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#491345 - 11/13/07 07:14 AM Is this the Down side to QDM?
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10525
Loc: Warren Co

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I have noticed a certain theme to the usual grumbling about someone shooting a certain buck. Not just on here but out in the real world talking to other hunters.

Its hard to explain but here goes.

I have noticed that a lot of hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they passed. Not only that but hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they deem inferior or too young/small/not a trophy buck. There are a lot of posts about someone being jealous because a neighbor is hunting too close to the property line and shooting "my" deer, or one coming off "My managed property".

Could this be an unintended side effect of QDM? It seems that a lot of hunters develop feelings of ownership toward deer once they start down the QDM path.

Anyone else notice this attitude shift? THoughts?


Edited by fishboy1 (11/13/07 07:14 AM)
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#491356 - 11/13/07 07:21 AM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: fishboy1]
richmanbarbeque
16 Point


Registered: 07/17/03
Posts: 12774
Loc: Middle, Tn

Offline
I think a lot of what you mentioned has been around for years. Property disputes and deer "ownership" has been around before the qdm rage. I think for the most part hunting can bring out the selfishness in all of us. I try as hard as possible to keep selfishness away from my hunting experience and so far so good.
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#491519 - 11/13/07 09:38 AM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: richmanbarbeque]
kholmes
4 Point


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 280
Loc: Nashville

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I agree with richmanbbq. QDM more than likely amplifies it.
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#491521 - 11/13/07 09:38 AM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: richmanbarbeque]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65056
Loc: Nashville, TN

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In my opinion, serious QDMers eventually learn not to care about what the neighbors or others are doing, especially once they are successful with their program. It is those who don't really know what QDM is about (those who only think it is about the buck's antlers) and those who are in the begining and struggling stages of QDM that get really concerned about what others are doing.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#491727 - 11/13/07 12:22 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: ]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65056
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
stovepipe,

I learned long ago that those hunters that will shoot any buck end up only killing young bucks. It simply amazes me how few of the older bucks that use my property ever get shot by any of my neighbors. I've even had a neighbor tell me he's not going to hunt his own property anymore because there aren't any good bucks around. I guess I should tell that to the mature bucks I have pictures of walking back and forth between our two properties.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#492047 - 11/13/07 04:13 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: fishboy1]
deerchaser007
10 Point


Registered: 12/17/02
Posts: 4257
Loc: Bradyville, TN USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I have noticed a certain theme to the usual grumbling about someone shooting a certain buck. Not just on here but out in the real world talking to other hunters.

Its hard to explain but here goes.

I have noticed that a lot of hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they passed. Not only that but hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they deem inferior or too young/small/not a trophy buck. There are a lot of posts about someone being jealous because a neighbor is hunting too close to the property line and shooting "my" deer, or one coming off "My managed property".

Could this be an unintended side effect of QDM? It seems that a lot of hunters develop feelings of ownership toward deer once they start down the QDM path.

Anyone else notice this attitude shift? THoughts?


Yes there are folks who run down others for shooting small deer. I can't relate to it myself ,. for i'm not gonna tell'em what to shoot. BUT,.. BUTTTT,. if they say 1 word about they ain't no big deer to shoot , or TN can't produce trophy's,.. or i didn't pass him cause someone else would shoot,.. i speak my mind like a flea on a dog. I'm gonna let someone have it. I don't care if they like it or not.
Hunting close to a property line is uncalled for. Especially if the hunter knows there are other hunters on the adjoining land. BUT,.. if it is unhunted land next door there ain't a problem. Most hunters will shoot deer across the property lines,.. and that ain't right. It should be in the hunter ethics book not to hunt within 50 yards of a property line were other hunters are present. My opinion..

