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#3672667 - 05/18/14 06:08 AM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: megalomaniac]
PalsPal
8 Point


Registered: 10/01/12
Posts: 1273
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: megalomaniac

I think they have already imprinted on my little kids \:\) Or maybe my kids have imprinted on them!




I assume that you and the kids have seen the PBS special, My Life as a Turkey? If not, they would love it!

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/...mprinting/7367/

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#3672787 - 05/18/14 09:36 AM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: Gravey]
megalomaniac
12 Point


Registered: 10/28/05
Posts: 5054
Loc: Mississippi

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Gravey
What does it mean when you say pipped them? How do you get wild eggs for hatching? Assuming maybe its work related.


Around day 26-27 (usually anywhere from 4h-24h prior to actually hatching), the poult will pierce the inner membrane surrounding the chick to gain access to the air cell within the egg, and take it's first breath. Shortly after that, the poult will puncture the hard shell with its egg tooth on the end of the beak so that fresh air can enter the egg at a higher rate than simple transpiration that occurred during the incubation process. This then causes the small arteries and veins along the inner membrane to constrict (like cutting the cord after a baby is born). The chick then rests for a bit and then begins to 'zip' the egg circumferentially around shell to actually hatch.

Sometimes, the poult is misoriented in the egg, however, and either cannot reach the inner membrane or outer shell... For this reason, I usually manually puncture remaining eggs that have not pipped themselves 24h after the first pip. This must be done VERY carefully over the air cell (should be on the big end of the egg) and make a small (1/4") hole so I can see into the egg. If one pierces the shell anywhere other than over the air cell, the chick will most likely bleed to death if it is still alive. The poult I saved was still alive within the egg, but had not punctured the inner membrane. I made a tiny hole in that membrane, but the vessels had not yet constricted, so there was a small amount of bleeding along the membrane... so I gave him another 24h and raised the humidity in the hatcher from 70% to around 95% (to prevent the inner membrane from adhering to the poult, causing 'shrink wrapping' of the chick. Waiting allowed the vessels to self constrict and I then could hatch the chick manually by peeling off its shell and inner membrane myself the following day. That poult is doing just fine with the others, and would have died had I not intervened.

Obviously, it is illegal to raid wild turkey nests. The eggs I got were from a game farm that raises poults for reintroduction and put and take (canned) hunts... much like many quail and pheasant hunts are now. They obtained their birds from indian reservations east of the Mississippi (who can sell birds or eggs, since our state and federal laws do not apply to them). They've had them for several generations, and periodically add fresh stock from those indian reservations. I have all the legal paperwork showing that these eggs were in fact NOT obtained from our wild turkeys, just in case MDWFP comes knocking.

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#3672878 - 05/18/14 12:14 PM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: megalomaniac]
Gravey
16 Point


Registered: 07/20/05
Posts: 19030
Loc: Rutherford / Wilson County Lin...

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Gotcha and thanks for the explanation. That's cool. Assuming they are released how long do you have to raise them before releasing?
_________________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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#3673397 - 05/19/14 08:14 AM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: megalomaniac]
woodsman87
8 Point


Registered: 09/27/12
Posts: 1298
Loc: south TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: megalomaniac
 Originally Posted By: Gravey
What does it mean when you say pipped them? How do you get wild eggs for hatching? Assuming maybe its work related.


Around day 26-27 (usually anywhere from 4h-24h prior to actually hatching), the poult will pierce the inner membrane surrounding the chick to gain access to the air cell within the egg, and take it's first breath. Shortly after that, the poult will puncture the hard shell with its egg tooth on the end of the beak so that fresh air can enter the egg at a higher rate than simple transpiration that occurred during the incubation process. This then causes the small arteries and veins along the inner membrane to constrict (like cutting the cord after a baby is born). The chick then rests for a bit and then begins to 'zip' the egg circumferentially around shell to actually hatch.

