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#3357797 - 09/13/13 08:47 AM Need a second opinion
infoman jr.
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Loc: Elizabethtown, KY

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I just wanted a gut check before I bought the seed today. We're going to plant tomorrow. Does this look right? Thanks!
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#3357807 - 09/13/13 08:57 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
Bayou Buck
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Registered: 05/11/09
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I would go a little heavier on the wheat and oats. Also, what type of clover are you using? It can make a big difference in lbs per acre. I normally go with 50lbs per acre of cereal grains and then adjust my other seed rates.
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#3357817 - 09/13/13 09:08 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: Bayou Buck]
infoman jr.
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Basically what we did is took 20% of the suggested broadcast rates since we have a mix of 5 different seeds (50*.2=10lb/acre). That is why we don't have 50lb/acre as you suggest.

We haven't decided for sure on the type of clover we'll buy. I'm open to suggestions.
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#3357845 - 09/13/13 09:28 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
Obsession
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Registered: 04/27/11
Posts: 190
Loc: Lebanon, Tn

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I noticed the round-up on your list. Have you already sprayed?
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#3357849 - 09/13/13 09:30 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: Obsession]
infoman jr.
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 Originally Posted By: Obsession
I noticed the round-up on your list. Have you already sprayed?

Yes, last Sunday.
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#3357854 - 09/13/13 09:32 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: Obsession]
Obsession
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Registered: 04/27/11
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You still may want to bump up your seeding rates. According to my Quality Food Plot book you still need about 50lbs per acre for wheat/oats even in mixes.
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#3357861 - 09/13/13 09:37 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: Obsession]
smstone22
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Way to low on the wheat and oats. Could be low on the clover, depending on your goals and what type of clover it is.
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#3357862 - 09/13/13 09:37 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: Obsession]
infoman jr.
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Well now that could get spendy!
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#3357871 - 09/13/13 09:40 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: smstone22]
infoman jr.
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 Originally Posted By: smstone22
Way to low on the wheat and oats. Could be low on the clover, depending on your goals and what type of clover it is.

That's interesting. My thought was that there was only so much soil to support the vegetation, so I'll take a percentage of the suggested broadcast rate. I'm no food plot-ologist though.

Would you recommend 50/acre also?

Thanks for the feedback, guys!
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#3357942 - 09/13/13 10:31 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
muddyboots
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Looks like to me u got about 1/2 enough seed.
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#3357947 - 09/13/13 10:33 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
smstone22
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50-75lbs or even more per acre would be my advice. What kind of clover are you planting? If your goal is a perennial clover plot then you would do things differently with that versus just an annual clover.
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#3357949 - 09/13/13 10:34 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
drrxnupe
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Registered: 02/15/09
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For cereal grains alone, the recommendation is 120#s per acre. So if you mix, the smallest I've seen is 50#s per acre. Do your research on clovers. Whites (ladino, durana) generally recommend 5#s or so per acre. Reds and crimson generally recommend 15-30#s per acre. Check out this summary sheet.

http://msucares.com/pubs/misc/m1591.pdf


Edited by drrxnupe (09/13/13 11:01 AM)

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#3357950 - 09/13/13 10:34 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: smstone22]
infoman jr.
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These are meant to be annual plots.
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#3357954 - 09/13/13 10:37 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
smstone22
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Annual.. so you must be buying crimson clover more than likely?Have you soil tested to see if that amount of fertilizer is needed? That fertilizer is where alot of money goes down the drain.
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#3357978 - 09/13/13 10:58 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: drrxnupe]
infoman jr.
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 Originally Posted By: drrxnupe
For cereal grains alone, the recommendation is 120#s per acre. So if you mix, the smallest I've seen is 50#s per acre. Do your research on clovers. Whites (ladino, durana) generally recommend 5#s or so per acre. Reds and crimson generally recommend 15-30#s per acre. Check out this summary sheet.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&...0,d.b2I&cad=rja

At the bottom, it says this:
BAll of the above planting rates assume a complete stand for each species. If you plan to mix species, reduce planting rates (such as when broadcasting a 50/50 mixture of wheat and oats, use 60 lbs of each for a total of 120 lbs)

We were splitting our seeds proportionally to the number of different types of seeds. In their example, they use 50% because of using 2 seeds; in our application we were going to use 20% based on 5 seed types. This seems intuitive to me.
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#3357979 - 09/13/13 11:00 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: smstone22]
A.Hall
Formerly "Spoon"
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On Wheat and Oats, I plant 100 lbs per acre
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#3357988 - 09/13/13 11:08 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: A.Hall]
infoman jr.
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OK, new question so we're all on the same page. If you have a 1-acre plot to plant. You're planting
wheat, oats, rape, turnips, clover

What weight of each seed will you plant on that ONE acre?
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#3357991 - 09/13/13 11:10 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
muddyboots
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 Originally Posted By: infoman jr.
 Originally Posted By: drrxnupe
For cereal grains alone, the recommendation is 120#s per acre. So if you mix, the smallest I've seen is 50#s per acre. Do your research on clovers. Whites (ladino, durana) generally recommend 5#s or so per acre. Reds and crimson generally recommend 15-30#s per acre. Check out this summary sheet.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&...0,d.b2I&cad=rja

At the bottom, it says this:
BAll of the above planting rates assume a complete stand for each species. If you plan to mix species, reduce planting rates (such as when broadcasting a 50/50 mixture of wheat and oats, use 60 lbs of each for a total of 120 lbs)

We were splitting our seeds proportionally to the number of different types of seeds. In their example, they use 50% because of using 2 seeds; in our application we were going to use 20% based on 5 seed types. This seems intuitive to me.


