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#3306363 - 07/30/13 10:51 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: BSK]
MattR
8 Point


Registered: 09/22/12
Posts: 1712
Loc: Nashville

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Diehard Hunter
It takes a lot of knowledge and skill, but first and foremost, it takes TIME in the field. The kind of time very few people have.


I tend to disagree with this. Yes, some of the best big buck killers I know hunt a lot, but they do so because hunting is their passion. However, in my opinion, the absolute worst advice I see given about being a successful older buck hunter is HUNT HARD. That advice suggests that those who consistently kill older bucks do so simply because they spend more time in the woods. CONSISTENTLY killing older bucks is not about lucky encounters, with more time in the woods resulting in more lucky encounters with older bucks. Consistently killing older bucks is about knowing how to hunt them. Spending more time HUNTING THE WRONG WAY is not going to make you more successful.


I agree. I think this is opne thing I need to work on. I think I see some good sign and get excited about it but then I want to just hunt it and hunt it hard. I know if I would of waited for better conditions last year I would of killed a mature buck.

Sometimes it is hard to hunt under optimal conditions unless you have a lot of time off. You have to hunt what you can and not worry about the days you can't go. Some of the better hunters I know seem like they almost have a stand or spot for every condition. And their best spots, they don't even go in unless everything lines up. That gives them the best chance to kill the buck that is in that location. It seems every year a deer ages the less chances they are going to give you to kill them. So, I think it has more to do with TIMING than TIME, as someone mentioned before.

So, maybe Patience and self control I should add to my list lol. I'm not an expert, and don't have tons of experience but it makes sense.


Edited by MattR (07/30/13 11:16 AM)
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#3306379 - 07/30/13 11:03 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: MattR]
rukiddin?
8 Point


Registered: 02/04/09
Posts: 1543
Loc: E. Tenn

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Common ground with the guys I know that consistantly kill big deer?
1. They all have very flexible jobs or own their own business.
2. They have multiple properties they can hunt exclusively.
3. They don't tell anybody about a big'un until its in the back of their truck.
4. They don't take themselves to seriously, it does'nt consume them. Laid back, easy going. They have fun, first and foremost.
5. Lastly, it sounds dumb, but they hunt areas WITH big deer.
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#3306390 - 07/30/13 11:08 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: rukiddin?]
Football Hunter
Non-Typical


Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 25485
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co

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Not overhunting a property,BIG ONE!
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#3306393 - 07/30/13 11:10 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: MattR]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65411
Loc: Nashville, TN

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I case in point to my previous post: although I'm by no means a consistently successful mature buck hunter, for awhile, I did focus on killing mature bucks and I killed a number of them over an 8 year period. ALL OF THESE MATURE BUCKS WERE KILLED WITHIN THE FIRST WEEK OF TRYING TO KILL THEM. Now we've all seen on TV and read the articles about the guys who work all year to kill a specific buck and finally kill that buck on the last day of the season after months of working towards that goal, but this certainly hasn't been my experience.

But I was able to kill those mature bucks so quickly because I did a couple of things:

1) I waited to hunt them until the absolute best time to hunt mature bucks (just prior to peak breeding).

2) I had multiple stand set-ups so that when the best time came to hunt, I could hunt under any weather conditions or wind directions that might be occurring at that time.

3) I did not overhunt stands--once or twice was it for each stand location, and never on back-to-back hunts.

4) I played the highest odds travel patterns as close to sanctuary cover as possible (often hunting within shooting distance of the edge of the cover).
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3306439 - 07/30/13 11:46 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: MattR]
Diehard Hunter
CRAMP
12 Point


Registered: 08/01/08
Posts: 6817
Loc: East Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: MattR
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Diehard Hunter
It takes a lot of knowledge and skill, but first and foremost, it takes TIME in the field. The kind of time very few people have.


