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#3153689 - 02/06/13 10:28 AM Drone strikes on US Citizens
Poser
Mud Dauber
16 Point


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 13154
Loc: Tennessee

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Justice Department memo reveals legal case for drone strikes on Americans

http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/201...-americans?lite

Article 3, Section 3, US Constitution. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.

The Constitution defines only one crime, that of treason, and tells us that it requires (1) the Congress to be involved and (2) the Courts (article 3 is the Judiciary) to be involved and gain a "conviction" based on witnesses or confession in OPEN court before (3) the Executive takes action. Maybe the Founders felt it was important to clearly define that particular crime for some reason because it is the only one that got specifically mentioned in the Constitution itself.

http://armaborealis.blogspot.com/2013/02/drone-strikes-targeting-americans.html
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#3153713 - 02/06/13 10:52 AM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Poser]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 45514
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

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Sounds similar to the British ROE during our fight for independence, minus the drones of course.
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MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

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#3153719 - 02/06/13 10:56 AM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Poser]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 16411
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Poser
Justice Department memo reveals legal case for drone strikes on Americans

http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/201...-americans?lite

Article 3, Section 3, US Constitution. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.

The Constitution defines only one crime, that of treason, and tells us that it requires (1) the Congress to be involved and (2) the Courts (article 3 is the Judiciary) to be involved and gain a "conviction" based on witnesses or confession in OPEN court before (3) the Executive takes action. Maybe the Founders felt it was important to clearly define that particular crime for some reason because it is the only one that got specifically mentioned in the Constitution itself.

http://armaborealis.blogspot.com/2013/02/drone-strikes-targeting-americans.html


Not to hijack your thread, but how is sending the Muslim Brotherhood 20 F-16's and 200 Tanks not treason?

This is a touchy subject for me. I want to think we all deserve due process, but if you leave this country and declare war on us, I think you should be stripped of your citizenship immediately. If you happen to get smoked by a Hellfire missile in Yemen, OH WELL.

But, if you are in the USA and do the same thing, it is your right to have Due Process. You have the right to face your accusers, and you are innocent until proven guilty.

I have not read the NDAA if that is what you are referring to...
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#3153732 - 02/06/13 11:15 AM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
Hangnail
12 Point


Registered: 11/30/00
Posts: 7390
Loc: Murfreesboro, TN

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I'm with FLTENNHUNTER1 on this. Outside the U.S., ya better duck if you're against us. The first drone strike in the U.S. against a citizen could be the last straw with some folks. Hope we never have to find that out.
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#3153748 - 02/06/13 11:26 AM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Hangnail]
Poser
Mud Dauber
16 Point


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 13154
Loc: Tennessee

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Yes, but there is nothing mentioned in the Constitution about foreign soil. Its a very specifically worded statement and no other administration has been willing to take that step.
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It doesn't have to be fun to be fun.

Wild & crazy, can't be stopped. Only the strong will survive.

Keep your knife sharp and your skillet greasy.

http://www.GoCarnivore.com

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#3153787 - 02/06/13 11:59 AM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Poser]
waynesworld
8 Point


Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Mboro, Tennessee

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Poser as you say that there is no mention about foreign soil the fact is that our Constitution is the law of our land not some other land. Due process is only protected in the us if you are in a foreign country you have to go by there law in most cases. In the case of being at a constant state of war agenst terriost when a us citizen joins the other side it is no longer a crime but just part of the war. That is why we would not have to try people before we kill them. I do think we should have a wanted deed or alive site on our federal web sit and if you are on it and think it is in error you can surrender to the authorities to clear up any mistakes. And the if you look on the site and notice the guy you play poker with every week is on there you may not want to be around him much \:\)
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#3153827 - 02/06/13 12:48 PM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: waynesworld]
Poser
Mud Dauber
16 Point


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 13154
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: waynesworld
Poser as you say that there is no mention about foreign soil the fact is that our Constitution is the law of our land not some other land. Due process is only protected in the us if you are in a foreign country you have to go by there law in most cases. In the case of being at a constant state of war agenst terriost when a us citizen joins the other side it is no longer a crime but just part of the war. That is why we would not have to try people before we kill them. I do think we should have a wanted deed or alive site on our federal web sit and if you are on it and think it is in error you can surrender to the authorities to clear up any mistakes. And the if you look on the site and notice the guy you play poker with every week is on there you may not want to be around him much \:\)


But the argument here is who gets to decide? As it stands, the Obama administration appears to be ready to serve as the judge, jury and executioner. If a US Citizen takes up arms against the US, and this is openly determined in congress, as described in the constitution, then so be it. But, you're only one step away from allowing the administration to make drone strikes and assassinations on US citizens on domestic soil. How far are you willing to go and, are you willing to put these decisions in the hands of the president with no scrutiny, debate or accountability?
_________________________
It doesn't have to be fun to be fun.

Wild & crazy, can't be stopped. Only the strong will survive.

Keep your knife sharp and your skillet greasy.

http://www.GoCarnivore.com

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#3153845 - 02/06/13 01:00 PM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Poser]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 45514
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Poser
 Originally Posted By: waynesworld
Poser as you say that there is no mention about foreign soil the fact is that our Constitution is the law of our land not some other land. Due process is only protected in the us if you are in a foreign country you have to go by there law in most cases. In the case of being at a constant state of war agenst terriost when a us citizen joins the other side it is no longer a crime but just part of the war. That is why we would not have to try people before we kill them. I do think we should have a wanted deed or alive site on our federal web sit and if you are on it and think it is in error you can surrender to the authorities to clear up any mistakes. And the if you look on the site and notice the guy you play poker with every week is on there you may not want to be around him much \:\)


But the argument here is who gets to decide? As it stands, the Obama administration appears to be ready to serve as the judge, jury and executioner. If a US Citizen takes up arms against the US, and this is openly determined in congress, as described in the constitution, then so be it. But, you're only one step away from allowing the administration to make drone strikes and assassinations on US citizens on domestic soil. How far are you willing to go and, are you willing to put these decisions in the hands of the president with no scrutiny, debate or accountability?


Not the admin as a whole, but Obama himself will have the authority I believe.
_________________________
MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3153868 - 02/06/13 01:22 PM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: MUP]
Hangnail
12 Point


Registered: 11/30/00
Posts: 7390
Loc: Murfreesboro, TN

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With the way this particular administration spins and contorts the constitution, if a known enemy of the state is a citizen and is brave enough to give us the finger while out of the country, all's fair in love and drones. If they target citizens in the U.S., that's another story. If I were Ted Nugent, Rush or Mark Levine, I'd give my passport to someone I won't see again for at least another four years. That's how much I wouldn't trust the government.
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#3153935 - 02/06/13 02:18 PM Re: Drone strikes on US Citizens [Re: Hangnail]
TNDeerGuy
12 Point


Registered: 11/28/06
Posts: 6139
Loc: Old Hickory/Mt.Juliet, TN

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We all know that waterboarding terrorists for information that saves American lives is soooo much worse than the illegal murder of American citizens! Obama should be tried murder and held to the same set of laws that the rest of us adhere to everyday—but of course, we all know that will never happen to the annointed one!
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