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#3186208 - 03/07/13 09:21 AM Pre-Nazi Germany
Still-n-Quiet
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Registered: 07/18/06
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Guys, seriously, please help me see how we are different than pre-Nazi Germany! I'm looking at all these events and I would really like to see something different. Are we on the tipping point of a terrible dictatorship?

A Government to be Feared (American Thinker)
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#3186228 - 03/07/13 09:47 AM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: Still-n-Quiet]
Rebel
TnDeer Old Timer
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Registered: 03/16/99
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Good post and good article S-N-Q.
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#3186247 - 03/07/13 10:04 AM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: Rebel]
Crappie Luck Moderator
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Hitler and the Nazi party rose to power amid elections between Marxists, Socialists and Union factions. There were no GOOD guys on the menu.

If we as conservatives (GOP specifically) fall for these "demographic reforms", embrace gay marriage, amnesty and social engineering, we'll effectively set up the same scenario- an election where there are no "good guys".

Conservative principles and the preservation of our Constitution are our only frame of reference. They are our Founding principles. Without a candidate that believes in them (Romney, McCain, Graham etc) we will lose the republic.

However, until we lose the last of our principled candidates, there is hope. All we need for liberty to return is a good salesman of states rights and founding principles. We haven't seen that is quite a while because we've continually ran candidates that don't believe in them. How can they sell something they don't believe in?

Run a TRUE conservative with a voice and build a "community organizing" mechanism around THAT.
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#3186259 - 03/07/13 10:11 AM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: Crappie Luck]
AndyW
10 Point


Registered: 10/21/10
Posts: 4351
Loc: Allardt, TN

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The parallels are deeply troubling to me.
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#3186276 - 03/07/13 10:20 AM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: Crappie Luck]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
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 Originally Posted By: AndyW
The parallels are deeply troubling to me.

x 2

The worst of history tends to repeat every few generations, and yes, the conditions in American now are eerily similar in many ways to 1930's Germany. This is especially true with politicians trying to divide us, which empowers those politicians, but greatly harms our society. Hitler singled out the Jews as the evil; Obama singles out everyone who is not a democrat in lock-step with his agenda, which is about half the country. Real leaders unite people rather than turn them against each other.

Let us not forget that in the 20's & 30's, Germany was a more advanced society/civilization than the United States. They were a country of great arts and intellectuals. Adolf Hitler was in fact an artist with a gifted mind and tremendous charisma ---- about half the German people loved and worshiped him.

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#3186451 - 03/07/13 01:26 PM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: Wes Parrish]
nodog
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Registered: 08/12/12
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good question and some good responses. Time builds upon time and one thing about WWII is that it built upon WWI.

"Let's not forget..." "Advanced" "20's" The greatest recorded inflation ever, happened in the early 20's Germany. Inflation went to almost 4,000,000 percent.

Are we like then? Were they like a time before them? Sure. Our own past has been a building block for today and the future. From what I see, we aren't any different from anybody who came before us. Only by force will we act appropriately. If you don't like today, learn from the past that gave us today, don't blame today, it's just the fruit of yesterday.
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#3187496 - 03/08/13 01:41 PM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: nodog]
BSK
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I do agree that the current Adminstration is attempting to create a Totalitarian system, but I don't think Hitler's rise to power and Nazism are the right analogies. Hitler's popularity and the system he championed (Nazism) were primarily a result of the way Germany lost WW I. Germany had not yet been militarily defeated when the Armistice was sprung somewhat unexpectedly on the German nation and especially the common soldiers (and the reason why the Germans called for an Armistice is a part of history few people today understand). But the way it ended for Germany allowed a popular belief to arise that a few Jews in the government stabbed the nation in the back, fueling already existing anti-semitism.

Yet Hitler did not rise to power on his message of anti-semitism. He was supported by the average person on the street (and the military) because of his message of finally winning what had been stolen from them by treachery in WW I--the greatness that was their destiny of ruling all of Europe. This played extremely well to the social conciousness of the German people at the time. It was part of their collective societal belief system that they were destined to be the rulers of continental Europe. In essence, Hitler's message was one of aggression and expansion. This is definitely not the message of the current Adminstration.

Nor can the current Adminstration be compared to the Bolshevik Revolution of Russia. That was an uprising by the urban poor against the monarchical ruling class as well as against the land-owning farming and urban merchant and business-owning middle class (although this uprising has some similarities in "message" with the current Adminstration's tactics).

What the current Administration's push towards totalitarianism is closest to is a Latin American Banana Republic, especially that of Hugo Chavez' rise to power and totalitarian dictatorship of Venezuala. In these Banana Republic systems, a charismatic demagogue creates a cult of personality and rises to initial freely elected power on a message of being a champion of the poor; i.e. campaigns on a platform of class warfare, portraying the wealthy as evil supressors of the poor, and stirring up suspicions that the wealthy are secretly controling the government for their own benefit and profit. And of course, as soon as this demagogue is elected, he/she immediately attempts to consolidate all power in his/her own hands to enact exactly that--a ruling class (led by his/herself) that uses their power to ensure their lifelong hold on power for their own benefit. They rapidly take control of the media so they can control what the populace hears, they nationalize the most profitable private industries to appropriate their funds, and heavily tax the wealthy and middle-class to increase their ability to buy the votes of the poor through handouts and entitlements. And all the while live lavish lifestyles of wealth and priviledge off the public's dime.
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#3187549 - 03/08/13 02:41 PM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: BSK]
Wes Parrish
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Registered: 06/12/02
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GREAT, HISTORICAL, INSIGHTFUL POST, BSK!