I tend to disagree with this. Yes, some of the best big buck killers I know hunt a lot, but they do so because hunting is their passion. However, in my opinion, the absolute worst advice I see given about being a successful older buck hunter is HUNT HARD. That advice suggests that those who consistently kill older bucks do so simply because they spend more time in the woods. CONSISTENTLY killing older bucks is not about lucky encounters, with more time in the woods resulting in more lucky encounters with older bucks. Consistently killing older bucks is about knowing how to hunt them. Spending more time HUNTING THE WRONG WAY is not going to make you more successful.


I agree. I think this is opne thing I need to work on. I think I see some good sign and get excited about it but then I want to just hunt it and hunt it hard. I know if I would of waited for better conditions last year I would of killed a mature buck.

Sometimes it is hard to hunt under optimal conditions unless you have a lot of time off. You have to hunt what you can and not worry about the days you can't go. Some of the better hunters I know seem like they almost have a stand or spot for every condition. And their best spots, they don't even go in unless everything lines up. That gives them the best chance to kill the buck that is in that location. It seems every year a deer ages the less chances they are going to give you to kill them. So, I think it has more to do with TIMING than TIME, as someone mentioned before.

So, maybe Patience and self control I should add to my list lol. I'm not an expert, and don't have tons of experience but it makes sense.


I think both of you took my post the wrong way. I am not suggesting that spending more time doing the wrong things will make you better. I am saying no matter how good you are, if you do not have the time to scout, if you do not have a flexible enough schedule to hunt the stands at the right time, and you do not have the time to spend on stand, you are not going to kill as many mature deer as someone that does have the time and flexibility.

People that kill these mature deer consistently, on their own, do not have the time constraints normal people have. Pure and simple. They have the extra time and flexibility to hunt when they need to hunt to kill that particular deer. I don't care how good your skill set is, if you do not have the time to scout that deer and hunt that deer when and where he is most vulnerable, you will not kill him except by pure luck.
_________________________
The recreational value of a game animal is inverse to the artificiality of its origin and the intensiveness of the management system that produced it. Aldo Leopold


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#3306450 - 07/30/13 11:50 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: Diehard Hunter]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65411
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
Diehard Hunter,

Sure, if you can't get out to hunt, you can't kill anything. But I know some sure 'nuff big buck killers who take a week off each year to big buck hunt. Is a week's vacation really that out of the question? I think too many hunters have the idea that the consistently successful are hunting every day of the year.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3306463 - 07/30/13 11:57 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: BSK]
Diehard Hunter
CRAMP
12 Point


Registered: 08/01/08
Posts: 6817
Loc: East Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: BSK
I case in point to my previous post: although I'm by no means a consistently successful mature buck hunter, for awhile, I did focus on killing mature bucks and I killed a number of them over an 8 year period. ALL OF THESE MATURE BUCKS WERE KILLED WITHIN THE FIRST WEEK OF TRYING TO KILL THEM. Now we've all seen on TV and read the articles about the guys who work all year to kill a specific buck and finally kill that buck on the last day of the season after months of working towards that goal, but this certainly hasn't been my experience.

But I was able to kill those mature bucks so quickly because I did a couple of things:

1) I waited to hunt them until the absolute best time to hunt mature bucks (just prior to peak breeding).

2) I had multiple stand set-ups so that when the best time came to hunt, I could hunt under any weather conditions or wind directions that might be occurring at that time.

3) I did not overhunt stands--once or twice was it for each stand location, and never on back-to-back hunts.

4) I played the highest odds travel patterns as close to sanctuary cover as possible (often hunting within shooting distance of the edge of the cover).


You,are the case I was suggesting.

1) you must have a very flexible work schedule.

2) you must have plenty of time before the season to scout those stand set ups and to learn the travel patterns of the deer.

3) Something I did not talk about......you have plenty of room to hunt without worrying about pressure from other hunters.

4) again, you have plenty of time to learn those travel patterns, and to learn where the sanctuary cover is. I bet you even had the time to create some of that cover.

