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#443098 - 10/11/07 08:22 PM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: FULLDRAWXX75]
BSK
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If it doesn't go all the way through, I'm not shooting it. I've seen bucks shot with a round-ball in the chest that were lost in late evening shooting situations.

No full penetration; no blood trail; potentially lost deer.
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#443163 - 10/11/07 08:44 PM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: BSK]
FULLDRAWXX75
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Registered: 01/29/07
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I can respect that BSK, I to have seen deer shot with many different weapon, not recovered. More with a bow than any other.

Like Hawkeye5 stated, shot placement is very important no matter what you are using.

FDXX75
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“Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.”
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#443675 - 10/12/07 07:41 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: FULLDRAWXX75]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: FULLDRAWXX75
I can respect that BSK, I to have seen deer shot with many different weapon, not recovered. More with a bow than any other.


I couldn't agree more FDXX75, that's why I quit bow-hunting. I just have a hard time dealing with a lost deer.

That said, any weapon and any shot placement can result in a lost deer. Bullets and arrows do funny things when they hit flesh and bone. Sometimes a weapon and projectile combination that has always proved deadly produces some bizarre result and a deer is lost.


 Quote:
Like Hawkeye5 stated, shot placement is very important no matter what you are using.


I couldn't agree more. However, when I see a projectile that results in lost and nearly lost deer, repeatedly, I shy away from it. That's why I stopped using the 295 grn and lighter Powerbelt bullets. Five deer hit with them--some at point-blank range broadside--and five deer nearly lost because of no blood-trail. I've moved up to the 405 grn Powerbelts, and now I get full penetration every time and good blood-trails.

I'll be the first to admit I'm biased about MZ bullet sellection because I began using MZs when the only options available were round-balls or big lead conicals. I found I could rely on the conicals for full pass-throughs but not the round-balls. Now in today's world of inlines (which I use) and sabotted pistol bullets, I still find myself relying on the old idea of throwing the biggest, heaviest chunk of hardened lead I can find. I want bone-crushing penetration. I realize some of the new inlines can throw smaller pistol bullets almost fast enough to cause "knock-down" shocking power, similar to a modern rifle. But I still see an MZ as a weapon that kills by knocking the biggest hole possible all the way through a deer. So I use bullets I know will do that from any angle (including end-to-end) and come out the other side.

I want blood-loss, and I want it outside the body on both sides! ;\)


_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#443794 - 10/12/07 08:38 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: FULLDRAWXX75]
FULLDRAWXX75
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Hickory,

We did kinda stray away from your original guestion, r/b or conical?

I have taken deer with r/b, (.54 cal) if you choose to go with a modern sabot you will sacrific size and energy of the bullet. Starting with a .45 cal to begin with.

As BSK has stated, a full lead conical may be your better choice for that rifle.

FDXX75
_________________________
“Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.”
― Albert Einstein


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#443883 - 10/12/07 09:12 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: BSK]
renegade50
16 Point


Registered: 02/02/07
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bsk your right on your bias with your bullet selction for your self. but shot placement is what counts the most and waiting for proper placement of what your gonna shoot this is what causes the majority of lost deer: bad markmanship, lack of knowledge of anatomy, and lack of trigger patience. i shoot a tc renegade and have not lost any of the 12 bucks that i have shot with it at all since 1992 shooting a 240 grain xtp 44 cal bullet in a tc break away sabot in front of 100grains of ffg pyrodex rs select none of them have gone more than 45 yards and on most of them the round either punches thru the chest or lodges under the oppisite hide using all its knock down power dropping them in their tracks . alot of peole dont use enough powder shooting round balls and they need to be educated on that a good rule of thumb is to double the caliber for a round ball charge and then cut it by 10 to 15 grains for your starting load to find out the most accurate powerful killing charge with it and then put in the patch experiments for tight seal to prevent loss of veloicity from patch burn thru some people dont take the time to get their weapon up to speed and do the homework that is also a big cause no matter what black powder projectile you are using just my 2 cents on this not trying to slam either side

Edited by renegade50 (10/12/07 09:13 AM)
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#443988 - 10/12/07 10:32 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: FULLDRAWXX75]
CHRIS WILSON
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Registered: 05/31/05
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With a .45 caliber, I'd shoot a decent weight conical. Round balls for a .45 are small, light weight rascals. Save the .45 round balls for small game or coyotes.
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#445430 - 10/13/07 07:06 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: CHRIS WILSON]
BSK
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Interesting stuff Renegade50. I too think shot placement is absolutely critical, but I've seen round-balls hang on the skin on the opposite side of a broadside chest hit, and little blood came from the entrance wound, producing an extremely hard-to-find deer in the dark.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#445535 - 10/13/07 09:21 AM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: BSK]
GRAMPS
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Registered: 09/12/03
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I have killed deer with both the round ball and concial. Like BSK, I prefer a heavy conical. I like to blast a hole all the way thru.
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#445732 - 10/13/07 01:46 PM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: BSK]
renegade50
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
Interesting stuff Renegade50. I too think shot placement is absolutely critical, but I've seen round-balls hang on the skin on the opposite side of a broadside chest hit, and little blood came from the entrance wound, producing an extremely hard-to-find deer in the dark.
hard to find or not find, it just sounds like you have had some bad experiences with using a round ball and changed to a better round for more effective killing and tracking that is the goal that we all want overall,i dont use round balls in my rifle but use them in 50 cal plains pistol to dispatch with thats it. we all want the best possble setup for hunting which i am sure is the same sitaution with everyone so some guys use a round ball maybe that is what they find kills the best for their setup is i geuss what i am trying to say???
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work harder and pay your taxes!!!! millions of democrat voters on welfare as a way of life depend on you!!!!

a tax paying worker voting for a democrat
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#445735 - 10/13/07 01:50 PM Re: Round Ball or Conical? [Re: renegade50]
renegade50
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Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 14240
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then again we got to throw the equation of rate of twist into it also for different projectile useage, it is a trial with weapon charges and projectiles and hopefully not error thing out in the woods because of lack of homework so to speak not being done. which alot of inexperienced hunters with muzzleloaders have been known to do when they 1st start out.
_________________________
work harder and pay your taxes!!!! millions of democrat voters on welfare as a way of life depend on you!!!!

a tax paying worker voting for a democrat
is like a chicken voting for colonel sanders

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