That would work if all your seed was the same size but they are not. A lot more clover seed in a pound than a pound of oats.
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#3357993 - 09/13/13 11:13 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: muddyboots]
infoman jr.
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 Originally Posted By: muddyboots
 Originally Posted By: infoman jr.
 Originally Posted By: drrxnupe
For cereal grains alone, the recommendation is 120#s per acre. So if you mix, the smallest I've seen is 50#s per acre. Do your research on clovers. Whites (ladino, durana) generally recommend 5#s or so per acre. Reds and crimson generally recommend 15-30#s per acre. Check out this summary sheet.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&...0,d.b2I&cad=rja

At the bottom, it says this:
BAll of the above planting rates assume a complete stand for each species. If you plan to mix species, reduce planting rates (such as when broadcasting a 50/50 mixture of wheat and oats, use 60 lbs of each for a total of 120 lbs)

We were splitting our seeds proportionally to the number of different types of seeds. In their example, they use 50% because of using 2 seeds; in our application we were going to use 20% based on 5 seed types. This seems intuitive to me.


That would work if all your seed was the same size but they are not. A lot more clover seed in a pound than a pound of oats.

That's exactly why we did 20% of the suggested broadcast rate for each seed.
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#3358076 - 09/13/13 12:15 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
muddyboots
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Heres my figures using 20 percent

Wheat recommended at 100 lb per acre x 20 percent = 20 lb per acre
Oats recommended at 100 lb per acre x 20 percent = 20 lb per acre
rape recommended at 10 lb per acre x 20 percent = 2 lb per acre
turnips recommended at 10 lb per acres x 20 percent = 2 lb per acre
white clover recommended at 10 lb per acre x 20 percent = 2 lb per acre

Using that method you would need 20 lb of oats, 20 lbs of wheat, 2 lbs of rape, 2 lbs of turnip, and 2 lbs of clover to the acre. Personally I would up the wheat and oats to about 30 lbs each.
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#3358082 - 09/13/13 12:20 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: muddyboots]
infoman jr.
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Loc: Elizabethtown, KY

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Great! I feel like we're speaking the same language now. The clover we ended up with is ladino. I'm guessing it will still come back in the spring?

Can you tell I've never done this!? \:\)
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#3358095 - 09/13/13 12:25 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
muddyboots
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Spread your wheat and oats first and then cut in or drag then spread rape, clover, and turnips on top and roll or cultipack. Do not bury the small seed.
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#3358097 - 09/13/13 12:27 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: muddyboots]
muddyboots
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Also welcome to the world of food plots. If your like the majority you will like growing things almost as well as the hunting lol.
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#3358099 - 09/13/13 12:29 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
smstone22
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The issue I would have with buying ladino is that your paying a perennial clover price then just killing it next Fall. That works but I hate to buy a more expensive perennial clover then just kill it. Another consideration... turnips, what kind? Reason I ask is this... if I were to plant purple top turnips this late, I wouldnt get optimal green size or optimal bulb size, so I wouldnt fool with it. I like 60 days prior to average first frost for purple tops, so sometime around August 15th for me. Seven top would be a little different story, they are a greens producer, while they wouldnt produce huge leaves this late, they would be decent so I might could live that but I probably personally just wouldnt bother. I dont know your average first frost date though where you are planting. I would delete turnips and increase rape, but thats just me at 2000 ft elevation and average first frost of Oct 15th plus me liking to get large leaves and large bulbs if Im going to do it.
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#3358129 - 09/13/13 12:49 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: smstone22]
muddyboots
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Good point stone!
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#3358133 - 09/13/13 12:53 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: muddyboots]
infoman jr.
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We are considering establishing these as perennial clover plots next year and overseeding them in the spring. I'm not sure about the turnips. In everything I buy, I've always gone in as in informed consumer. We should've started our homework a little earlier.

Good points, though.
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#3358217 - 09/13/13 02:04 PM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: infoman jr.]
drrxnupe
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infoman... I highly recommend that you get this book:

http://www.qdma.com/shop/quality-food-plots-your-guide-to-better-deer-and-better-deer-hunting

I'm by no means an expert...but I betcha I have learned more in the last 3 months by reading this book than a lot of guys know in a lifetime without reading the book. I feel like it has saved me money from buying excess and unneeded stuff for plots.

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#3361006 - 09/16/13 08:17 AM Re: Need a second opinion [Re: drrxnupe]
infoman jr.
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Thanks for the tip, nupe. The guys got everything planted on Saturday. Everything went pretty well except the tractor with the small disc would hardly touch one of the overgrown plots, so they had to get the dozer out and pull the big disc and follow with the tractor. I couldn't make it as I was shooting a sporting clays tournament, but they said everything seemed to be in good shape. Hopefully I'll have some good update pics in a couple weeks.

The 5-acre bean plot is looking good!
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