Now I ask.....if I gave you a full time job, with no vacation time during the pre rut or rut, and you learned what days and hours you would be working one week in advance, how would you like your odds? Lets throw a couple of kids playing sports in there, and maybe you have a parent that needs you to help take care of them. You have the knowledge and ability, but now you don't have the time. What do you give up o kill that deer? Your parents? Your family? Your job?
_________________________
The recreational value of a game animal is inverse to the artificiality of its origin and the intensiveness of the management system that produced it. Aldo Leopold


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#3306465 - 07/30/13 11:58 AM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: BSK]
Diehard Hunter
CRAMP
12 Point


Registered: 08/01/08
Posts: 6817
Loc: East Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: BSK
Diehard Hunter,

Sure, if you can't get out to hunt, you can't kill anything. But I know some sure 'nuff big buck killers who take a week off each year to big buck hunt. Is a week's vacation really that out of the question? I think too many hunters have the idea that the consistently successful are hunting every day of the year.


A weeks vacation during prime time is totally out of the question for me....oh wait, vacation does not exist for me, because I get summers off. So yes. Same for every other teacher I know. Technically, I could take sick time, but if they found out, I would get fired.
_________________________
The recreational value of a game animal is inverse to the artificiality of its origin and the intensiveness of the management system that produced it. Aldo Leopold


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#3306485 - 07/30/13 12:18 PM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: Diehard Hunter]
Poser
Mud Dauber
16 Point


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 12881
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Diehard Hunter
 Originally Posted By: BSK
I case in point to my previous post: although I'm by no means a consistently successful mature buck hunter, for awhile, I did focus on killing mature bucks and I killed a number of them over an 8 year period. ALL OF THESE MATURE BUCKS WERE KILLED WITHIN THE FIRST WEEK OF TRYING TO KILL THEM. Now we've all seen on TV and read the articles about the guys who work all year to kill a specific buck and finally kill that buck on the last day of the season after months of working towards that goal, but this certainly hasn't been my experience.

But I was able to kill those mature bucks so quickly because I did a couple of things:

1) I waited to hunt them until the absolute best time to hunt mature bucks (just prior to peak breeding).

2) I had multiple stand set-ups so that when the best time came to hunt, I could hunt under any weather conditions or wind directions that might be occurring at that time.

3) I did not overhunt stands--once or twice was it for each stand location, and never on back-to-back hunts.

4) I played the highest odds travel patterns as close to sanctuary cover as possible (often hunting within shooting distance of the edge of the cover).


You,are the case I was suggesting.

1) you must have a very flexible work schedule.

2) you must have plenty of time before the season to scout those stand set ups and to learn the travel patterns of the deer.

3) Something I did not talk about......you have plenty of room to hunt without worrying about pressure from other hunters.

4) again, you have plenty of time to learn those travel patterns, and to learn where the sanctuary cover is. I bet you even had the time to create some of that cover.

Now I ask.....if I gave you a full time job, with no vacation time during the pre rut or rut, and you learned what days and hours you would be working one week in advance, how would you like your odds? Lets throw a couple of kids playing sports in there, and maybe you have a parent that needs you to help take care of them. You have the knowledge and ability, but now you don't have the time. What do you give up o kill that deer? Your parents? Your family? Your job?


I think that, if deer hunting is absolutely your number one priority, then you figure it out. Maybe you don't have kids. Maybe you take a job that you are less than qualified for so that you have a flexible schedule. You make sacrifices. -not saying that's the best way to live life or that any one person should be cut out for it, but that's the reality of it. Many people who follow their passions seriously, forego or delay getting married, having kids, having health insurance, owning a house etc.

Example: Hunters often complain about not having anytime to hunt because they have to work as much as possible in order make their $$ truck payment. They bought an expensive truck for "hunting purposes", but they have to work all the time in order to pay for a truck which reduces their hunting time. If hunting is their priority, they would have made a different decision, but that is clearly not the case.

Many people complain that certain hunters have more time to hunt and that is why they are successful. True, time is important, but most hunters, even though they will not admit it, have 2, 3, or 4 priorities in front of hunting and that is just the reality of it. If you accept that your family and job are more important than hunting, then you have no reason to complain about it. That's just life.

When I lived in Nashville, I'd see a endless supply of musicians coming to town wanting to "make it' playing music professionally. For the most part, the ones who were successful were the one who had committed their lives to that goal and everything else is secondary. Day jobs can and will be quit the moment they get in the way. Period. Rent? Get roommates, sleep on couches. Priorities, determination and perseverance almost always pay off, but at a high cost.