I don't think hunters feel a ownership toward the deer,. i think its all jealousy. Heck,. i'll be honest. I get a litle jealous sometimes when i see BSK, wes,and all these other qdm guys post pics of these bruisers. BUT,.. at the same time it gives me hope that someday myself and my neighbors can acheive the same goal. Sometimes alittle jealousy is good for a person,.. especially if it inspires them to work harder and become smarter at what they are trying to achieve. BUT,. there are always them ones that let the jealousy take over. AND,.. they are only hurting themselves in my opinion.
Hope that answered your question. If not,... try to focus on the goods of qdm and not the bads. An apple tree is always gonna produce apples,....... some good-some bad. Just throw the bad ones to the side and focus on the good ones. I think you know what i mean...
_________________________
QDMA member...Cannon co.
Guard your tongue in youth,.. and in age you may mature a thought that will be of service to your people!!
(Minquass)

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#492059 - 11/13/07 04:29 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: deerchaser007]
TAS
6 Point


Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 563
Loc: Hickman County

Offline
 Originally Posted By: deerchaser007
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I have noticed a certain theme to the usual grumbling about someone shooting a certain buck. Not just on here but out in the real world talking to other hunters.

Its hard to explain but here goes.

I have noticed that a lot of hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they passed. Not only that but hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they deem inferior or too young/small/not a trophy buck. There are a lot of posts about someone being jealous because a neighbor is hunting too close to the property line and shooting "my" deer, or one coming off "My managed property".

Could this be an unintended side effect of QDM? It seems that a lot of hunters develop feelings of ownership toward deer once they start down the QDM path.

Anyone else notice this attitude shift? THoughts?


Yes there are folks who run down others for shooting small deer. I can't relate to it myself ,. for i'm not gonna tell'em what to shoot. BUT,.. BUTTTT,. if they say 1 word about they ain't no big deer to shoot , or TN can't produce trophy's,.. or i didn't pass him cause someone else would shoot,.. i speak my mind like a flea on a dog. I'm gonna let someone have it. I don't care if they like it or not.
Hunting close to a property line is uncalled for. Especially if the hunter knows there are other hunters on the adjoining land. BUT,.. if it is unhunted land next door there ain't a problem. Most hunters will shoot deer across the property lines,.. and that ain't right. It should be in the hunter ethics book not to hunt within 50 yards of a property line were other hunters are present. My opinion..

I don't think hunters feel a ownership toward the deer,. i think its all jealousy. Heck,. i'll be honest. I get a litle jealous sometimes when i see BSK, wes,and all these other qdm guys post pics of these bruisers. BUT,.. at the same time it gives me hope that someday myself and my neighbors can acheive the same goal. Sometimes alittle jealousy is good for a person,.. especially if it inspires them to work harder and become smarter at what they are trying to achieve. BUT,. there are always them ones that let the jealousy take over. AND,.. they are only hurting themselves in my opinion.
Hope that answered your question. If not,... try to focus on the goods of qdm and not the bads. An apple tree is always gonna produce apples,....... some good-some bad. Just throw the bad ones to the side and focus on the good ones. I think you know what i mean...


Jeremy,

Dang, that was well said. How long you been pondering this one?
I couldn't said that better if I would have worked on it for a couple days! \:D Agree 100%.
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#492061 - 11/13/07 04:33 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: BSK]
156p&y
10 Point


Registered: 10/23/01
Posts: 4207
Loc: Franklin Tn

Offline
BSK... I think a lot of that is a result from what qdm teaches hunters. I know in my case the best teacher I've ever had in the woods is the whitetail itself and before I became thoroughly involved in QDM I was missing out on a lot of lessons. We see the same thing though, the guys who practice the QDM effectively around us are the ones harvesting the older deer.

 Originally Posted By: BSK
In my opinion, serious QDMers eventually learn not to care about what the neighbors or others are doing, especially once they are successful with their program.


Couldn't agree more. Worrying about others just takes away from what you are trying to do, and it takes enjoyment out of it. Surrounding areas will always reap the benefit from QDM properties, I see it every year. One thing you can't do is get in a wad about it. I personally am very enthusiastic when surrounding neighbors actually see results from what others are doing, it's just one step closer to getting them on the bandwagon with you.

