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#3179327 - 02/28/13 02:05 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: scn]
Bayou Buck
10 Point


Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 2725
Loc: Spring Hill / Perry Co

Offline
 Originally Posted By: scn
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
 Originally Posted By: -DRM-
 Originally Posted By: Jcalder
Losing one out of ten deer is unacceptable in my book. Why not increase your odds with a gun that is better suited for deer.


Do you have any hard proof increasing caliber will remove all other variables and increase the shooter's odds? Seems like a mighty big assumption.
Or why not stop archery hunting? Your odds of looseing a deer is far greater with archery equipment than it is with a 223..That I guarentee.


The controlled studies that have been done found exactly the opposite. Gun hunters lost more deer than archery hunters.

As an officer in the field, that is what I found as well. Many gun hunters are so conditioned mentally to seeing an animal drop in their tracks that when one runs off they don't even check to see if they hit or missed the deer. And, with many being hundreds of yards away, it is much more difficult for the hunter to pinpoint where the deer was standing to look for sign of a hit.



I can believe this happens a lot! Especially with less experienced hunters.

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#3179422 - 02/28/13 03:43 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: Bayou Buck]
Hunter 257W
10 Point


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 3522
Loc: Franklin County

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 Originally Posted By: Bayou Buck
 Originally Posted By: scn
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
 Originally Posted By: -DRM-
 Originally Posted By: Jcalder
Losing one out of ten deer is unacceptable in my book. Why not increase your odds with a gun that is better suited for deer.


Do you have any hard proof increasing caliber will remove all other variables and increase the shooter's odds? Seems like a mighty big assumption.
Or why not stop archery hunting? Your odds of looseing a deer is far greater with archery equipment than it is with a 223..That I guarentee.


The controlled studies that have been done found exactly the opposite. Gun hunters lost more deer than archery hunters.

As an officer in the field, that is what I found as well. Many gun hunters are so conditioned mentally to seeing an animal drop in their tracks that when one runs off they don't even check to see if they hit or missed the deer. And, with many being hundreds of yards away, it is much more difficult for the hunter to pinpoint where the deer was standing to look for sign of a hit.



I can believe this happens a lot! Especially with less experienced hunters.


Yeah, I may have very well left deer in the woods when I 1st started deer hunting now that I can look back with more experienced eyes on my early escapades. I had no adult to learn from and I just assumed that a centerfire rifle with all that noise and energy would drop a deer in it's tracks if you hit it. When I shot and they didn't fall, I assumed that I had missed. (Probably did most of the time because I had a lot of trouble with buck fever as a kid.)

But when looking at lost deer, rather than lumping them all together, I think you have to break them down into two basic categories. The 1st would be deer that killed quickly but simply not found. The hunter shoots, the deer runs a couple hundred yard into a gosh-awful briar thicket - dies within a minute and is never found. Nobody likes losing one like that but at least the animal didn't suffer a lingering death. The 2nd group would be a deer that is hit but the wound is not severe enough to cause quick death which allows it to run far enough that it's never found. This animal may die hours or days later or may even recover.

I bet there are more bow shot deer in that last category.

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#3179525 - 02/28/13 05:29 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: -DRM-]
mathews338
12 Point


Registered: 11/05/09
Posts: 5409
Loc: jackson co.

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 Originally Posted By: -DRM-
 Originally Posted By: Jcalder
Losing one out of ten deer is unacceptable in my book. Why not increase your odds with a gun that is better suited for deer.


Do you have any hard proof increasing caliber will remove all other variables and increase the shooter's odds? Seems like a mighty big assumption.
we all know that things don't always go as planned and with that in mind i killed a 4.5 year old 8pt 2 years ago.
i had just climbed down out of the tree and was gathering my things when i heard something coming. i turned around and he had just topped the hill. he was looking right at me standing broadside but there was a cedar bush between me and him. i needed to shoot 1" to the right of the bush in order to still hit vitals.
it was only about 40 yards but i was off handed. i shot through the bush which was 3" in diameter and killed that deer stone dead, complete pass through btw.
that is the only proof i need and like i said before, i hunt hard all year for only a few encounters each year so i want every advantage i can get because i know i'm not perfect and i will make mistakes from time to time.
i believe my .338 or other large calibers do increase a shooters odds. they won't fix everything but they do help. do not limit yourself unless you have to is my way of looking at it.

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#3179718 - 02/28/13 08:29 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: scn]
MRUTVOL
6 Point


Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 904
Loc: Goodlettsville,Tennessee,USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: scn
[quote=cecil30-30][quote=-DRM-][quote=Jcalder]Losing

The controlled studies that have been done found exactly the opposite. Gun hunters lost more deer than archery hunters.

As an officer in the field, that is what I found as well. Many gun hunters are so conditioned mentally to seeing an animal drop in their tracks that when one runs off they don't even check to see if they hit or missed the deer. And, with many being hundreds of yards away, it is much more difficult for the hunter to pinpoint where the deer was standing to look for sign of a hit.



I can believe that since there are more gun hunters than bow hunters so they should have a larger number of lost deer. BUT I would say the percentage of lost deer to the number of hunters for each group ,Gun or Bow, would be higher for Bow Hunters. In my circles anyway I hear more bow hunters who remark of hitting a deer but not finding it which in a lot of cases means a bad hit and probably not a dead deer but a crippled deer. I have heard several hunters speak of multiple loss deer during bow season. One guy I suggested he quit bow hunting because he lost 4 deer in one week of hunting. Just my opinion no studies to back it up.

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#3181678 - 03/02/13 09:13 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: Hunter 257W]
hunter0925
8 Point


Registered: 01/21/13
Posts: 1092
Loc: TN, Rhea,

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 Originally Posted By: Hunter 257W
Regarding head shots with any cartridge, I used to agree that they would either be a kill or clean miss but I disagree now. It would be very easy to hit a jaw or nose and leave a deer with a horrible wound to slowly die. I just don't think head shots are a good idea unless the deer is really close and you KNOw you can make it and how do you ever know 100%. A behind the shoulder has a lot more margin for error if you wobble or the deer moves just as you pull the trigger.


My uncle lives and hunts in TX and solely uses a 223 with head shots. He has told me of shooting a 10pt and watching it run off with its' jaw hanging off never to be seen again. I agree with you one hundred persent in this aspect.
_________________________
We the unwanted, do the unthinkable, for the ungrateful.
In Each Other We Trust.

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#3212494 - 04/03/13 02:46 PM Re: Anyone using .223 / 5.56 cal for deer hunting? [Re: scn]
Winchester
Non-Typical


Registered: 12/05/03
Posts: 27878
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: scn
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
 Originally Posted By: -DRM-
 Originally Posted By: Jcalder
Losing one out of ten deer is unacceptable in my book. Why not increase your odds with a gun that is better suited for deer.


Do you have any hard proof increasing caliber will remove all other variables and increase the shooter's odds? Seems like a mighty big assumption.
Or why not stop archery hunting? Your odds of looseing a deer is far greater with archery equipment than it is with a 223..That I guarentee.


The controlled studies that have been done found exactly the opposite. Gun hunters lost more deer than archery hunters.

As an officer in the field, that is what I found as well. Many gun hunters are so conditioned mentally to seeing an animal drop in their tracks that when one runs off they don't even check to see if they hit or missed the deer. And, with many being hundreds of yards away, it is much more difficult for the hunter to pinpoint where the deer was standing to look for sign of a hit.


Im not surprised at all, I have saw similar situations in the past myself!

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