Personally, I don't have the desire to make those kinds of sacrifices just to kill "big" deer when I can hunt a good amount, have fun doing it, and kill as many deer as I need to, all the while, still encounter (maybe not kill) mature bucks every season. I'd be much more interested in being a well rounded hunter and being exposed to different styles of hunting rather than the singular dedication of consistently killing mature bucks.
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It doesn't have to be fun to be fun.

Wild & crazy, can't be stopped. Only the strong will survive.

Keep your knife sharp and your skillet greasy.

http://www.GoCarnivore.com

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#3306501 - 07/30/13 12:33 PM Re: Serial Mature Buck Killer !! Opinions? [Re: Diehard Hunter]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65411
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Diehard Hunter
 Originally Posted By: BSK
I case in point to my previous post: although I'm by no means a consistently successful mature buck hunter, for awhile, I did focus on killing mature bucks and I killed a number of them over an 8 year period. ALL OF THESE MATURE BUCKS WERE KILLED WITHIN THE FIRST WEEK OF TRYING TO KILL THEM. Now we've all seen on TV and read the articles about the guys who work all year to kill a specific buck and finally kill that buck on the last day of the season after months of working towards that goal, but this certainly hasn't been my experience.

But I was able to kill those mature bucks so quickly because I did a couple of things:

1) I waited to hunt them until the absolute best time to hunt mature bucks (just prior to peak breeding).

2) I had multiple stand set-ups so that when the best time came to hunt, I could hunt under any weather conditions or wind directions that might be occurring at that time.

3) I did not overhunt stands--once or twice was it for each stand location, and never on back-to-back hunts.

4) I played the highest odds travel patterns as close to sanctuary cover as possible (often hunting within shooting distance of the edge of the cover).


You,are the case I was suggesting.

1) you must have a very flexible work schedule.


Not at the time. I just took a week's vacation each year scheduled for the right calendar period of the rut.


 Quote:
2) you must have plenty of time before the season to scout those stand set ups and to learn the travel patterns of the deer.


A couple of weekends post-hunt in February, a couple of weekends in August or September. is that really a lot? And by the way, I'm NOT a "sign" hunter. I hunt "best odds" terrain and habitat situations, regardless of sign, and could determine those locations long before the season started.


 Quote:
3) Something I did not talk about......you have plenty of room to hunt without worrying about pressure from other hunters.


I have family members that fly in from all over the country to hunt that same period. We have FAR more pressure on our property at that time than any of our neighbors.


 Quote:
4) again, you have plenty of time to learn those travel patterns, and to learn where the sanctuary cover is. I bet you even had the time to create some of that cover.


Yes, I'm hunting property I own and manage, and know VERY well. But being limited to just one property makes successful mature buck hunting MUCH harder. Look at the most successful mature buck hunters and you will find they hunt multiple properties and are always looking for new property. They hunt where the most mature bucks are at the time. I hunt where I hunt regardless of buck populations or age.


 Quote:
Now I ask.....if I gave you a full time job, with no vacation time during the pre rut or rut, and you learned what days and hours you would be working one week in advance, how would you like your odds? Lets throw a couple of kids playing sports in there, and maybe you have a parent that needs you to help take care of them. You have the knowledge and ability, but now you don't have the time. What do you give up o kill that deer? Your parents? Your family? Your job?


I would not like them at all. If I were a "couple of weekends per year" deer hunter, I think my odds of consistently killing mature bucks would be close to nada.

But per the topic of this thread, what are traits of successful big buck killers? Another to add would be that pursuing these bucks is a passion to these people, and they make sacrifices in life to pursue their passion. However, that means SOME sacrifices. They do not have to be EXTRAORDINARY sacrifices. They don't have to have a job where they can leave on a whim every time the weather is right. But taking a week or two of vacation during the right time to hunt may be required. I don't consider this an extraordinary sacrifice. Many, many hunters do this every year.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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