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#535072 - 12/20/07 12:37 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: megalomaniac]
Highland
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Registered: 12/18/07
Posts: 13
Loc: Hamilton County

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Excellent responses from everybody. This census proves there is no simple ansewer to the question. Everything that has been debated on this forum, we as a club have discussed time and time again. Removing people from the lease is most likely not an option.

The best solution we have come up with, is to implement the BSK system of trail camereas this year. We are going to monitor our deer herd through camereas and see if we can identify some of these top notch 2 1/2 year old bucks that we as a club want to see make it to at least the next age class. If the club can view these bucks before the arrows are knocked and the bullets loaded, it may improve judgement. Not to mention the fact that if we get some photo's of 140's plus, it may deter some from wanting a 115 inch deer.

Thanks for the responses.

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#535104 - 12/20/07 01:06 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Highland]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65683
Loc: Nashville, TN

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NOTHING helps hunters pass up "decent" bucks like having proof much better bucks exist (trail-cam pictures of top-end bucks). I've seen it happen time and again.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#535192 - 12/20/07 02:34 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Highland]
chicken litter
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Registered: 12/20/07
Posts: 6
Loc: Chattanooga, TN.

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I agree with Winchester, its probably the same problem members year after year, and yes it may be time to set an example and eliminate the problem. I have been a member of several hunting clubs in pass and I look at it like this, if this club has a 3 1/2 yr. old, 125 class rule and the other members are trying very hard to comply and are passing on these smaller bucks just to have those problem members cuttem down. This will only lead to problems with moral among the compling members. These problem hunters need to get serious and educate themselves or go! Trophy Hunting is not about kill numbers its about harvesting quality mature animals and it sounds like this club just has basic rules.
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#535221 - 12/20/07 02:56 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Highland]
chicken litter
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Registered: 12/20/07
Posts: 6
Loc: Chattanooga, TN.

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Yes Highland, this trail cam idea sounds like a good plan, we do this some on our lease and it helps educate us on our properties herd. We actually give the deer in our trail cam pictures names so everyone can identify shooters and non shooters. Again good idea.
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#535242 - 12/20/07 03:21 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Highland]
hawghead
4 Point


Registered: 11/20/06
Posts: 137
Loc: COLLEGE GROVE,TN

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WE HAVE RULES THAT ARE PRETTY BASIC.THE BUCK HAS TO BE AT LEAST EIGHT POINTS OR BETTER,AND THE SPREAD HAS TO BE WELL OUTSIDE HIS EARS.WE DON'T TRY TO AGE DEER IN THE WOODS,RATHER WE HAVE THOSE GUIDLINES TO GO BY.WE HAVE ONLY HAD TO PENALIZE ONE MEMBER(WHICH WAS ME)FOR SHOOTING A BUCK WITHOUT TAKING A GOOD LOOK AT HIM FIRST.YES WE HAVE HAD TO PASS ON SOME NICE DEER,BUT WE HAVE INSURED A GOOD POPULATION OF MATURE ANIMALS.
OH YES,I SHOT AN EIGHT POINT THAT LOOKED GOOD ENOUGH FROM THE SIDE,BUT WAS NOT WIDE ENOUGH TO PASS FOR A SHOOTER.I MADE THE WRONG DECISION.I LOST MY HUNTING PRIVILEGES FOR THREE WEEKS.
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#535271 - 12/20/07 03:49 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: chicken litter]
Highland
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Registered: 12/18/07
Posts: 13
Loc: Hamilton County

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WOW! Chicken Litter - remind me not to get on your bad side. I hope you don't make a mistake in the hunting woods with that kind of policy. Our club is made up of friends, and yours sounds like it is a military training facility.

That is a little too much for me, it is still deer hunting, which is suppose to be about fun and good friends. We are wanting to curtail the harvesting of 2 1/2 year old bucks, not put the shooter on trial.

But thanks for sharing your opinion.

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#545442 - 12/31/07 06:56 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Highland]
Mountain Buck
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Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 23
Loc: TN, Marion County

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Highland,
What are your club rules on legal deer?

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#545655 - 12/31/07 09:25 PM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Mountain Buck]
Brad Martin
6 Point


Registered: 08/28/03
Posts: 913
Loc: Knoxville

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I think the key is getting those club members to believe that there are 140+ deer walking around, (trail-cams) AND having members that want to kill only deer of that size. I can't really blame those guys in the club for shooting a 110-115 8pt, if this is their biggest deer they have ever seen, or even their second or third. Now, if they have eight of them on the wall that are bigger, then it might be a problem.

I think that one of the problems that clubs run into is trying to convince members not to shoot the biggest deer they have ever seen. I have passed several deer on our club, knowing that if half of the club members saw it, they would shoot it. If I shoot it, he is definitely not going to be any bigger next year. Keeping the same club members each year and as they kill more and more bucks, or see more hunting and through trailcams, everyone will increase their standards.
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#551626 - 01/06/08 10:13 AM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Brad Martin]
Mike Belt
TnDeer Old Timer
16 Point


Registered: 03/26/99
Posts: 18080
Loc: Lakeland, Tn.

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Basically, the first step in a QDM program buckwise is to protect all yearlings. Generally the next step is to protect most 2.5 year olds. The distinction between 2.5 year olds and 3.5 year olds is hard to make under hunting conditions especially on your top end 2.5 year olds. I don't really see how you can totally eliminate the top 2.5 year olds from harvest. I might add in a minimum antler score and brackett the penalties per score range up to and including forfeiture of filling remaining buck tags if the buck is too small. Even this won't eliminate all 2.5 year olds taken but it should help slow it down to acceptable levels.

I say this and I belong to a club that has a size restriction of 120" minimum. We've had a 40+% increase in our 120"+ class bucks taken this year over last but at the same time a 100% increase in those bucks taken under that minimum. The really sad part is that half of the unders ranged from 96"-108". Even with our restrictions and penalties hunters shot these bucks. I can see a mistake on certain bucks closer to the minimum but bucks the size of 96" aren't even close. When rules are in place and hunters still take bucks of this caliber irregardless of the penalties it may simply be time for those hunters to look for another place to hunt.
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#551649 - 01/06/08 10:35 AM Re: QDM Club Penalties [Re: Mike Belt]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65683
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Great post Mike, and that's why it's so important to join/form a club with hunters of like mind. I realize that is extremely difficult, but if you can pull it off you've got something special.

Some hunters have no problem holding out for what they really want--a large-antlered buck--even if that means going "buckless" for several years in a row. Other hunters will take the first "decent" buck they see simply to keep from going buckless for the year. If you want a successful "big buck" club, you have to find those hunters that can hold off on the lesser bucks.

I'll be the first to admit I hate going buckless. I do want to kill a large-antlered buck, but I have real problems passing up that first 90-110 class 2 1/2 year-old buck I see. It is a constant mental battle...
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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