Sometimes, the poult is misoriented in the egg, however, and either cannot reach the inner membrane or outer shell... For this reason, I usually manually puncture remaining eggs that have not pipped themselves 24h after the first pip. This must be done VERY carefully over the air cell (should be on the big end of the egg) and make a small (1/4") hole so I can see into the egg. If one pierces the shell anywhere other than over the air cell, the chick will most likely bleed to death if it is still alive. The poult I saved was still alive within the egg, but had not punctured the inner membrane. I made a tiny hole in that membrane, but the vessels had not yet constricted, so there was a small amount of bleeding along the membrane... so I gave him another 24h and raised the humidity in the hatcher from 70% to around 95% (to prevent the inner membrane from adhering to the poult, causing 'shrink wrapping' of the chick. Waiting allowed the vessels to self constrict and I then could hatch the chick manually by peeling off its shell and inner membrane myself the following day. That poult is doing just fine with the others, and would have died had I not intervened.

Obviously, it is illegal to raid wild turkey nests. The eggs I got were from a game farm that raises poults for reintroduction and put and take (canned) hunts... much like many quail and pheasant hunts are now. They obtained their birds from indian reservations east of the Mississippi (who can sell birds or eggs, since our state and federal laws do not apply to them). They've had them for several generations, and periodically add fresh stock from those indian reservations. I have all the legal paperwork showing that these eggs were in fact NOT obtained from our wild turkeys, just in case MDWFP comes knocking.



Just proves how tough it is for these things to survive. Even taken care of by humans, some of the poults still do not survive getting out of the egg.

Preserve the hens.

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#3673399 - 05/19/14 08:15 AM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: Gravey]
wlf89
8 Point


Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 2172
Loc: Lawrence County

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i have tried raising tame turkey 2-3 times never did work out, they just seemed to always die when they was about 2 or so months old act fine then just die. hope you have better luck than me.
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#3673450 - 05/19/14 09:45 AM Re: 1st poult of the year [Re: PalsPal]
megalomaniac
12 Point


Registered: 10/28/05
Posts: 5054
Loc: Mississippi

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Gravey
Gotcha and thanks for the explanation. That's cool. Assuming they are released how long do you have to raise them before releasing?


Honestly I have no idea... these will not be released (I'd rather eat any surplus males myself than feed the darn yotes). I'd guess around 5-6 months of age they might stand a chance depending on local predator populations.



 Originally Posted By: wlf89
i have tried raising tame turkey 2-3 times never did work out, they just seemed to always die when they was about 2 or so months old act fine then just die. hope you have better luck than me.


sounds very suspicious for Histomoniasis (Blackhead disease). They usually get the protozoan from chickens who carry it but chickens are fairly resistant to it. Did you have chickens on the same ground as your turkeys? I have some metronidazole on hand just in case for the future. Another possibiliy of loss around that age is due to vitamin/ mineral/ protein deficiency... poults need to be started on a highly fortified 30% game bird grower ration. Regular chick starter just doesn't have enough protein nor vitamins for healthy turkeys.

My poults are currently brooded with a few Ameracauna chicks; but I have a closed flock and have never brought in birds/ chicks... only eggs which I've incubated/ hatched myself. The chicks are good at teaching the turkey poults what to eat/ drink, and hopefully will keep them calmer when I finally have to move the poults out of the living room and into the outside coop and run I've built for them. I'll separate the turkeys from the chickens when they're about 6-8 weeks.

Although the poults are being handled 4-5x/ day by my kids at this stage, when they hit the awkward looking stage at 3-4 weeks, I'm sure my kids interest in them will wane.

 Originally Posted By: PalsPal
 Originally Posted By: megalomaniac

I think they have already imprinted on my little kids \:\) Or maybe my kids have imprinted on them!




I assume that you and the kids have seen the PBS special, My Life as a Turkey? If not, they would love it!

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/...mprinting/7367/


Thanks so much for that link! I had never seen that documentary before and we watched it last night. We all LOVED it... extremely well done. Just hilarious to watch the baby poults follow the fellow all around. Roosting time was neat as well!

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