
Sounding like a new 28 ga. autoloader would be even better!

P.S. I don't like pump actions for turkey hunting.

Anyone have a particular brand/make 28 ga autoloader they personally recommend?
No, but I have drooled over a couple CZ Readhead 28g over unders rigged for turkeys. Not a great beginner/youth option, but I really want one.
 

Andy S.

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Not all that familiar with 28G autoloaders, but do know Mossburg, Tristar, Berretta, and Benelli makes one. Most I have seen are the fancier wood/blueing and longer barrels (26-28"), so not what I would prefer to turkey hunt with. The only only I saw that was matte black and 24" barrel was the Mossburg. See link below to see the 28G autoloaders Bud's Gun Shop typically stocks. Many are out of stock now like a lot of other guns/ammo.

 
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