007...great post. I agree with most all that


Edited by 156p&y (11/13/07 04:33 PM)
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#492087 - 11/13/07 04:54 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: TAS]
deerchaser007
10 Point


Registered: 12/17/02
Posts: 4257
Loc: Bradyville, TN USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: TAS
 Originally Posted By: deerchaser007
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I have noticed a certain theme to the usual grumbling about someone shooting a certain buck. Not just on here but out in the real world talking to other hunters.

Its hard to explain but here goes.

I have noticed that a lot of hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they passed. Not only that but hunters get mad when someone kills a deer they deem inferior or too young/small/not a trophy buck. There are a lot of posts about someone being jealous because a neighbor is hunting too close to the property line and shooting "my" deer, or one coming off "My managed property".

Could this be an unintended side effect of QDM? It seems that a lot of hunters develop feelings of ownership toward deer once they start down the QDM path.

Anyone else notice this attitude shift? THoughts?


Yes there are folks who run down others for shooting small deer. I can't relate to it myself ,. for i'm not gonna tell'em what to shoot. BUT,.. BUTTTT,. if they say 1 word about they ain't no big deer to shoot , or TN can't produce trophy's,.. or i didn't pass him cause someone else would shoot,.. i speak my mind like a flea on a dog. I'm gonna let someone have it. I don't care if they like it or not.
Hunting close to a property line is uncalled for. Especially if the hunter knows there are other hunters on the adjoining land. BUT,.. if it is unhunted land next door there ain't a problem. Most hunters will shoot deer across the property lines,.. and that ain't right. It should be in the hunter ethics book not to hunt within 50 yards of a property line were other hunters are present. My opinion..

I don't think hunters feel a ownership toward the deer,. i think its all jealousy. Heck,. i'll be honest. I get a litle jealous sometimes when i see BSK, wes,and all these other qdm guys post pics of these bruisers. BUT,.. at the same time it gives me hope that someday myself and my neighbors can acheive the same goal. Sometimes alittle jealousy is good for a person,.. especially if it inspires them to work harder and become smarter at what they are trying to achieve. BUT,. there are always them ones that let the jealousy take over. AND,.. they are only hurting themselves in my opinion.
Hope that answered your question. If not,... try to focus on the goods of qdm and not the bads. An apple tree is always gonna produce apples,....... some good-some bad. Just throw the bad ones to the side and focus on the good ones. I think you know what i mean...


Jeremy,

Dang, that was well said. How long you been pondering this one?
I couldn't said that better if I would have worked on it for a couple days! \:D Agree 100%.


I didn't ponder on it,.. it just comes out of me. I'm typically a quiet person. BUT,. if i see a chance to open up on how i feel,.. i kick the door wide open and dive all in.
_________________________
QDMA member...Cannon co.
Guard your tongue in youth,.. and in age you may mature a thought that will be of service to your people!!
(Minquass)

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#492161 - 11/13/07 05:52 PM Re: Is this the Down side to QDM? [Re: deerchaser007]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10525
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
Excellent points.

What I wonder is IF the average Joe, hunting show watching, 4 point shooting, public land hunter will ever make it to the level of understanding that you guys have.

The Hardcore qdm guys USUALLY have a piece of private property to control and manage. There is a certain amount of feedback that you get by managing your own land. You can see the results and get to reap the benefits. Most importantly, you excercise CONTROL over your hunting experience.

The average Joe does not get to see those benefits. He hunts a couple weekends a year and just wants to kill a deer to take home. That is his reality. Maybe he will get lucky and a mature buck will make a mistake and blunder in. Chances are, he will shoot the first legal deer because that is likely to be his only chance to kill a deer with his limited hunting time.

Nothing wrong with that but how likely is it that this guy is going to "buy in" to the whole QDM thing if his reality is 3-4 hunting opportunites a year on Public land? At some point, Joe average is going to say "QDM doesn't work!" OR worse yet, the jealousy factor will kick in and you will hear "I passed on that 4 pointer and some idgit on the next ridge shot him"

Have any of you QDMA guys discussed this possible PR problem for QDM and the "average hunter"?
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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