 Originally Posted By: BSK
Yet Hitler did not rise to power on his message of anti-semitism. He was supported by the average person on the street (and the military) because of his message of finally winning what had been stolen from them . . .

Your are correct here.
However, I'd point out that each new day, each new year is unprecedented in history, and we can repeat fewer of history's tragedies in finding some parallels which are not so obvious.

Obama's message is not so much to Americans as it is to the rest of the world and a minority of Americans. Obama's message is he will now "give" them what was stolen from them by America. If you're an illegal alien from Mexico, come on over, and vote to keep me in power. If you're a member of a minority, vote for me and I'll get you what you're "entitled", free healthcare, free cell phones, and you'll never have to work a day in your life. All the while being able to con enough of the majority to stay in office.

And you've hit the nails on their heads with everything below, just saying there ARE many parallels to what happened in 1930's Germany and what is happening today in America. There are also parallels to what's happening today to what happened in the 1770's and the 1860's.

 Originally Posted By: BSK
What the current Administration's push towards totalitarianism is closest to is a Latin American Banana Republic, especially that of Hugo Chavez' . . . . . a charismatic demagogue creates a cult of personality and rises to initial freely elected power on a message of being a champion of the poor; i.e. campaigns on a platform of class warfare, portraying the wealthy (the Republicans) as evil suppressors of the poor, and stirring up suspicions that the wealthy (the Republicans) are secretly controlling the government . . . . .

Sounds "spot on" regarding the Obama administration?

 Originally Posted By: BSK
They rapidly take control of the media so they can control what the populace hears, they nationalize the most profitable private industries to appropriate their funds, and heavily tax the wealthy and middle-class to increase their ability to buy the votes of the poor through handouts and entitlements.

You left out "fear mongering".
Many people don't realize that Obama has come close to already nationalizing many industries via government agency regulations which are using fines to siphon their profits and/or to bankrupt them if they don't agree in lock-step with the administration. Oil, banking, automotive, healthcare, etc., and demonizing any opposing voice such as Fox News.

 Originally Posted By: BSK
And all the while live lavish lifestyles of wealth and privilege off the public's dime.

That certainly fits the Obamas.

And note after Obama's day-after-day rantings and fear-mongerings about the sequester (which he blamed on republicans), not only has it now become obvious that this was little more than childish fear-mongering deception, but the Obama's have made no cuts in THEIR lavish taxpayer-funded lifestyles.

Worse, after all this fear-mongering of how this sequester was going to hurt America, and we couldn't afford teachers and air traffic controllers, much less house federal prisoners, Brother Barack even found an extra $250,000,000 to send to the Muslin Brotherhood AFTER the sequester (which he said would cause a lay-off of Whitehouse janitors). I bet that $250 million dollars would pay all the Whitehouse janitors for several decades?

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#3187623 - 03/08/13 04:15 PM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: BSK]
Bambi Buster
14 Point


Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 8515
Loc: Middle Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
I do agree that the current Adminstration is attempting to create a Totalitarian system, but I don't think Hitler's rise to power and Nazism are the right analogies...... heavily tax the wealthy and middle-class to increase their ability to buy the votes of the poor through handouts and entitlements. And all the while live lavish lifestyles of wealth and priviledge off the public's dime.


Wow! No black helicopters, no baseless rumors from wingnut websites about Russian-speaking DHS agents invading from Kentucky, but instead, original, well-reasoned intelligent thought. What a welcome breath of fresh air here. I fear it will be short-lived, though.
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#3187885 - 03/08/13 10:46 PM Re: Pre-Nazi Germany [Re: AndyW]
DSL_Connector
Spike


Registered: 03/02/13
Posts: 53
Loc: Knoxville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: AndyW
The parallels are deeply troubling to me.


There are significant parallels.

The Weimar Republic dem(mob)ocracy where communists/gun grabbers were trying to take over. There were serious racial issues. I suspect the Russian communists were behind much of the turmoil.

8:47 minute video.
YouTube "The Art Of Subversion"
Big Brother government, financial crashes, a police state run by dictators. Who would've believed it possible in 1984 that the USA would be a socialist state by the year 2001? Soviet defector Yuri Bezmenov explains the method behind the madness and warns of the consequences if the "communist conspiracy" is not stopped.

There are other videos with Beszemenos. He says that 80% of the KGB's budget went to subversive activities.

(Yuri Beszemenos is supposed to have been a former KGB agent. For reasons I don't understand the Russians sent him here. If they didn't he would have been dead. Murdered.)

This time the US, not Germany, are going to be the bad guys.

Russia's going to wait until the American people destroy themselves then they are going to invade. I feel certain of it.

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